DAL/NWA SLI Hearings in a nutshell

[Superpilot92]

I'm surprised none of the NWA pilots are appreciative of the place they find themselves in.

LMAO :laugh: , thanks for saving us

The money NWA is bringing is why DAL can continue to grow.

DAL wouldnt have been able to make its financial obligations while continuing to grow without the money NWA is bringing. That was quoted by your Mgmt earlier this year.

Bottom line is we are now in this together.

 

[Schwanker]

This is just a DALPA pipe dream. Not a chance this will fly. You can make numbers say whatever you like, as DAL is trying to do with these BS numbers. The expert witnesses DAL put on had to be a complete embarrassment as Mr. Katz ripped apart and easily disproved these so called "facts" and DAL numbers. I guess you can't blame DALPA for shooting for the moon. At least the NWALPA is positioning themselves for a middle of the road position which is much more likely to look like the final award.

Schwanker

 

[nonstop]

Someone was able to get a snapshot of one of the DAL negotiators outside making a statement to the press.

http://mypetjawa.mu.nu/archives/Mohammed-Saeed-al-Sahaf_iraqi-information-propaganda-minister.jpg

 

[PCL_128]

Fins, maybe I'm not understanding something here. How exactly can you merge a list via ratio within aircraft categories when you have tons of pilots that bid aircraft based on QOL? A guy could be 100 on the total list at NWA, but bids DC-9 CA because he likes the shorter flights and doesn't want to fly international. Do you really want to slot him in with the -88 and 737 pilots? Maybe I'm just missing something, but it doesn't seem like a reasonable way to integrate pilots.

 

[Shamrock1]

Someone mentioned up above about the people at both DAL and NWA that are on bypass, what would happen to them? Would they be treated as if they are on property within their respective seniority slot?

 

[Sedona16]

LMAO :laugh: , thanks for saving us

The money NWA is bringing is why DAL can continue to grow.

DAL wouldnt have been able to make its financial obligations while continuing to grow without the money NWA is bringing. That was quoted by your Mgmt earlier this year.

Bottom line is we are now in this together.

With all due respect "Superpilot" much of the time you come off as a snot nosed kid. Your arguements are charged with adolscent emotion and missconstrued facts. Just my opinion which I have no doubt you will dissagree with.

 

[Cessna340]

Venting removed...

 

[~~~^~~~]

PCL:

You start by putting pilots in the most senior equipment they can hold, if everyone were bidding the most senior equipment they could hold.

For instance, take a guy that is at at 92% of the list, or 8% from the bottom. At DAL that's a MD88 FO after you stack all the 777, 767, 757, 737 and MD88's slots along the seniority list. They might have bid the 767ER, but that does not mean they are up at the top.

Some people call this this "stovepipe." It is relative seniority which helps draw up the ratios where folks are placed where they already are, best preserving the status quo.

 

[wings421]

With all due respect "Superpilot" much of the time you come off as a snot nosed kid. Your arguements are charged with adolscent emotion and missconstrued facts. Just my opinion which I have no doubt you will dissagree with.

Hey, you can't talk to "super-premiumpilot92" like that!

No hard feelings superpilot.

 

[Monster Buck]

Want to share thoughts...........fine.


Anger over the first quarter scoreboard ..................POINTLESS!

Some are really going down the wrong road here.imp:

 

[Superpilot92]

With all due respect "Superpilot" much of the time you come off as a snot nosed kid. Your arguements are charged with adolscent emotion and missconstrued facts. Just my opinion which I have no doubt you will dissagree with.

You couldn't be more wrong. Here is the deal, i am junior now and will likely be junior afterwards therefore you wont see much flaming and bs posted from me. I dont know why you feel i post with "adolescent emotion" because i dont get emotional about this crap. Also my posts arent any more adolescent or snot nosed than anyone else, i guess you only mention that because i have mentioned i am "younger" . How old are you? Does your age make your posts anymore worthy of FI standards? I am here for the long haul regardless and I have way to much time left with this new company to let this stuff get to me. Does it get to you? Does the fact that i am "younger" bother you? IMHO, you either read to much into my posts or you dont like my optimism about this whole circus?

With that said thanks for the flame, i hope you feel "older" and more Crusty for doing so.

