Jetblue pilots begin organization drive...

[jbucpt]

JetBlue Swings To A Loss In Q3; Plans To Reduce Growth Rate By Cutting Fleet - Update
Tuesday, October 24, 2006; Posted: 11:47 AM


You were saying.

Go back and clean the cabin son.

put down your ALPA magazine and let me given you reality check regarding jetblue for the 4th quarter 2006, per James Parker Ph.D of Raymond James. (if you need more analyst info on jetblue, ill be happy to provide it)

• revenue and cost better than originally anticipated.
• jetblue now projects a 4Q passenger RASM increase of 22-24% y/y and ex-fuel CASM to increase just 3-5% y/y (down 2 points from prior guidance)
• removing seats to a 150 confiquration creates a net savings of 30 million over 5 years.
• based on these positive trends we are raising our 4Q and 2007 EPS estimates of $.12 and $0.50, respectively, up from $(0.01) and $ 0.45. our 2008 EPS estimate remains unchanged at $0.80.
• moreover, we reiterate our outperform rating and $16 target on JBLU.
• as momentum clearly is continuing to build for the company. JETBLUE in our view, is well on its way to double-digits margins.

all without being in bankruptcy. can you give me independent research outlook on delta (not what your CEO is selling to prevent a merger) so i can compare??

now, be a good DALPA B#tch, and spread those butt-cheeks for Grinstein.

 

[furloughed dude]

jbucpt,

C'mon you work for crap wages and no retirement. Some big profit sharing checks too, huh? So you can say what you want about other carriers, but you know your "agreement" sucks. I know I worked there...

Now go clean that cabin....

 

[ATR-DRIVR]

He's working, are you?

 

[furloughed dude]

Why yes I am.. Thanks for asking though. I don't clean cabins either...

 

[Falconjet]

put down your ALPA magazine and let me given you reality check regarding jetblue for the 4th quarter 2006, per James Parker Ph.D of Raymond James. (if you need more analyst info on jetblue, ill be happy to provide it)

• revenue and cost better than originally anticipated.
• jetblue now projects a 4Q passenger RASM increase of 22-24% y/y and ex-fuel CASM to increase just 3-5% y/y (down 2 points from prior guidance)
• removing seats to a 150 confiquration creates a net savings of 30 million over 5 years.
• based on these positive trends we are raising our 4Q and 2007 EPS estimates of $.12 and $0.50, respectively, up from $(0.01) and $ 0.45. our 2008 EPS estimate remains unchanged at $0.80.
• moreover, we reiterate our outperform rating and $16 target on JBLU.
• as momentum clearly is continuing to build for the company. JETBLUE in our view, is well on its way to double-digits margins.

all without being in bankruptcy. can you give me independent research outlook on delta (not what your CEO is selling to prevent a merger) so i can compare??

now, be a good DALPA B#tch, and spread those butt-cheeks for Grinstein.

Wow, I guess the third time is the charm. I kept wondering what in the hey "butt-checks" were!

FJ

 

[jbucpt]

jbucpt,

C'mon you work for crap wages and no retirement. Some big profit sharing checks too, huh? So you can say what you want about other carriers, but you know your "agreement" sucks. I know I worked there...

Now go clean that cabin....

now thats really funny!! whats even funnier is i make more flying an a-320 than those flying the a-320 at the legacy ALPA carriers. whats the funniest of them all is; the jetblue e-190 pilots now make more or equal to what the ALPA boys do at USAIR. and the biggest laugh of all is we didnt pay 1.95%.

i dont know if you were asleep (dreaming about becoming an ALPA pilot again) and missed what happened to the "retirement plans" at the legacy carriers over the last 6 years, but i'll rely on my 401K, roth IRA, and investments before i trust ANY airline providing me with money at retirement.

 

[furloughed dude]

If you are proud of your pay you are definitely an idiot. The pay and benefits suck. I'm glad you won't trust an airline to provide for your retirement because that isn't gonna happen at Jetblue anyway. But at least you have dreams of profit sharing....

 

[LandGreen]

now thats really funny!! whats even funnier is i make more flying an a-320 than those flying the a-320 at the legacy ALPA carriers. whats the funniest of them all is; the jetblue e-190 pilots now make more or equal to what the ALPA boys do at USAIR. and the biggest laugh of all is we didnt pay 1.95%.

i dont know if you were asleep (dreaming about becoming an ALPA pilot again) and missed what happened to the "retirement plans" at the legacy carriers over the last 6 years, but i'll rely on my 401K, roth IRA, and investments before i trust ANY airline providing me with money at retirement.

JBCpts opinion: worthless!

JB Pilots opinion: Judging from the crewrooms lately...ALPA is the majority winner so far. That is the current snapshot...it could change, but not likely?

