ASA PBS Goes LIVE!

[centralpilot]

So i guess ASA is going to wait till tomorrow at 5pm to publish the lines even tho the IAD guys and gals didn't get to rebid. They should have gotten ours done first and let us see what crap they came up with.

What does rebidding or not have to do with it? Per the LOA, the final schedules aren't required to be posted any sooner than 1700 on the 20th. I wouldn't expect them to be beating the deadline by much on the first live month.

 

[SiuDude]

Per the LOA, the final schedules aren't required to be posted any sooner than 1700 on the 20th.

I believe it says "no later than...".

 

[777forever]

Yep-

And Delta didn't give us the flying which resulted in sweet high-block three days on the Brasilia or the ATR, did they?

-People are so eager to believe that our own union didn't f- all of us on this one. It is always someone else's fault.

(BTW-I sincerely hope you MFs are enjoying the 6hrs PER DAY credit we voted for you by passing PBS! I hope the free lunches are delicious as well. These days are numbered.)

Sweet high block 3 days on the brasilia and ATR equal crap low block 3 days on the jet. The 50 doesn't do high block legs like HPN or YYZ anymore. It's sad that MDT or CHO are now 'long' legs. Looks like if a 200 pilot wants to fly a high block/credit schedule, that pilot needs to bid the 700/900 or IAD

 

[Speedtape]

What does rebidding or not have to do with it? Per the LOA, the final schedules aren't required to be posted any sooner than 1700 on the 20th. I wouldn't expect them to be beating the deadline by much on the first live month.

Apparently, you didn't read the whole LOA or the Updates. It appears, the first 3 months, they have the option to extend it a day so all you morons have more time to bid.

 

[Speedtape]

Yep-

And Delta didn't give us the flying which resulted in sweet high-block three days on the Brasilia or the ATR, did they?

-People are so eager to believe that our own union didn't f- all of us on this one. It is always someone else's fault.

(BTW-I sincerely hope you MFs are enjoying the 6hrs PER DAY credit we voted for you by passing PBS! I hope the free lunches are delicious as well. These days are numbered.)

Do you live in a cave? Delta is shortening the average stage length to put the squeeze on 50 seat operaters. Less miles mean less revenue for a plane that becomes more unprofitable. Then, a 2 for 1 trade to get rid of the 50's becomes more lucrative. ALPA does not determine what the stage length will be. Who does?

 

[Speedtape]

Yep-

"Leave the arm chair quarterbacking for the loosers."

How appropriate, CRJ567!

 

[goahead]

Well regardless we all missed the part in the PBS LOA that gave ALPA five days to run our schedule and they gave themselves 6 hrs of pay to do it. Seriously why does it take more than an hour, total BS. Hope you all question the crap out of them at our dues paid for lunch, email DN, or amyone on the PWG or tell everyone who vol for them how crappy this is!

 

[goahead]

Do you live in a cave? Delta is shortening the average stage length to put the squeeze on 50 seat operaters. Less miles mean less revenue for a plane that becomes more unprofitable. Then, a 2 for 1 trade to get rid of the 50's becomes more lucrative. ALPA does not determine what the stage length will be. Who does?

Yea b/c the 120 and ATR had horrible sch with short legs, so instead of trying to help out the guys that pay their salary they just foward some bs about it's out of their hands. Either be a union for the pilots or let me keep my $2,000 a year and know that I'm rep by the company. Very weak of our union, very weak.

 

[LazyLightnin']

How's Dulles, speedtape? Ive always liked your glasses. So refined.

 

[the palm]

Yea b/c the 120 and ATR had horrible sch with short legs, so instead of trying to help out the guys that pay their salary they just foward some bs about it's out of their hands. Either be a union for the pilots or let me keep my $2,000 a year and know that I'm rep by the company. Very weak of our union, very weak.

RJ's are flying those turbo-prop legs now. And they fly faster hence the shorter leg times. It's pretty simple math actually. The average leg on the CR2 is now 1.2 hrs. For ASA to get their productivity out of you we need to fly 62 legs per month or 16 legs per trip. That makes for a pretty crappy 3 or 4 day trip no matter how you slice it. Want better trips? Go to the CR7/9 or a different airline.

p.s. It's only gonna get worse on the 200 as major airline partners put the squeeze on that airplane. Abandon ship!

 

[johnpeace]

Want better trips? Go to the CR7/9 or a different airline.

So, as a junior FO on the CR7...I can only expect to see vacancies filled by pilots senior to me with a net loss of seniority in my seat with each new vacanacy.

