United Hiring Questions

[Jetjockey]

1,400 still furloughed at 400 per year is 3 1/2 years, possibly less time for growth airplanes, depending on whether the combined airline shrinks in the near future? Then another year or two of 400 per year retirements to have enough new-hires to push a person hired now off reserve = 4 - 6 years, depending on the hiring variable and if people don't take recall?

Not looking to start over, just lurking and didn't realize that many people were still on the street there... Being furloughed sucks, I know. Hope everyone gets back if they want to sooner than later!

Incorrect. More than 400 UAL have come over to the CAL side. They will have to hire sooner rather than later. The work rules, combined with FAR rest rule changes will drive new hiring off the street.

 

[eaglesview]

So if this TA passes, it affects all newhires on the Continental side, paying and abiding by the new TA?

Yes it would be a joint contract all but ending "UAL/CAL" sides with just the SLI to go.

 

[Mad Dog 80]

Any off the street hiring taking place in January?

 

[Andy]

1,400 still furloughed at 400 per year is 3 1/2 years, possibly less time for growth airplanes, depending on whether the combined airline shrinks in the near future? Then another year or two of 400 per year retirements to have enough new-hires to push a person hired now off reserve = 4 - 6 years, depending on the hiring variable and if people don't take recall?

Not looking to start over, just lurking and didn't realize that many people were still on the street there... Being furloughed sucks, I know. Hope everyone gets back if they want to sooner than later!

The total number of LUAL furloughs is 1435 (was 1437; one died and one turned 65). The actual number is probably lower; I only know of those two.

There are ~400 LUAL pilots currently flying at LCAL or in the training pipeline.

LUAL pilots have 10 years' recall rights from date of furlough. That has not changed in the new contract, so all pilots under the new contract will have 10 years' recall rights. Because of this, many will not return anytime in the near future.

On the last round of LUAL recalls in 2006-2008, approximately 2/3s of 2172 returned to LUAL. Those that bypassed a second time lost all recall rights (the 10 year recall rights were added in the contract rewrite).

The number of retirements in 2006-2008 at LUAL were less than the combined LUAL/LCAL retirements.

The new contract is supposed to require ~700 more pilots in order to fly in accordance with the contract.

737 training at LCAL is maxed out. When I went through training, someone high up in the training dept talked to our class and stated that they were looking 'worldwide' for available 737 sim time. AFAIK, no sim outsourcing has occurred yet.

Prior to the new contract, all LUAL furloughees had been offered a training slot at LCAL and they began to hire off of the street.

How many LUAL furloughees will return due to the new contract? Maybe another 400. That would tie up current available training for another year. If they outsource sim time, that time decreases.

 

[Andy]

Any off the street hiring taking place in January?

I ran into a trainee in IAH. He had been hired at UAL in 2008 but never got a class date. He's in an early December class.
While it's off the street hiring, that's not exactly what you wanted to know.
The last time I heard the pilot in charge of hiring, Capt Charlie Venema, discussing the hiring plan (it's been a few months), they were going to initially offer jobs to furloughed ALPA pilots first and then open hiring up to all pilots. He specifically mentioned a hiring preference to Comair pilots.

With the new contract, I would expect a decent number of LUAL 2007-2008 newhires to accept a job at LCAL. The payrates are significantly better than what they would have returned to under the old contract. There were only ~195 newhires at LUAL in 2007/8 and some have already accepted jobs at LCAL so this isn't a gamechanger.

Again, the hiring plan is somewhat dated information. I'll try to update once I get a chance to talk to someone in training. Since I'm IAH based and stay in some of the same hotels as trainees, I get a pretty good idea of new class composition.

 

[kj6991]

Any off the street hiring taking place in January?

Have you been paying any attention to anything? I swear you are a half retarded 4th grader. I hope someone does finally hire you somewhere so these types of questions finally vanish... There are endless threads on all information and questions you have ever asked.

 

[152SIC]

I was hired in early 2008 by LUAL and never received a class date. 3/24/2008 was when I received a letter from Kay stating that classes were put on hold.

