What a NO vote means.

[Ski Bum]

I'm fine with them being there... What i feel is unprofessional is when they linger around outside the crew room and try to force their opinions on others - in front of passengers... THAT is unprofessional.. passengers do not need to be concerned with that.

How soon we forget what the OC had to go through just to get people to be able to wear lanyards...
The OC would LOVE to be in the crew rooms, but the company won't allow it. If you don't believe me then you should be in crew rooms almost daily when OC members are asked to take signs down and volunteers from Delta, FedEx, Northwest, ASA, and others are kicked out of crew rooms. So I am sorry if two pilots in uniform have to speak about their profession in the terminal. I can see how passengers who don't even know that gate D2 is the 2nd one down the "D" Concourse would take offense at two pilots talking. In fact they probably won't ever fly again.

 

[SkyNation]

Our pay discussions are a joke, pure and simple.

what has the result of these discussions been in terms of your pay vs. your counterparts at ASA, Comair, AWAC, etc? I'd bet you and I make more in the end.

Any pay gains we achieve are purely due to the willingness of our management.

are you suggesting that we can 'strong arm' our management with ALPA on board?

 

[Ski Bum]

are you suggesting that we can 'strong arm' our management with ALPA on board?

Quit fishing for somebody to say that all ALPA is is a bully.

Skywest Inc did not WANT to negotiate with ASA or give them more money, but they had to enter into NEGOTIATIONS where both sides made concessions and advances to reach a legally binding contract.

It isn't Strong Arming, it is negotiating for a legally binding contract.

Strong Arming, huh, interesting term. Would that be like presenting a pay package and then when it gets voted down not presenting another one for over a year? Would that be changing policies with the stroke of a pen? Would that be firing pilots who then are later awarded their job and back pay because it turns out they were unjustly accused? Strong Arming. Good Term.

 

[Nevets]

what has the result of these discussions been in terms of your pay vs. your counterparts at ASA, Comair, AWAC, etc? I'd bet you and I make more in the end.



are you suggesting that we can 'strong arm' our management with ALPA on board?

Some people lament the fact that ALPA supporters bring up Horizon, ExpressJet, etc and not others when comparing the overall value and QOL of their contracts. That may be a valid point. So just ask yourself if what you get paid now is fair considering the lost value of money (inflation) over time. Your pay slides back every year. Soon enough your pay will be lower than some others. But as a matter of fact, you can say that ASA has surpassed you while you stand still in terms of pay and QOL.

You cannot "strong arm" your management with ALPA on board. But you are certainly not going to get ANY legally binding good faith bargaining from SAPA. And I'm sure that if the ALPA drive fails, management will continue their passive aggressive "stong arming" that has prevented your pilots from at least getting a COLA.

 

[SkyNation]

Nevets,

how long have you been at XJT? how much did you make last year?

 

[Nevets]

Nevets,

how long have you been at XJT? how much did you make last year?

Um, yeah. We already had this conversation. You must be out of arguments against ALPA. So for the sake of saving some time let me refresh your memory. After I answered your question you said this.

I have friends there, and I genuinely hope you are happy there. However, for the sake of comparison, had you come here 2.5 years ago you could have upgraded by now, made more $, seen more growth, etc. etc. We're not losing airplanes or flying. This is not to incite a pissing contest about who is better, but we have some here who constantly use XJET as the 'shining example' of what a mngmt/ALPA relationship can provide. what do you think? and just so you know, this is where all the skywest haters will pile on with their usual crap about how we have it good now, but just wait!

35 years so far........

Then I replied like this.

There are arguments to be made whether Skywest is thee best regional. The fact you don't have an enforceable contract is probably the best argument against it. My point is that you guys/gals can make it where it is undisputed that Skywest is THEE best regional to work for.

I'm not suggesting you will do it first shot right out of the box. But with the balance sheet Skywest Inc. has, the ASA TA, the help from ALPA National's Bargaining Committee and Financial Analysis Department, together with the apperant fair relationship you have with management, there is nothing to say you can't have an industry leading contract right out of the box. But even if its not, you will get a contract that is enforceable and better than the wages and terms of employment you have now. Your rookie MEC will not be short of assets and bargaining leverage to deliver something better than what you have now. And THAT is the point. You can make things a whole lot better there that some people don't even realize it.