Take Care :beer:

 

[General Lee]

This is just a DALPA pipe dream. Not a chance this will fly. You can make numbers say whatever you like, as DAL is trying to do with these BS numbers. The expert witnesses DAL put on had to be a complete embarrassment as Mr. Katz ripped apart and easily disproved these so called "facts" and DAL numbers. I guess you can't blame DALPA for shooting for the moon. At least the NWALPA is positioning themselves for a middle of the road position which is much more likely to look like the final award.

Schwanker

Middle of the road? DOH? Come on now! USAir East asked for the same, and got relative seniority, which is a HECK OF A LOT closer to our proposal. And, everyone knows that the 742s and some of the DC9s are going away, which could have meant job losses, hence the bottom 400 or 500 being NWA pilots. Career expectations you know.... You can say that your side has a bunch of retirements coming up, and you should benefit from that. What about the same amount we have leaving 5 years after that? Can we benefit from those please? You have more senior pilots, with a frozen pension. That cancels that argument. Regardless, your side showed up looking sloppy, with a thin argument (we are older, we bring in more money(?), and the 787= DOH). It will be interesting indeed. I can't wait to buy all you guys beers in Bismark. (3rd and 5th rounds, actually)


Bye Bye--General Lee

 

[Schwanker]

Middle of the road? DOH? Come on now! USAir East asked for the same, and got relative seniority, which is a HECK OF A LOT closer to our proposal. And, everyone knows that the 742s and some of the DC9s are going away, which could have meant job losses, hence the bottom 400 or 500 being NWA pilots. Career expectations you know.... You can say that your side has a bunch of retirements coming up, and you should benefit from that. What about the same amount we have leaving 5 years after that? Can we benefit from those please? You have more senior pilots, with a frozen pension. That cancels that argument. Regardless, your side showed up looking sloppy, with a thin argument (we are older, we bring in more money(?), and the 787= DOH). It will be interesting indeed. I can't wait to buy all you guys beers in Bismark. (3rd and 5th rounds, actually)


Bye Bye--General Lee

SS-
I didn't realize you viewed NWA as a USAIR East equivalent. As far as retirements, you benefit from yours from now thru infinity. That's fine with me. At the same time we should benefit from NWA retirements indefinately. Sounds good to me. You won't get anything close to what your proposing. It's as lopsided of a proposal as anyone could envision. Your witnesses sure struggled on cross as they not only couldn't defend this proposal, but they couldn't defend any of the numbers that were manipulated to build this BS list. I'm looking forward to the end as I expect these experienced arbitrators to do the right thing.

Schwanker

 

[PCL_128]

PCL:

You start by putting pilots in the most senior equipment they can hold, if everyone were bidding the most senior equipment they could hold.

Ahhh, that makes much more sense. Thanks for the explanation, Fins. Sounds like a fair proposal to me, but I'd have to hear the NWA arguments to see what their objections are.

 

[General Lee]

SS-
I didn't realize you viewed NWA as a USAIR East equivalent. As far as retirements, you benefit from yours from now thru infinity. That's fine with me. At the same time we should benefit from NWA retirements indefinately. Sounds good to me. You won't get anything close to what your proposing. It's as lopsided of a proposal as anyone could envision. Your witnesses sure struggled on cross as they not only couldn't defend this proposal, but they couldn't defend any of the numbers that were manipulated to build this BS list. I'm looking forward to the end as I expect these experienced arbitrators to do the right thing.

Schwanker

I would guess you might not have reviewed your NWALPA proposal, since it looked like a term paper done the night before it was due. As far as what you deserve, you should get what your future fleet plan would look like in two years, and yours is losing planes. Our retirements will match yours in 5 years, and you getting credit for yours will equal what we should get for ours. So, that would be a wash there. USAir East ASKED FOR DOH, which is the same thing you did. How did they do? They got pretty close to what we are asking for. Your older pilots will leave with a frozen pension, and that is significant, since you got our better rules (and pay---even though you lost some things like minimum hours and time and a half after 80 hours), and we don't get a pension, ever. I hope the arbitrators look at our proposal and see that it really is middle of the road. If we had gone full tilt like you guys with DOH, we would have asked for a staple.


Bye Bye---General Lee