New Jetblue pay raise!

[Bavarian Chef]

I dont think you support them but you are an expert at giving them a daily " jb hater" fix..

PS the reserve grid for bus Fo's tomorrow shows -1 dang !!!

Support them? By doing what? Email them? I never email anyone at this company. That's what Scud is for. Emails always work at jb, btw. Just ask Tara about the benefits guide.

Jb hater? Yep, I am a jb hater. I hate the company that pays my bills and lets me fly for free. Yep. I hate that.

I voted for the Values Committee members, now I can't remember who they are or what they do. I did read a snazzy letter to the BOD though.

 

[JBPA]

BC,

Thanks for the walk down memory lane. The 121 transition was woefully painful for me too (sarcasm). Those night hand-flown Case III's (no Autos for me) didn't prepare me at all for the grueling ILS approaches with the autopilot on that I was in store for (more sarcasm). Flying around the northeast is especially challenging too when your only experience includes LFE's in Fallon or Red Flag or combat listening to no less than 4 freqs (STK, TAC, HQ, MIDS) while on NVG's and (GASP!) having to actually fly the airplane, work the radar, formation keep, and lead a sec/div downrange at 1200 kts closure, and talk on said radios all at the same time (you keepin' up Av8?)!

I'm about to click into year six-pay. I can hardly wait to be clearing what I did 3 years ago again! Well, at least until they drop the next healthcare bomb on us!

 

[Bavarian Chef]

BC,

Thanks for the walk down memory lane. The 121 transition was woefully painful for me too (sarcasm). Those night hand-flown Case III's (no Autos for me) didn't prepare me at all for the grueling ILS approaches with the autopilot on that I was in store for (more sarcasm). Flying around the northeast is especially challenging too when your only experience includes LFE's in Fallon or Red Flag or combat listening to no less than 4 freqs (STK, TAC, HQ, MIDS) while on NVG's and (GASP!) having to actually fly the airplane, work the radar, formation keep, and lead a sec/div downrange at 1200 kts closure, and talk on said radios all at the same time (you keepin' up Av8?)!

I'm about to click into year six-pay. I can hardly wait to be clearing what I did 3 years ago again! Well, at least until they drop the next healthcare bomb on us!

Come on now, take it easy on him. He had to wait an extra ten minutes for the hotel van and he couldn't get the wireless internet to work until he called the front desk. Oh, and his "Cowabunga, Dude!" sticker fell off his Purdy bag yesterday.

Please, show some empathy. Or sympathy. Your choice.

 

[flyinboxes]

Didn't know ALPA wasn't a real union?

Ask a former TWA guy that question. Nice work on that one boys!

Yes it is ALPA's fault AMR bought your bankrupt airline.

 

[Occam's Razor]

Ok...now I'm confused. What's the sort here?

I'll take the "cabin cleaning" quips. Chef's got the subsonic civilian sim experts. AlbieF15 take the high guy on your side (TWS). SonicPig, you stay in full scan and look for spitters.

 

[Anaconda]

No, it was the many pilots that have quit in the past months that got JB pilots this raise. A union will be needed to get anything else out of them.

Have that many pilots quite JB in recent months? Where are they going for example?

 

[Oh-ryan]

Military jocks with no instrument time? Where? Deicing is tough? The Northeast corridor? Is that like "going downtown"? Ohmagod. You really need to spend a week with those forward deployed pilots and see what tough is. You been shot at? Had to shell out of an airplane? Land on a unlit postage stamp, I mean aircraft carrier at 3 am? Spend up to 6 months away from your newborn baby? Better yet, shower with shoes on for 6 months? If you don't get my jokes about the young, hair gel backpack-lugging new hires, then you aren't based in nyc. The point you are missing is what that says about the job and where the morale of this company may be headed. If we hire guys content with these benefits and pay rates, what's the incentive to raise them?

BC,
Sometimes I would take the shoes off to spice things up a bit. My own little game of Russian Roulette - the shower version. Will I wake up tomorrow with a planter's wart, athlete's foot... or will it keep me guessing for a couple of weeks and develop into a nice case of toe nail fungus? Who knows... but it sure did make a six month deplyoment go by faster. The other advantage of no shoes is that it is easier to "toe" your shower babies down the drain.

PS.
I agree with you... all civilian pilots suck.