As far as comparisons go, what you say may be true. But not everyone is in it for the money, or the upgrade, or the jet time, retirement funds, etc. Different strokes for different folks. And you guys can make it so that the guy who wants to get his PIC time and move on is happy and the guy who is there to make it a career is happy. We have that at XJT. We have good work rules, good wages, a retirement fund, relatively quick upgrades, we are NOT losing airplanes but rather increasing the amount of flying we do.

Many of these things are because we have a good relationship with management. We have given leeway in things so they can work out their business plans and we get something in return for them. Both sides understands the give and take and we both use it as a win win situation. We do have a good relationship. We get briefed constantly on business plans and we brief them on things that can be done better and how the pilots can help achieve that. Basically, the two sides trust each other to a certain extent.

I'm not a Skywest hater. On the contrary, I like you guys. I have many many friends there. And some that will make it a career there. That is why I'm posting in here.

Oh yeah, I'm very happy here. It was actually choice 3 out of 3 for regionals. But now I'm glad this is where I am instead of the other two places.

This is from the "Does SAPA do all this?" thread.
http://forums.flightinfo.com/showthread.php?p=1440919#post1440919

So are you going to respond to my last post? I'll post it again.

"Some people lament the fact that ALPA supporters bring up Horizon, ExpressJet, etc and not others when comparing the overall value and QOL of their contracts. That may be a valid point. So just ask yourself if what you get paid now is fair considering the lost value of money (inflation) over time. Your pay slides back every year. Soon enough your pay will be lower than some others. But as a matter of fact, you can say that ASA has surpassed you while you stand still in terms of pay and QOL.

You cannot "strong arm" your management with ALPA on board. But you are certainly not going to get ANY legally binding good faith bargaining from SAPA. And I'm sure that if the ALPA drive fails, management will continue their passive aggressive "stong arming" that has prevented your pilots from at least getting a COLA."

Please respond to the merits of my post. Thank you.

 

[SkyNation]

I don't know how to tell you any plainer. I make as much or more than my counterparts at XJT and any other comparable regional. I have no reason to think that our management will do anything different than they've done for the last 35 years to keep it that way, keep us healthy as a company, and keep this place a desirable place to work. To do otherwise would be bad business. This is my opinion, and obviously we have our vocal minority that will disagree. If this vote goes down, then what I've said will reflect what the majority of guys here feel as well. If not, then I'll be wrong and admit it.

 

[Nevets]

I don't know how to tell you any plainer. I make as much or more than my counterparts at XJT and any other comparable regional. I have no reason to think that our management will do anything different than they've done for the last 35 years to keep it that way, keep us healthy as a company, and keep this place a desirable place to work. To do otherwise would be bad business. This is my opinion, and obviously we have our vocal minority that will disagree. If this vote goes down, then what I've said will reflect what the majority of guys here feel as well. If not, then I'll be wrong and admit it.

Because many people at Skywest don't make as much or more than you or your counterparts at XJT, Horizon, AWAC, etc. This is not all about one person. Many people at Skywest have been irreperably harmed by a management that has no legal obligation than to treat you for what you are - an at will employee! For Skywest management to treat you other than an at will imployee is, as you said, is "bad business." JA can pass away tomorrow and have the likes of Ornstien take over. They may not care about the last 35 years. This is about not settling for what you have when better is one ALPA drive away from being better solely on the basis of having an enforceable contract. Personally, I feel you will also be able to gain respectable wage and QOL gains which in turn helps your fellow pilot at AWAC, Mesa, XJT, etc.

Why would you not want the best for Skywest? Why wouldn't you want an enforceable contract? Why wouldn't you want to help out your fellow pilots at Skywest and the rest of the industry? Do you think that SAPA or your management will give you ANY of that?

 

[jea]

For every stupid post you bring up in this public forum I am gonna start posting the 5 digits of your employee number, and when that fills in I will start with your name.
and the first number is..... 2
Eat $hit you pogue.
PBR
Wanna keep going?

27242... whats yours? chicken $hit...

 

[jea]

I have nothing to hide... Some dont like my posts.. I'm ok with that... You found out who I am because I do not fear you or what you say you can do to my career. My initials are my name on flightinfo- they always have been. You, pbrstreetgang, on the otherhand, are a coward... You represent the best alpa has to offer. Weak intimidation, slander, insults, childish threats, I say you are spineless. Grow up. drop a ball or two, be a man and deal with the fact that I disagree with you. It is not a personal thing to me. You seem to feel like I hate you- I dont know who you are- I dont care. I dont believe alpa is right for SkyWest. I work here, I have my opinion, you have yours. Still a chicken $hit?