Furloughs at Delta and Northwest

[clippyrip]

NWA brings more pilots than pilot jobs.

We also bring an almost equal amount of cash on hand and less debt. Try remembering that when you complain.

 

[General Lee]

We also bring an almost equal amount of cash on hand and less debt. Try remembering that when you complain.

But hey, your senior guys have a frozen pension...... I wouldn't brag you have an equal amount of cash on hand while your pay rates and work rules were inferior.....please try to remember that.... Steenland really appreciates your sacrfice during BK, and that extra cash means all the world to him. How much of the merger pie "loot" did we have to use up to bring you up to our rates and give you our better rules? Thanks for the DC9s, though...


Bye Bye--General Lee

 

[clippyrip]

But hey, your senior guys have a frozen pension...... I wouldn't brag you have an equal amount of cash on hand while your pay rates and work rules were inferior.....please try to remember that.... Steenland really appreciates your sacrfice during BK, and that extra cash means all the world to him. How much of the merger pie "loot" did we have to use up to bring you up to our rates and give you our better rules? Thanks for the DC9s, though...


Bye Bye--General Lee

I understand we all have things to be proud of and things that we are not. I just hate to see some Delta boys start bitching about the deal as if they got screwed. They were happy with LOA 19 before NWA joined up and then did an about face on it once we joined on. Oh no, NWA is getting a bigger raise, boo hoo, I want more money, I'm gong to vote it down, boo hoo. Its all ego and its lame. Everyone is getting a raise, good deal. Yes, initially NWAs will be bigger, big deal. Such petty cr@p to be whining about. For those that feel that way, like Speedbird, I have a little viloin that is playing your tune.

 

[tomgoodman]

Minefield

Some Delta pilots clearly feel there is an advantage in shooting down the JPWA to get the SLI put back in front of the contract. I dare say that they control the internal debate right now. The current expectation is that the JPWA will be voted down. (current, as in "subject to change")

Politically every option seems risky given the USAPA precedent.

Fins,

You're right about the political risk, which all MECs hate, and that's why I think the list will end up in arbitration anyway. I fear that shooting down the JPWA would only delay the inevitable, and management would take the opportunity to substantially reduce its next JPWA offer, (if there is one). If they or the creditors are having second thoughts about the merger, this would be a perfect excuse to call it off.

 

[IXLR8]

Steenland really appreciates your sacrfice during BK, and that extra cash means all the world to him.
Bye Bye--General Lee

As I am sure Anderson will enjoy his cash you put forward in the future...enjoy.

 

[General Lee]

As I am sure Anderson will enjoy his cash you put forward in the future...enjoy.

Ummmm, ooooooh-kay? What? Do you want me to drive a Delorean Back to the Future? Huh?


Bye Bye--General Lee

 

[brainhurts]

I wasn't talking about who is dressed up, but rather, the content of most posts to the right of that clown.

Yes, he is a tool.

 

[Superpilot92]

The latest from the NWA side. Good News!!

“ No involuntary, out-of-category, displacements or layoffs will occur as a result of the 2008 fall schedule reduction. Involuntary, out-of-category, displacements previously published for October 2008 will, at pilot option, be reversed. A pilot previously identified to be displaced for October 2008 will be contacted to elect whether he wishes to remain in his position or to be displaced. A pilot electing displacement shall retain the attendant 24.E.10. recall rights to which he is entitled in the Agreement.”

 

[Redmeat]

“ No involuntary, out-of-category, displacements or layoffs will occur as a result of the 2008 fall schedule reduction. Involuntary, out-of-category, displacements previously published for October 2008 will, at pilot option, be reversed. A pilot previously identified to be displaced for October 2008 will be contacted to elect whether he wishes to remain in his position or to be displaced. A pilot electing displacement shall retain the attendant 24.E.10. recall rights to which he is entitled in the Agreement.”

Yeah, I'm sure the displacement announcement was a mistake by some mid-level manager drone trying to do the right thing managerial wise.

Broke the *no negativity until the merger is complete referendum*

They gotta get everyone back into Kumbaya mode now.

 

[cessnapilot]

Thanks for the DC9s, though...


Bye Bye--General Lee

Your welcome!
cp

 

[Occam's Razor]

Yeah, I'm sure the displacement announcement was a mistake by some mid-level manager drone trying to do the right thing managerial wise.

Not a mistake. It was probably accurate at the time, but circumstances changed.

1. The plan for dealing with the ridiculous run-up of fuel prices has changed. It changed because the plans of the competition changed.

2. There was influence from decision makers outside NWA who weren't consulted while the original plan was being constructed.

 

[Noserider76]

“ No involuntary, out-of-category, displacements or layoffs will occur as a result of the 2008 fall schedule

Good news indeed. We get used to the displacement and furlough word being thrown around in this crappy business but it's generally a life changing event for the person it affects.

 

[Voice Of Reason]

2. There was influence from decision makers outside NWA who weren't consulted while the original plan was being constructed.

OOooooo...do elaborate....

 

[Superpilot92]

OOooooo...do elaborate....

I would guess that means Mother Delta

 

[Flyer1015]

Yes, he is a tool.

Ha.

Still pis$ed from our heated arguments from over 6 months ago?

Yeah, I know it must hurt. You resorting to namecalling only proves that point.

Grow up.

 

[Flyer1015]

I don't know who that is, could you spill the beans on that guy? Thanks.

Phil Trenary, the CEO of Pinnacle Airlines. Or should I say, Pinnacle Airlines Corporation.

He created a subshell/holding company BS to circumvent our scope when it came to buying Colgan.

PT the Clown lives in infamy. He's hated by pretty much every pilot at Pinnacle.

 

[Flyer1015]

I wasn't talking about who is dressed up, but rather, the content of most posts to the right of that clown.

I post valid points regarding the potential outcome of flowthrough/flowback agreements, and suddenly, I'm the bad guy?

 

[~~~^~~~]

Not a mistake. It was probably accurate at the time, but circumstances changed.

1. The plan for dealing with the ridiculous run-up of fuel prices has changed. It changed because the plans of the competition changed.

2. There was influence from decision makers outside NWA who weren't consulted while the original plan was being constructed.

Occam:

There might be another angle at play. While we have separate operating certificates we can not fly each other's airplanes. That means furloughs and displacements can't be done (in order) until we have the SOC.

The time line is very, very, quick. ACL said it well, when he said we will be talking about our new seniority numbers while we eat Thanksgiving Turkey.

In other news, Delta is now saying they will NOT be hiring this fall. This fits with everything that I was told that Delta would hire IF they did nt have an SLI.

Almost makes me wonder if we already have a handshake agreement on a SOC. As a training god, you probably know this stuff before we do.

Congrads on the pay rates - BTW.

 

[JoeMerchant]

I post valid points regarding the potential outcome of flowthrough/flowback agreements, and suddenly, I'm the bad guy?

You committed the cardinal sin of question convential wisdom within ALPA....That will draw cheap attacks from the bleachers.....

 

[Fly4hire]

Occam:

There might be another angle at play. While we have separate operating certificates we can not fly each other's airplanes. That means furloughs and displacements can't be done (in order) until we have the SOC.

If the list is done and it is ratio dynamic as has been suggested do not assume DC9 F/O will be the bottom seniority numbers. We could easily have a situation where the bottom #'s go something like 3xDC9 F/O, 2x737 F/O, and so on, and if there were furloughs announced they would come off the bottom in that order. You are assuming that all bottom positions will be on NWA acft. I wouldn't be so sure of that.

Your number is your number, and furlough will be based on that, not what your position is.