 

[thruthemurk]

Please understand that we recognize that jbucpt is an un-informed neophyte.

His opinions represent a minority of pilots at jetblue, and his crude attempts at discourse are an embarrassment to the profession.

 

[FNG_that's me]

now thats really funny!! whats even funnier is i make more flying an a-320 than those flying the a-320 at the legacy ALPA carriers. whats the funniest of them all is; the jetblue e-190 pilots now make more or equal to what the ALPA boys do at USAIR. and the biggest laugh of all is we didnt pay 1.95%.

i dont know if you were asleep (dreaming about becoming an ALPA pilot again) and missed what happened to the "retirement plans" at the legacy carriers over the last 6 years, but i'll rely on my 401K, roth IRA, and investments before i trust ANY airline providing me with money at retirement.

If you're still legally making roth IRA contributions, then you don't make enough money to rub anything in anyone's face regarding compensation.

 

[cgmason1]

whats the funniest of them all is; the jetblue e-190 pilots now make more or equal to what the ALPA boys do at USAIR. and the biggest laugh of all is we didnt pay 1.95%.

Wrong answer...even with the recent low raise-we do not make as much as the US Air 190 Captains currently make at 95 an hour and their proposed raise is to 125 an hour.

If you're still legally making roth IRA contributions, then you don't make enough money to rub anything in anyone's face regarding compensation.

I have to agree.

 

[HA25]

He's working, are you?

What so working as a whore and pariah on the industry is somehow honorable? If it weren't for the likes of JB and the ills it spawned, we all wouldn't be taking such huge pay cuts everytime we turn around and negotiate a new contract. The effects on one or two large non-union carriers on the rest of us is far disproportionate to their numbers and size..

Remember, a rising tide lifts all.. and JB is not raising anything but the expectations for what pilots should do, among which cleaning the cabin has become one.

 

[ATR-DRIVR]

Let's see...you took World over Delta? Is that right? Your choice of course. I left a regional to move up. So I am a whore and pariah? Wow, I guess I should have stayed at the regional so I could plateau out on pay and bennies and be at a "Regional Carrier". Yep, you guessed my plan. I guess you picked World over Delta for the same reasons. You made your choice, so did I. I, along with everyone else in this industry would like to make 200K, A and B funds, and fly 9 days a month. Show me a passenger carrier who fits that bill and I would apply tomorrow along with everyone else. I hope you enjoy the flying that World has. It is not for everyone. I did it many years ago and really enjoyed it.
Good luck.

 

[HA25]

Let's see...you took World over Delta? Is that right? Your choice of course. I left a regional to move up. So I am a whore and pariah? Wow, I guess I should have stayed at the regional so I could plateau out on pay and bennies and be at a "Regional Carrier". Yep, you guessed my plan. I guess you picked World over Delta for the same reasons. You made your choice, so did I. I, along with everyone else in this industry would like to make 200K, A and B funds, and fly 9 days a month. Show me a passenger carrier who fits that bill and I would apply tomorrow along with everyone else. I hope you enjoy the flying that World has. It is not for everyone. I did it many years ago and really enjoyed it.
Good luck.

Get a Union, and pay what your pears are paying with the work rules your pears are working under (note, pears are WN, TED, HP, etc..).. and then, I'll back off, until then I see JB as a bane on the profession.. Not going as far as J/S wars, and blacklists that many I know advocate, but making the point that while the Legacies (I was hired by American in 2001) were faltering, the JB Koolaid drinkers were reveling in that... well, it's time to come to account for that.

 

[ATR-DRIVR]

Get a Union, and pay what your pears are paying with the work rules your pears are working under (note, pears are WN, TED, HP, etc..).. and then, I'll back off, until then I see JB as a bane on the profession.. Not going as far as J/S wars, and blacklists that many I know advocate, but making the point that while the Legacies (I was hired by American in 2001) were faltering, the JB Koolaid drinkers were reveling in that... well, it's time to come to account for that.

So a union is the cure-all?? Tell that to TWA, Pan AM, HP and all the other carriers, major and regional alike who were 'protected' by the 'union'. How is that pay CUT at Airways, DL, AMR, and all the rest. What is a "pears" exactly? I suppose you mean PEERS. Yeah, let's 'blacklist" and have j/s wars, helps everyone. I really don't care if 'you' think jb is a 'bane'. Airline management is who I call a ' bane' on the profession. I really am curious as to why you took World over Delta? Is World ALPA? Keep thinking JB is the 'bane'. So all of the furloughees from DL, NW, US, AA, UA that are here have contributed to the downfall of the legacies through JB??
Sigh.....