 

[Zipperhead]

Yes it is ALPA's fault AMR bought your bankrupt airline.

It IS ALPA's fault the TWA pilots got stapled due to failure to represent. This is why the lawsuit the TWA pilots have against ALPA is proceeding nicely.

 

[AlbieF15]

Have that many pilots quite JB in recent months? Where are they going for example?

I've seen several former JB guys go to Fedex, SWA, CAL, and to UPS. I've also seen several guys miss on shot 1 at SWA who will be trying again.

 

[Caveman]

I don't have a problem with the first year pay. It's better than most. The problem is the quick upgrade to 320 CA has disappeared and now the new guys have to try and make a living on FO pay for 4-5 years. If someone can get hired at SWA, FedEx, or UPS they can make a LOT more in their second and subsequent years than they can at JetBlue. A LOT more.

The new pay scale doesn't give me a 20% raise for year 2, it gives me a dollar an hour raise. I was already going to get $56 and change, now I'm going to get $57 and change. Whoopty fricking do. Also, no retro for me because I'm just finishing my first year so the only bonus I get is to keep my current rate.

If they really want to stop the bleeding of 1st and 2nd year FOs leaving they are gonna have to do better on year 2/3 pay. Year one we're in good shape compared to everyone else. Then the wheels fall off. That's why people are leaving. It isn't the culture or lack thereof. Show me the money.

 

[zkmayo]

I don't have a problem with the first year pay. It's better than most. The problem is the quick upgrade to 320 CA has disappeared and now the new guys have to try and make a living on FO pay for 4-5 years. If someone can get hired at SWA, FedEx, or UPS they can make a LOT more in their second and subsequent years than they can at JetBlue. A LOT more.

The new pay scale doesn't give me a 20% raise for year 2, it gives me a dollar an hour raise. I was already going to get $56 and change, now I'm going to get $57 and change. Whoopty fricking do. Also, no retro for me because I'm just finishing my first year so the only bonus I get is to keep my current rate.

If they really want to stop the bleeding of 1st and 2nd year FOs leaving they are gonna have to do better on year 2/3 pay. Year one we're in good shape compared to everyone else. Then the wheels fall off. That's why people are leaving. It isn't the culture or lack thereof. Show me the money.

I realize Im wasting my breath here, but here goes. Youre just getting off 1st year pay and youre already complaining about 2nd year pay? Boo frickin hoo is right...didnt you look at the pay scale when you got on here for years 2-10? I just dont get it. Where in the last 11 months has the expectation been created that you would get a pay raise beyond what you signed on for? Not only the expectation, but the entitlement that you are actually "owned" any raise? Reality check: JB is a 7 year old start up, it hasnt been around 35 years or 197 years like SWA/FDX and UPS. Youre not going to make that type of money here nor should you expect to NOW. Year by year pay should come up though. If you want to go work for them, more power to you. Im not saying we all dont deserve more money, we all do. But the last time I looked this is still a very young company that hasnt been very profitable of late.

Im not bashing you or defending the company; I just dont understand the expectations or the sense of entitlement.

 

[General Lee]

I realize Im wasting my breath here, but here goes. Youre just getting off 1st year pay and youre already complaining about 2nd year pay? Boo frickin hoo is right...didnt you look at the pay scale when you got on here for years 2-10? I just dont get it. Where in the last 11 months has the expectation been created that you would get a pay raise beyond what you signed on for? Not only the expectation, but the entitlement that you are actually "owned" any raise? Reality check: JB is a 7 year old start up, it hasnt been around 35 years or 197 years like SWA/FDX and UPS. Youre not going to make that type of money here nor should you expect to NOW. Year by year pay should come up though. If you want to go work for them, more power to you. Im not saying we all dont deserve more money, we all do. But the last time I looked this is still a very young company that hasnt been very profitable of late.

Im not bashing you or defending the company; I just dont understand the expectations or the sense of entitlement.

It looks like the way to make money at JB is as an A320 Capt. What are the prospects at an upgrade onto the bus at JB? Probably not very good, since all of the 320 captains are young and won't retire anytime soon, and there are probably many senior bus FOs waiting for any spot that opens up. There are probably E190 Captains that are waiting to move over to the bus left seat eventually too. If you are junior on the bus or E190 as an FO right now, it may take awhile to see that large pay increase. Don't worry, we have some of the same problems here at DL, but we are getting a bunch more 757s this year and some more 777s and 787s eventually. And hey, maybe we will merge (or aquire you or parts of you) and you can bid 767s over here.


