Pinnacle pilots can do better

[Papps]

I'm going to go out on a limb here.....But asides from the people living in PNCL bases who wanted to get hired there, do you think most people went to PNCL for there industry leading contract? I don't expect much because I know these guys went to a company and decided to work under their prior rules.

Most 9E pilots are at their first airline. You don't know words like CDO, highspeed, extend, Junior Man, etc. your first time around (not just talking about streamers, but guys with real prior experience in 91 or 135 operations. You have no idea how "scheduled" and legal to start - legal to finish, and extensions are going to play a more important part in QOL than low pay. Its up to the guys that should know better (senior pilots). Unfortunately it sounds like this TA was reached with an "every one for themselves" metality.

And as for the guys who live in base, that thought flying for this airline made sense, life isn't exactly cherry for them either.

 

[buscap]

Without knowing the entire last contract and the entire current TA, I can't really say, but it does look like some improvements. That's the problem; some.

There should be more and the pay-scales are laughable considering how long this thing will stick.

The impact of over 60 guys coming back will be worse than you think. I have a buddy at UPS who has really been bent over by that one.

The thing is this turd will be in place just at the time when things will get better, leaving the Pinnacle pilots way behind.

I say, hold out and get something better. You don't need to fall on a self-killing sword like Comair did. Just look at what we did. Don't fly 'broke' airplanes. That really is all it takes. You will have the TA you deserve with just a little more effort and patience.

And then the rest of us will have a better leg to stand on when our time is up. Yes, it's that simple. Rising tides and all the boats ...blah blah blah...but trust me, in the end you will be glad you held out for better.

The Pinnacle pilot group is so darn junior, your costs will still be low by industry standards with a much better contract than this one. Pinnacle can afford to do better by you guys and still be extremely competitive. They know it, and you guys know it, so step up and do yourselves right.

 

[PCL_128]

Oh.... and my personal favorite. It allows the over 60 guys to return at their previous seniority!

Are you f&^%ing serious?!

 

[WayBack]

Are you f&^%ing serious?!

That's your beautiful ALPO at work.
Bending over the junior guy.

 

[PeanuckleCRJ]

Are you f&^%ing serious?!

No joke. The senior lifers really threw the rest of the pilot group under the bus with this one.

Every section that I see I am more and more amazed. When you have to look hard for improvements to speculate on why I would vote yes if I were still there, it's bad.

Typically with contracts I have to look for easter eggs to figure out why I would vote no. This one is just the opposite...

 

[SBD]

Crown and Coke? What are you guys like 16 or are you just females? Why waste a good liquor in a strong mixer? Time to grow up...Crown on the rocks with a splash of water.

Anybody who pours Coke/cola into any Whiskey/Scotch/Bourbon needs to be beaten to a bloody pulp. Add a light Beer while you destroy your drink.

 

[nwcrjca]

repost sorry

 

[TNPILOT]

Anybody who pours Coke/cola into any Whiskey/Scotch/Bourbon needs to be beaten to a bloody pulp. Add a light Beer while you destroy your drink.

Thank you. Let me add women who order a cosmo with Grey Gouse or the like to the mix.

 

[dondk]

right from section 22, agreed upon on 9/27/06... I can only guess this was the GT clause, he would be the one guy I think most would not have too much of an issue with.


Should the FAA extend or otherwise revise the federally regulated maximum age limit, the Company may elect to reinstate a pilot who has retired from the Company due to reaching the previously established federal maximum age limit. Such pilot will be reinstated to his former relative position on the seniority list.

PCL. I am surprised, you did not bolt yet when this was TA'd. You had no idea?

 

[redflyer65]

I'm amazed that the MEC sent this to the pilot group. I really don't see the improvement over a contract from 1999.

No 401k bump?
An average payscale scheme with no published scale?
No COLA beyond the ammendable date?
A low signing bonus that is paid out over two payments?

I would say that PNCL management has made out pretty well. The bottom line if this passes...

PNCL has skipped one complete contract cycle and are setting themselves up to skip another!

