Perspectives on an AirTran and SWA merger

[T3700]

DOH with pay protection would be appropriate in this scenario. Some senior AAI capts would be unhappy with the fact they were no longer bidding in the top 10% even though their pay would go up substantially. Some of the more junior capts would be unhappy because they were no longer capts (even though they would get a big pay raise too). Most F/Os would be much better off with significant pay raises and quality of life improvements.

I think the 717 could fit in well flying the thinner routes that the 737-700 are a little to large for. As the leases on the 717 end, they could be replaced with 737s. Pay on the 717 should, however, be the same as the 737 until they are disposed of.

Most AAI pilots commute and I doubt there are a huge amount of Southwest pilots chomping at the bit to move to Atlanta. I don't think fences for Atlanta or MKE would be required. Maybe leave Atlanta as a 717 base and let it go junior.

Date of hire, pay protection, and let the AAI pilots hold whatever they can would be a simple and reasonably fair solution for most involved. If DOH was used, furloughs, if any, would occur in the most equitable manner possible.

A staple would not work and you would never get ALPA to agree to it. Any arbitrated settlement may result in a relative seniority scenario lumping 12 year AirTran Captains with 20 plus year Southwest Captains. This would create animosity and a nightmare like US Air.

The quicker AAI pilots (or the pilots of any airline bought by Southwest) consider themselves to be and are treated like any other Southwest pilot, the better.

 

[Mama's Boy]

The F9 guys screwed themselves. We never got past first base, they had their legs so tight together no amount of KY would help. Denver base protection (forever!) $3000 a month for F9 furloughed Pilots (forever!), Medical coverage forever......GMAFB :laugh: Who was bankrupt?

Anyone who uses the word "forever" in this industry is a fool.

 

[michael707767]

DOH with pay protection would be appropriate in this scenario. Some senior AAI capts would be unhappy with the fact they were no longer bidding in the top 10% even though their pay would go up substantially. Some of the more junior capts would be unhappy because they were no longer capts

Why would they lose their seats? I would expect in any merger you will be seat protected. I doubt there would be a full scale bump and flush.

 

[Kharma Police]

You are correct. Nobody there wants your group or any other group. They want to grow on their own. You need them not the other way around. You need to accept the fact that you are a large regional with 1500 pilots. You will do very well with Republic. Get use to it.

LOL!, guess what Junior, you are a even bigger regional that doesn't leave the CONUS. You guys still have PFT just like the regionals used to have too! Seriously, what's the most inter-Texas turns you've done in a day?!?

 

[Hose A. Jiminez]

Kharma,

I dont think he works for us. Notice he said "they" want to grow on their own. He's right, we do. Unfortunately it is not up to us. Not sure how an arbitrator would look at it. Its supposed to be "fair and equitable" to both groups per Allegheny Mohawk and Bond McCaskill. Neither side is supposed to get a "windfall". An arbitrator would likely see the pay raises that AAI guys would realize as a definite positive for them. Im not sure where any positives lie for our pilot group without some sort of bone thrown in there.

Im sure the majority of both groups would rather stay on their own.

 

[Quimby]

LOL!, guess what Junior, you are a even bigger regional that doesn't leave the CONUS. You guys still have PFT just like the regionals used to have too! Seriously, what's the most inter-Texas turns you've done in a day?!?

You sound like the General Lee of AirTran.

 

[Kharma Police]

You sound like the General Lee of AirTran.

Thank you, I admire his work!

 

[SWA/FO]

Amazing!!!, you forgot the word "staple" in your rhetoric, must of slipped your mind... The fact of the matter is you are overstaffed, not growing and your costs are rising, the F9 guys knew it. They saw the writing on the wall that they would be furloughed and they made the tough decision to give you guys the finger and merge with a commuter. It's amazing how you guys are still upset with that decision.

We have what you desperately need, a ton of gates in ATL. You cowboys need to grow to survive, some of you know that already but don't want voice your opinions to the other Jonestown members. Now, you can either play nice with us or the arbitrator will hand down a decision that you may or may not be happy with. Either way, don't be surprised when we give you the finger too.

oh, sorry..... I forgot: STAPLE to the bottom of the seniority list of the best airline in the Country! An airline not on the auction block, making money unlike F9, which was BANKRUPT. Last time I checked, bankrupt companies don't make money or the rules.

Now, the F9 guys are getting a classic teamster beatdown.

This above has nothing to do with AT.

 

[SWA/FO]

You cowboys need to grow to survive

I wish that was true, but its not a true statement

 

[Kharma Police]

I wish that was true, but its not a true statement

Oh boy, that's what the car industry thought too in your home town.......

 

[Benjamin Dover]

So lemme axe you somethin else Kharma - could your agents in ATL do a 25 min. turn?

 

[MINIME]

Easy Karma,

Respectfully, I think that LUV guys are simply trying to create dialogue just in case. I don't think anyone is insinuating a staple of the Tranny.

Listen, unless AAI finds the right reasons in front of a judge to file for bankruptcy, and feels the need to sell parts of the airline, I doubt there will be serious talk of a staple. Unless the pilot groups agree to it, it simply isn't feasable. That's the law.

If this merger/acquisition was to take place both pilot groups better get their best efforts upfront and deal with the realities of the market. Cause I trust that neither pilot group really would want this. But the reality is that if Mr. Kelly and Mr. Fornaro feel that it's necessary for survival it may happen. In that scenario there isn't much pilots can do to stop it.

F9 might have been a nice addition for SWA. But with CAL/UAL around the corner, SWA and someone else, or AAI and someone else might become the new reality. It will be business pure and simple. Just like contracts, they're not personal they're all about the bottom dollar.

Of course it's a known fact that Mr. Kelly might try to accommodate his employees a little more than most CEOs. But a the end of the day its about viability and survival.

 

[GuppyWN]

Good lord. This thread sure went downhill fast.

Gup

 

[MILPILOT17]

Good lord. This thread sure went downhill fast.

Gup

You aint seen nothing yet!

 

[instructordude]

If there is a merger then it will be relative seniority. The McCain/Feinstein ruling requires it. Federal Law I'm afraid.