Yay.

Perma-reserve.

 

[ace6453]

So, as a junior FO on the CR7...I can only expect to see vacancies filled by pilots senior to me with a net loss of seniority in my seat with each new vacanacy.

Yay.

Perma-reserve.

That is pretty much what happens. You were free to bid the 200 and elected to stay on the 700.

 

[bacardi]

What does rebidding or not have to do with it? Per the LOA, the final schedules aren't required to be posted any sooner than 1700 on the 20th. I wouldn't expect them to be beating the deadline by much on the first live month.

I know the LOA, I just thought if they knew the results they would let us know our working schedule for next month. I just figured they would do that in good faith. To be honest the more they piss us off about this the more I'm going to tell every express jet pilot that they shouldn't sign this into their contract.

 

[cybourg10]

I know the LOA, I just thought if they knew the results they would let us know our working schedule for next month. I just figured they would do that in good faith. To be honest the more they piss us off about this the more I'm going to tell every express jet pilot that they shouldn't sign this into their contract.

Don't worry, we won't be voting for it.

www.nopbs.com

 

[sweptback]

Don't worry, we won't be voting for it.

www.nopbs.com

You guys should really get some better talking points. Maybe even talk to somebody who knows something about PR. Your bullet points are pretty flimsy.

Is the risk worth losing:

• Our vacation system?

Seems like the results of folks with vacation during the practice bids did pretty well. Either 20-25 days off with guarantee, or 15-17 days off with 100+ hours credit. Pilot's choice.

• Ability to pick-up open time?

Now that's a stretch. I don't know of an airline out there that doesn't allow you to pick up open time.

• Freely trip-trading with a generous amount of open time?

There's only a generous amount of open time if you're understaffed, or your company is horribly inefficient. At ASA (pre-PBS), seems like the only variety of open time we have is on the weekends, with a few trips here and there over the week. If you work during the week, enjoy what you've got because you probably can't get out of it.

Yes, with PBS there will be less open time to trade. But if you are able to get awarded originally for something you would eventually have to trade for, why does it matter?

• No training on days off? (A battle won in arbitration)

ASA has never had to train on days off. I don't know why this would be a concern to anybody. Just because CAL's PBS is one way doesn't mean that everybody's PBS is that way.

 

[cybourg10]

I don't trust the system to award me what I want the first time. The most important language in our contract is the line bidding and trade window language. I am not here to convince you to like or dislike PBS. I have done my research on many PBS systems including Delta, CAL, United, ASA, and TWA (which had the best language). I don't like it more than our current line bidding. Just my opinion. Southwest does not have PBS and they are more efficient than any other Major out there, PBS is not needed to be competitive for future RFPs. XJT won the Delta LAX flying in 2007 and the competitive United RFP in 2009 without the pilots having a PBS system. Growth can be accomplished without it and ASA can find synergies and cost savings in hundreds of other areas. If you have been convinced that the pilots need PBS or else suffer Comair's fate then I believe you have been fooled. I appreciate a grown up discussion over it however and I am willing to listen to the other side. I do agree that much of the rhetoric on the nopbs website is inaccurate.

 

[ASABound]

Cybourg, do you guys have integration over there buddy ? Where they can don what they want to you during the first 3 days of the month? We had it here. I will publicly say that I voted for PBS just to get rid of integration. there is no doubt about it that the current book language in your contract for line bidding and trading is way better than anything we have ever had here. As much as I want this transition to go off as easy and fast as possible I want the best of your contract and ours. if that means getting rid of PBS and shutting this place down then that is what we shall do. 4000 pilots strong, there is no excuse for not having some excellent bidding and QOL language. I really could care less about hourly pay....not that important. We need to have our duty rig (scheduled or actual, whichever is greater), trip rig, and a min day of at least 4 hours. Not to mention the b fund you guys have. In addition to the QOL language. I personally support whole heartedly in fighting this weak MEC and negotiating Committee at ASA, and keeping what you guys have already payed the price for.......with or without PBS. Look forward to working with you ..

 

[bacardi]

its 1710 on the 20th. Our schedules aren't out!!!! Pay attention express jet.
vote no pbs!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[CaribPilot]

The results for the Cr7 at least are gonna be out on the 21st this first round...check the cover sheet in Flica. The 200 might be the same.

It normally will be the 20th.

 

[TOOL CRIB]

its 1710 on the 20th. Our schedules aren't out!!!! Pay attention express jet.
vote no pbs!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Out on the 21st for the first three months.

Know facts before you spew!