Looks like CAL/UAL MECs want the RJs

[Yuppyguppy]

Scope is number 1....get it NUMBER F'ing ONE!!! WE WILL GET BACK OUR FLYING. PERIOD. The days of the 50 are over. The days of farming out flying are over! About damn time.

 

[glasspilot]

That's a nice thought yuppuguppy. Are you willing to fly it for the rates? Back in the day when the 50 seat RJs were just a dream for the regionals the majors turned their nose up at them due to two things;

1: they put the word "regional" right there in the name. It was easy for management to say, "you don't want to fly those...they're Regional Jets!!!"

2: the contracts at the majors at the time said point blank that no FO could ever make more than the most junior Captain. Well that was a deal breaker right there as an RJ doesn't support left seat pay above 747 senior Fo. Sooo, ya gonna let Captains make less than FOs?

I'm currious, really.

 

[General Lee]

That's a nice thought yuppuguppy. Are you willing to fly it for the rates? Back in the day when the 50 seat RJs were just a dream for the regionals the majors turned their nose up at them due to two things;

1: they put the word "regional" right there in the name. It was easy for management to say, "you don't want to fly those...they're Regional Jets!!!"

2: the contracts at the majors at the time said point blank that no FO could ever make more than the most junior Captain. Well that was a deal breaker right there as an RJ doesn't support left seat pay above 747 senior Fo. Sooo, ya gonna let Captains make less than FOs?

I'm currious, really.

Since there is currently stagnation at the regionals thanks to lack of hiring at the Legacies and some LCCs, all you have to do is see what the CURRENT average rate is among senior Regional pilots flying these planes. It's not $40 an hour for Captains these days, probably closer to $60 or $70 an hour for 50 seaters (longevity at regionals has increased), and maybe $85-90 an hour for E175s and CR9s. I think most Major Airline pilots would take those CURRENT rates as a base for a new contract. Also, many airlines allow their furloughed pilots to come back at the accrued year of longevity for the entire furlough---for example if a UAL guy went out at year two---and came back 4 years later, he would be at year 6 for pay. I know UAL doesn't do that right now, but DL does, and CAL/UAL will demand it no doubt. So again, the pay rates wouldn't be that low. And with retirements scheduled at hundreds per year at UAL and CAL coming up (remember, both of those airlines have had very little retirements so far, and have tons of old guys), people will move up the ladder quickly regardless.

So, glasspilot, I think they might have a plan, and it includes retirments of RJs, retirements of RJ contracts with UAL/CAL, and retirements of old pilots. I also think I know what yuppy's answer would be....(same as mine)



Bye Bye---General Lee

 

[glasspilot]

So you're saying the whole plan behind relaxing the scope to allow the regionals jets was to move the average pay from $50 to $80?

And now that it's there, coupled with massive retirements, it's time to shut the regionals down and take back that flying?

 

[atlcrashpad]

Regionals aint gwoin' no-wheres.... Mainline Managemints don't want mo mainline pylits... they need Regionals jus in case they need to loadshed some expense....

 

[contrail67]

In the end, 50 seaters will not even be here...70's will be the smallest RJ anyway.

Basically, when you are hired..you start on the 70 seater and move your way up.

 

[Oakum_Boy]

Cute plan. If a staple is involved, then great, but I don't think you'll see any of these airplanes goin over to mainline soon. If anything it'll be some new C series or something on the order of 100+ seats. Anything less than that will remain at the regionals unless you're planning on a seniority list staple.

 

[WayBack]

They're about 18yrs too late.
But let them have them, you think management is going to let those mainline guys fly them for more than what the regional guys are? Oh wait, ALPA will get you the pay and respect you need.
Now just line up behind the Aloha, ATA, Midwest.....and all the other defuct ALPA pilot groups.

 

[Flyerdan]

In the end, 50 seaters will not even be here...70's will be the smallest RJ anyway.

Basically, when you are hired..you start on the 70 seater and move your way up.

That doesn't make sense to me. What do you do with the routes that won't support a 70 seat airplane. There are many routes that are currently flown by a 30 seater because they won't support a 50 seat airplane.

Also, I think it is more likely that regionals are getting ready to morph into code share partners instead of just being vendors that provide feed. Is that covered in scope? Republic is the perfect example right now. As a code share partner they could put an E145 to an E175, to possibly an Airbus on a route. That may be the future.

 

[WayBack]

Scope is number 1....get it NUMBER F'ing ONE!!! WE WILL GET BACK OUR FLYING. PERIOD. The days of the 50 are over. The days of farming out flying are over! About damn time.

In the world of reality, no you wont. It will only get worse.

In your little pipe dream, sure ok. But you will be getting paid regional wages, HAHAHAH!

 

[PBRstreetgang]

You's guys just don't get it. You will get your scope, just as soon as the attorneys at Ford & Harrison figure a way to redirect your flying as Mgmt wants. It will be codeshare, bla bla bla, or some other newly invented way to get around what ever you think you prevented.This is about having the ability to reset your payscale without a strike, check out Comair, I will bet there will be 70-80% of their guys lined up to get jobs at some other airline. Believe this, as long as we as a group are divided, we are conquered, and the regional concept does this nicely. We all are reacting and the managers at the airlines are pulling the strings.
Sorry
PBR

 

[DontFeedTheBear]

Mainline is the Landlord, Regionals are renters. When you realize that, you will understand why the regionals are not a career, it is a job. Leases expire, things change, the Landlord is healthy again!

Yogi

 

[WayBack]

Mainline is the Landlord, Regionals are renters. When you realize that, you will understand why the regionals are not a career, it is a job. Leases expire, things change, the Landlord is healthy again!

Yogi

And with out renters, the landlord is stuck with a empty apartment having to cover all the bills himself. He will only lower the rent to compete with the other apartments in the area, to get the renters back in his apartments.

 

[Whydoitry]

The only way that the flying goes back to CAL/UAL is if the cost of doing it is below that of the outsourcing. To do that the rates would probably have to be well below what the regionals are doing it for because of the other benefits that CAL/UAL have. Not only that, but CAL/UAL won't finance any new aircraft for their regionals, so there would have to be a cost assigned to that, as well as all those training costs. I think it can be done, but it will be at a great expense to the pilot contract.

 

[Bako Cap]

It is interesting that CAL is signing a 10 year contract with SkyWest to fly these 50 seaters as part of their buying ExpressJet. Taking back scope is going to take 10 years at the new UAL. We all have plenty of time to beat each other up on FI.