I haven't heard anything from UAL recently. Any idea if they are going to call the rest of those hired at LUAL who didn't have class dates?

Thanks!

I ran into a trainee in IAH. He had been hired at UAL in 2008 but never got a class date. He's in an early December class.
While it's off the street hiring, that's not exactly what you wanted to know.
The last time I heard the pilot in charge of hiring, Capt Charlie Venema, discussing the hiring plan (it's been a few months), they were going to initially offer jobs to furloughed ALPA pilots first and then open hiring up to all pilots. He specifically mentioned a hiring preference to Comair pilots.

With the new contract, I would expect a decent number of LUAL 2007-2008 newhires to accept a job at LCAL. The payrates are significantly better than what they would have returned to under the old contract. There were only ~195 newhires at LUAL in 2007/8 and some have already accepted jobs at LCAL so this isn't a gamechanger.

Again, the hiring plan is somewhat dated information. I'll try to update once I get a chance to talk to someone in training. Since I'm IAH based and stay in some of the same hotels as trainees, I get a pretty good idea of new class composition.

 

[Andy]

I was hired in early 2008 by LUAL and never received a class date. 3/24/2008 was when I received a letter from Kay stating that classes were put on hold.

I haven't heard anything from UAL recently. Any idea if they are going to call the rest of those hired at LUAL who didn't have class dates?

Thanks!

I sent you a PM.

 

[152SIC]

Thanks for the PM Andy, I tried to reply back but your PM inbox is full.

 

[Andy]

Thanks for the PM Andy, I tried to reply back but your PM inbox is full.

The guy that I spoke to had a class date back in 2008; I don't know how much of a difference that makes.

 

[152SIC]

I think that is what makes the difference, so far at least.

Those hired at LUAL with class dates have been called, those without class dates are still in limbo. Thanks again for the information!

 

[CAL EWR B737]

Our MEC was briefed we are hiring 72 a month indefinitely. They have already had some in class as new hires that just interviewed in addition to those who were hired at CAL and UAL and put into a pool when both carriers stopped hiring after the last hiring period.

Jayson Baron
EWR CAL CA Rep

 

[kj6991]

Our MEC was briefed we are hiring 72 a month indefinitely. They have already had some in class as new hires that just interviewed in addition to those who were hired at CAL and UAL and put into a pool when both carriers stopped hiring after the last hiring period.

Jayson Baron
EWR CAL CA Rep

Other than some poolies being in class, I don't believe one bit of this post... I spoke with CV this morning actually. Where do you guys come up with this information, or should I say, misinformation?

I would like to see specific, in-writing information that off the street guys are currently interviewing, some are in class, and 72 a month indefinitely. When you post this in writing with valid confirmation, I'll swallow my words and apologize.

 

[zonker]

Other than some poolies being in class, I don't believe one bit of this post... I spoke with CV this morning actually. Where do you guys come up with this information, or should I say, misinformation?

I would like to see specific, in-writing information that off the street guys are currently interviewing, some are in class, and 72 a month indefinitely. When you post this in writing with valid confirmation, I'll swallow my words and apologize.

Good idea. Baron lied to this pilot group repeatedly about not giving ANY scope concessions to the company.

Now here we are and what do we have? Scope concessions.

Baron and his words aren't worth a bucket of warm spit.

 

[nimtz]

Other than some poolies being in class, I don't believe one bit of this post... I spoke with CV this morning actually. Where do you guys come up with this information, or should I say, misinformation?

I would like to see specific, in-writing information that off the street guys are currently interviewing, some are in class, and 72 a month indefinitely. When you post this in writing with valid confirmation, I'll swallow my words and apologize.

You are right and he is wrong. There has not been one new hire interview on the CAL side. Don't ya' think it would have been on this board or APC if there was? Furthermore the IAH training center can not handle 72/month. UAL guys can correct me, but I have heard of no new hire training at DENTK. Don't forget that our MEC was also briefed the our total compensation in 2013 will be superior to DAL's. :erm:

 

[Andy]

I want to make sure I'm clear about how I feel about LCALALPA. After LOA 25, I think they're bigger scumbags than smallsack, fred, and the rest of mismanagement.