 

[HA25]

So a union is the cure-all?? Tell that to TWA, Pan AM, HP and all the other carriers, major and regional alike who were 'protected' by the 'union'. How is that pay CUT at Airways, DL, AMR, and all the rest. What is a "pears" exactly? I suppose you mean PEERS. Yeah, let's 'blacklist" and have j/s wars, helps everyone. I really don't care if 'you' think jb is a 'bane'. Airline management is who I call a ' bane' on the profession. I really am curious as to why you took World over Delta? Is World ALPA? Keep thinking JB is the 'bane'. So all of the furloughees from DL, NW, US, AA, UA that are here have contributed to the downfall of the legacies through JB??
Sigh.....

You have me confused with someone else.. I work for Gemini. They recently went thru BK and ALPA did all they could to protect the contract, but surviving the 9/11 downturn put many aircarriers into BK.. fuel costs being the primary reason. I never went or interviewed at DAL, however I did get hired at American just prior to 9/11... IF/when they recall and re-interview I doubt I'll go back as I'm loving the idea of Cargo for the rest of my career.

As to your point about unions, TWA, PanAm etc... what do the two have to do with each other? Those companies faltered in a bad economy, and their managements (especially in the case of PanAm) handled their operations poorly which lead to their failure.

The problem I have with a JB and other "upstarts" and LCCs (other than WN), is that it seems like their entire business model is predicated on making pilots do more for less... they've figured out that fuel costs aren't as easy to control as labor, and that if we can convince the public that pilots are over paid, then we can get just enough of those pilots out there that buy into this myth to apply and work for us. If you're "Blue" enough, you don't need a union, cause you're a "team player" wink, wing, nudge, nudge..

Well, sorry, I'm old fashioned.. give me a union, a contract and work rules.. and I'll work my ass off with in that contract.. not a bit more, and not a bit less.

 

[HA25]

btw... like you I flew ATR at ASA.. and I was there when that union (the most dysfunctional ALPA unit IMHO) tried to sue itself onto the DAL list.. so there are examples of when a union can be it's own worse enemy, but generally you're better of with one.. and I hope JB joins the ranks of ALPA.

 

[lowecur]

Get a Union, and pay what your pears are paying with the work rules your pears are working under (note, pears are WN, TED, HP, etc..).. and then, I'll back off, until then I see JB as a bane on the profession.. Not going as far as J/S wars, and blacklists that many I know advocate, but making the point that while the Legacies (I was hired by American in 2001) were faltering, the JB Koolaid drinkers were reveling in that... well, it's time to come to account for that.

Another misery luvs company zealot. Maybe Jimmy Hoffa will reappear to help you resurrect the Teamsters. You'll keep bouncing around like a ping pong ball in your career because YOU come before your CARRIER. YOU people just can't stand the fact that Jetblue has a management team that has a plan that goes against the grain of pilot labor history.

Will Jetblue get a union someday? Yeah, I think it's inevitable with the growth they have had. You can't hire as many pilots and expect not to get fooled on interview by imposters that passed themselves off as company first people. Do these people care that the company needs margins between 10-15% to remain longterm viable?....No! Do they care that most of the legacy's have undergone a transformation that has sharpened their competitive position where it will take Jetblue time to adjust?...No! The minute Jetblue's mgt said they have turned things around and expect $150-200M profit in 07, the 190 raise and nothing for the 320 group was considered a slap in the face. If Jetblue was private, none of this would have been an issue at this time because they could have just kept their guidance quiet.

Lot's of people think an airline is better off if privately held. I think Jetblue is headed in that direction this year. The only thing stopping it would be the continued lobbying effort by Neeleman to make this deal work as a public company. I disagree with him, and I hope he changes his mind.....as the pundits of past history are rearing their ugly heads.

ps: Gemini just came out of BK in the middle of 2006 and I believe they are privately held. Time will tell if they have made all the right moves, but if they haven't then your furlough will come without warning.

imp:​

 

[jbucpt]

Wrong answer...even with the recent low raise-we do not make as much as the US Air 190 Captains currently make at 95 an hour and their proposed raise is to 125 an hour.




I have to agree.

wrong answer... you can spin it anyway you want, however, a jb pilot who flies 80 a month makes $7998 (12 year captain). a usair captain would make $7600. the $125 is wishful thinking, and has to be negotiated. we all know how long that will take.

you can also spin the roth's anyway you want. but the fact of the matter is; not to many (if any) ALPA A-320 pilots (captain/first officers) are making over $150,000 (married filing jointly) at their present payrates. therefore, i hope their not counting on the legacy retirement plans.

 

[Dave's kid]

You have me confused with someone else.. I work for Gemini. They recently went thru BK and ALPA did all they could to protect the contract, but surviving the 9/11 downturn put many aircarriers into BK.. fuel costs being the primary reason.

Guys help me out here, without a union, what did JetBlue have to give up after 9/11? Oh yeah, they got a pay raise.