RF

 

[Smarta$$]

All wrong.
-CDO's cannot be front loaded or back loaded any more
-The on duty break for CDO's was increased from five to six hours
-Pay for a week of vacation actually increased
-Airport reserve was reduced to 9 hours
-No pilot can be taken below the contractual min days off any more. That was the single most common complaint of junior pilots

I have not seen one single factually correct piece of information in this thread. All I see is a bunch of angry at management pilots rationalizing a 'no' vote.

Wow, your a real F@#k'n piece of work if you are defending this POS. The reserve rules are definitively worse. You can't spin that any other way. They are worse. Why? How did that happen?

The stuff you posted above is not completely accurate, there is no miminum break for CDO's any more, and Ready Reserve was already 9 hours. Still no pay credit for being awarded 5-21 airport reserves per month. How can reserve pilots still get only 10 days off per month? Is there even an RJ operator out there besides Trans States that has 10 off?

Are 401K match for the first 6 or so years is 25% of the first 5%! That is 1.25% match! Industry worst. Almost

No cost of living increases after the amendable date. Again. Someone else pointed out that by the end of this new contract and the time it takes to negotiate its replacement, the pinnacle pilots will have been under a pay freeze 10 out of 20 years............


This is a joke, and the fact that you even bother to defend it says EVERYTHING about you.

 

[Smarta$$]

It wasn't ALPA national that sold us out, it was MEM union leadership, MEM influence on negotiators and MEM negotiators. Just my impression, with some information to back it up. Lots of protect my senior job at ALL cost mentality from some leadership down there. Also, a TOTAL lack of any give a sh!t of the junior guys from them as well. It is sad, we were sold out from within.

Just to add as well, I also believe there was influence here from some very senior ATL (formerly MEM) pilots.

There more you learn about this TA, the worse it gets. Not kidding.

 

[PCL_128]

right from section 22, agreed upon on 9/27/06... I can only guess this was the GT clause, he would be the one guy I think most would not have too much of an issue with.


Should the FAA extend or otherwise revise the federally regulated maximum age limit, the Company may elect to reinstate a pilot who has retired from the Company due to reaching the previously established federal maximum age limit. Such pilot will be reinstated to his former relative position on the seniority list.

PCL. I am surprised, you did not bolt yet when this was TA'd. You had no idea?

For some reason I seem to be missing that TA'd section in my archives. I'm not sure if WG just never sent it to me, or whether I somehow lost it in the past few years, but I don't have it in my old PCL NC files. In any case, I wasn't aware that we had TA'd that language, which is a perfect example of how screwed up the negotiating process always was at PCL. The MEC was kept in the dark 99% of the time, and only the NC and MEC Chairman knew what was really going on. Even when TA'd sections were sent to us, we didn't get briefings on anything. It was a mess.

 

[redflyer65]

For some reason I seem to be missing that TA'd section in my archives. I'm not sure if WG just never sent it to me, or whether I somehow lost it in the past few years, but I don't have it in my old PCL NC files. In any case, I wasn't aware that we had TA'd that language, which is a perfect example of how screwed up the negotiating process always was at PCL. The MEC was kept in the dark 99% of the time, and only the NC and MEC Chairman knew what was really going on. Even when TA'd sections were sent to us, we didn't get briefings on anything. It was a mess.

Wow! Unbelievable, just Wow..

 

[JoeMerchant]

For some reason I seem to be missing that TA'd section in my archives. I'm not sure if WG just never sent it to me, or whether I somehow lost it in the past few years, but I don't have it in my old PCL NC files. In any case, I wasn't aware that we had TA'd that language, which is a perfect example of how screwed up the negotiating process always was at PCL. The MEC was kept in the dark 99% of the time, and only the NC and MEC Chairman knew what was really going on. Even when TA'd sections were sent to us, we didn't get briefings on anything. It was a mess.

This is too rich....The KING of ALPA cheerleaders claims he didn't know this was TA'd under his watch...and he blames us ALPA sceptics on our problems...You couldn't make this stuff up if you tried....

PCL_128...YOU are what is wrong with ALPA and this industry....Not the line pilots who pay your full time ALPA leave...