However, on this particular subject, I think the information is 'close enough' to being correct. The person I talked to who had a class date in 2008, now going through training, stated that he went through an interview. I didn't ask him how formal it was but he did state that he was interviewed before he started class. Hence the interview statement above.
The training department looked at buying offsite sim time more than 6 months ago so if they've acquired offsite sim time, they could easily increase training to 72/month.
The training department has been hiring and training quite a few 737 instructors. I don't recall the percentage increase but it was significant.

A few months ago, there was something that came out saying that LUAL would start recalling in January.
When I went through newhire training at UAL, class sizes were ~28/wk. DENTK can handle a LOT of training.

I tracked monthly retirements at LUAL for a few years after age 65 took effect. LUAL had 25-30 pilots/month turning 60, yet they only had ~1.4 retirements/month. The LUAL side will be short of pilots very quickly now that age 65 retirements are kicking in.

With normal retirements taking place, the combined company will need to build a large training pipeline. With every LUAL widebody retirement, you've got 3-4 training events. Every training event is going to take a minimum of 2 months from start of training to end of OE. Add in instructors and LCAs and you're looking at a need for somewhere on the order of 1000 pilot positions just for the training pipeline.

 

[Mad Dog 80]

Have you been paying any attention to anything? I swear you are a half retarded 4th grader. I hope someone does finally hire you somewhere so these types of questions finally vanish... There are endless threads on all information and questions you have ever asked.

Why are you so angry? If you are a Captain you don't show the qualities of a very good one. Is that how you treat your First Officers? It looks like your cockpit might be a very unplesant place. 4th Grader? You are the one with the name calling. People like yourself should not be part of any forum, every question will be a stupid question. I pray that your life be filled with joy or you are going to give yourself a heart attack.

 

[Furloughed80]

If I had to guess, starting early next year (around Feb maybe?) UAL will start hiring at a steady pace. The reason we have not seen anything yet is most likely due to the fact they were waiting to see if the JCBA would pass. Just my opinion; nothing official...

 

[nimtz]

Andy,

The interview for poolies does not involve screening from a large stack of applicants. Going forward there will be a new interview process for Unical that has not been decided yet. Sorry I don't consider the poolies meet and greet interview 'close enough' esp when used to support the claim of 72 per month indefinitely. Hiring was coming irregardless of TA approval.

 

[Andy]

Andy,

The interview for poolies does not involve screening from a large stack of applicants. Going forward there will be a new interview process for Unical that has not been decided yet. Sorry I don't consider the poolies meet and greet interview 'close enough' esp when used to support the claim of 72 per month indefinitely. Hiring was coming irregardless of TA approval.

I agree with you that a formal interview process has not yet been implemented, which amazes me. They should have started formal interviews months ago.

I understand what you're saying about the poolie meet and greet.

I also agree that hiring was coming with or without the TA.

 

[CAL EWR B737]

I want to make sure I'm clear about how I feel about LCALALPA. After LOA 25, I think they're bigger scumbags than smallsack, fred, and the rest of mismanagement.

The first time the CAL MEC saw LOA 25 was when the TA book was handed to us. The CAL MEC had zero knowledge of anything relating to that LOA until we read the TA. That LOA was created by the entire JNC (half of your guys).

As far as the inappropriate comment about the CAL MEC. As a 1987 hire, if I am ever unfortunate enough to fly with you. Gear up, flaps up and you can probably guess the rest.


Jayson Baron
CAL EWR CA REP

 

[Andy]

The first time the CAL MEC saw LOA 25 was when the TA book was handed to us. The CAL MEC had zero knowledge of anything relating to that LOA until we read the TA. That LOA was created by the entire JNC (half of your guys).

As far as the inappropriate comment about the CAL MEC. As a 1987 hire, if I am ever unfortunate enough to fly with you. Gear up, flaps up and you can probably guess the rest.


Jayson Baron
CAL EWR CA REP

Yeah, right. We all know that pierceofshii twisted arms at the last minute to get that added. You guys did everything you could to try to get some leverage in SLI through this contract. LOA 25 has CALALPA fingerprints all over it.