Bye Bye--General Lee

 

[AlbieF15]

I realize Im wasting my breath here, but here goes. Youre just getting off 1st year pay and youre already complaining about 2nd year pay? Boo frickin hoo is right...didnt you look at the pay scale when you got on here for years 2-10? I just dont get it. Where in the last 11 months has the expectation been created that you would get a pay raise beyond what you signed on for? Not only the expectation, but the entitlement that you are actually "owned" any raise? Reality check: JB is a 7 year old start up, it hasnt been around 35 years or 197 years like SWA/FDX and UPS. Youre not going to make that type of money here nor should you expect to NOW. Year by year pay should come up though. If you want to go work for them, more power to you. Im not saying we all dont deserve more money, we all do. But the last time I looked this is still a very young company that hasnt been very profitable of late.

Im not bashing you or defending the company; I just dont understand the expectations or the sense of entitlement.

I think don't caveman or anyone else have a "sense of entitlement", but they are looking around and seeing if their skills can go to a higher bidder. Caveman doesn't "owe" JB (nor does anyone else) a day longer on the property than they want to work there. Why would someone join knowing year 2 or 3 pay was low? First--there has been a lot of discussion in improving those rates. Second--compensation comes in many forms...including profit sharing and stock options. Finally--getting the 121 experience might make folks more marketable to other companies. Checking in for a year then checking out when a better deal comes along doesn't make a pilot a terrible person--it makes them a realistic business person.

A lot of folks are at JB now because JB was the only place they could get hired, and it was better than where they were OR it was good bridge to a later job.

And that...in a nutshell...is the big difference between JB now and 3 years ago. 3 years ago people joined with career aspirations. Now, a lot of folks look at this place as a stepping stone. Caveman (I think) left a job as a CL 65 captain at a place going through some tough times. Now he has a better job (I think). However--nothing says he can't march on to someone else with a little more experience and perspective now, and his stop in JB doesn't make him a terrible guy.

The choice is really up to current management. If they want career guys, then there needs to be some career type pay. Otherwise--folks will jump for better offers. When guys were upgrading at 2 years and making six figures, getting profit sharing, and the stock was on the way up...well...they'd ride the storms. Right now, JB has a great culture, but some real growing pains and a staganting upgrade train. Attrition is only going to go up, not down--until those things change. Chastising folks for looking for better deals is unrealistic.

One final note--and I've said this before--folks who STAY at a carrier should THANK everyone leaving. There is NO better way--even unionization--to send a signal to management that "...it needs to be better..." Every guy who walks over to FDX, CAL, or whereever is putting pressure on the company to make YOUR life better too. If they are senior to you--you move up a notch. If they are junior--its easier now to get your buddies hired. And either way--somebody is having to factor is attrition costs when they determine the next set of pay scales.

 

[AlbieF15]

Don't worry, we have some of the same problems here at DL, but we are getting a bunch more 757s this year and some more 777s and 787s eventually. And hey, maybe we will merge (or aquire you or parts of you) and you can bid 767s over here.


Bye Bye--General Lee[/quote]

Weren't you the same guy who a month ago was wearing a "keep Delta my Delta" lanyard and praying to God and anyone that would listen for Doug Parker to leave you alone?

It is continually apparent to me that without a Delta uniform on you are a very small person without much of a true identity in life. While I seriously doubt Delta will in fact merge/purchase/aquire any part of B6, I also never thought US Air had a shot at either America West or Delta, so I know I don't know squat about the industry. What I do know, however, is that by taunting guys about a possible merger or buyout just continues to reveal the lack of class and maturity that has characterized about 90% of the drivel you put on these boards.

 

[Nado]

Albie, taking words out of my mouth as usual.

GL, I keep trying to like you but you just make it so hard.

For the last 5 years it was pretty easy to take shots at you and DAL, what with record setting losses, no pensions (that you voted for if memory serves) and a long term BK, but that is just bad karma. DAL pilots are mostly good guys to give/get rides from. I have even had some interesting ALPA discussions with them. I try to remember they are in the majority, and you just hide behind a computer with your myopian view.

Just because you can reply to any and all threads, doesn't mean you should.