The second portion of your comment begs the question: do you actually fly the line?

 

[CAL EWR B737]

Yeah, right. We all know that pierceofshii twisted arms at the last minute to get that added. You guys did everything you could to try to get some leverage in SLI through this contract. LOA 25 has CALALPA fingerprints all over it.

The second portion of your comment begs the question: do you actually fly the line?

Yes I do fly the line. I have flown a full line of time the last four years in my position and represented one of the largest bases in ALPA. Only the last three months due to the ALPA BOD, numerous MEC meetings (basically non stop) associated with the TA and crew room duty the last month have I ever been on any full time flight pay loss period.

Jay Pierce and the CAL MEC had nothing to do with LOA 25. It was a function of the JNC. It's funny Jay, Tara and my names are known all throughout the UAL system. Why, because we represented our pilots very well, some on your side interpret that as screw job because we weren't push overs.

Whats your name? Never mind you are an internet keyboard coward and would never post it.

 

[Lear70]

Everybody knows who Andy is.

Well... some of us anyway. LOL It's just a disagreement of opinion over where things have gone in union issues and he's still irritated. No reason to get personal. :beer:

 

[FlyForFood_NOT]

.. we represented our pilots very well...

Come on Jason.. really? Now you're spilling sweet crap.
Have you meet the 4 corner stones that the CAL pilots were asking for?
Scope- your TA proposed 90 seaters.. it's a failure
Retro- no full retro.. it's a failure
Work rules- amongst the many, begging scheduling for release on the last DH, double pumping reserves, PBS that doesn't honor seniority, payrates that lag DL, etc.. only some of it is a success here

The ONLY reason this TA passed was due to fear (mainly on the UAL side), but NOT because it was a worthy of approval TA. So.. how well did you represent those pilots again?

 

[CAL EWR B737]

TA passed on CAL side by over 60%.

 

[CAL EWR B737]

Everybody knows who Andy is.

Well... some of us anyway. LOL It's just a disagreement of opinion over where things have gone in union issues and he's still irritated. No reason to get personal. :beer:

He called the CAL MEC scumbags that's not personal? What's his name love to track him down and have a little chat?

 

[FlyForFood_NOT]

Funny.. because IF the CAL side had over 60% yes voters, this would make the total count way more than 67% with so many UA guys already voting yes.. so unless you can somehow support this comment, im calling BS on it.

2nd of all, like i said before. This doesn't change the simple fact that the TA passed mainly due to fear conviniently spread by the union (and the company) instead of it actually being a worthy of a yes vote TA.. here is one of YOUR own quotes that shows how you played that fear card so well:

"I ask you to make this extremely inportant decision with your eyes wide open. I promise you that no matter what happens, Mr. Smisek, Fred Abbott, and Jackson Marting are going to be just fine either way, but how will your family fare if we are stuck working under a concessionary contract for possibly a long time to come?" (Jason Byron)

Well done Jason (the family sorrow card was a good choice on your part).. now how well did you represent those pilots again???
The least you could do is just simply own it (it's called business) and stop smearing BS excuses for what you and the union did, cause it's a bit nauseating to read.

 

[chppr5]

TA passed on CAL side by over 60%.

That's interesting, both MC's told us the break down wasn't going to be available. FWIW, you might as well own pay banding also, after pounding your fist on the table threatening to drag out negotiations for 5 years if S-UAL didn't agree to it. At least you brought up the pay for 16 airframes (767-400) at the detriment of 133 airframes (757-200). If that's representing YOUR pilots I'm sure the EWR 757 pilots appreciate your effort. Or.........just another piece of the SLI argument?

 

[kj6991]

Why are you so angry? If you are a Captain you don't show the qualities of a very good one. Is that how you treat your First Officers? It looks like your cockpit might be a very unplesant place. 4th Grader? You are the one with the name calling. People like yourself should not be part of any forum, every question will be a stupid question. I pray that your life be filled with joy or you are going to give yourself a heart attack.

Posts like this from 4th graders should be posted in the McDonalds Playground forum.