This is why the last payrates offered by NJA were "insulting."

[acaTerry]

.....

 

[beytzim]

Hey guys, I was in your boat just a few short months ago. My frustrations were causing me sleepless nights, problems at home, and small bouts of depression.

But you know what, I fixed it, and now I'm happier then ever! How did I do it? I left Netjets and never looked back.

Forget about Nutjets ever being the company you thought it was promised to be. It's over. It's a time-building company no better than a commuter. Forget all the promises that Shamtulli or the MEC has told you. YOU are master of your domain, so do something about it! Leave!

I know the job market sucks right now. If you're over the age of 45, its really tough to get hired by an airline, so carry a stack of resumes with you and give them out to every pilot you meet at an FBO and get a corporate job - so what if you'll have to relocate, get over it, people do it all the time. If you're under 45, you're an idiot if you don't have a B-737 type and a CURRENT application at Continental, Jblue, UPS, FedEx, and SWA.

Netjets sucks, it will NEVER, I repeat, NEVER pay a descent salary, so STOP hoping and do something about it already!

 

[Ultra Grump]

Nope, nope, nope. Sorry, you must have missed the thread where we said we're going to begin to raise our standards. One of the things that we're doing here is disagreeing without being disagreeable. Calling somebody a name that might otherwise get your nose broken if not for being in cyberspacial anonymity would classify as such.

Too bad. Your post was otherwise well put.

So here ya go. See you in three days.

UAL78

pathetic.

Trying to make it better? maybe not taking the job for loser wages in the first place would have been the right start? huh? thats the shady past every Netjet pilot wants to forget about.....and its the nail in your coffin.

Now all of a sudden you are worth 3X the amount you agreed to a few years ago? no wonder your management keeps handing you guys your asses and you are the laughing stock of the industry.

Union shop...negotiating instead of kissing ass? who is kissing ass? If my employer does not keep me happy with dough I prove my worth, expect what I need and, if not happy.....move elsewhere that would suit me..free marketplace... and you? Hows that "negotiating" working for you?

All you morons do is come on here and argue with a couple of dispatchers and make threats to "Shut the F'er down".

What a joke.

I have never said "STFD."

I have never said I should be paid 3x my current pay.

I have said that we should be paid a fair salary for the work we do, and that the POSTA and the last offer by the company do not measure up.

When company men come on here and tell me that the company has offered the best they can and that it's fair, I provide evidence to the contrary.

When xxxxxxx like you come here and tell me I'm a moron for trying to improve the pay at an otherwise pretty good job, it just shows your own ignorance.

Apparently you have a problem with reading comprehension:

maybe not taking the job for loser wages in the first place would have been the right start? huh? thats the shady past every Netjet pilot wants to forget about.....and its the nail in your coffin.

I came here knowing what the pay was. Overall, it's about the same (a little less, but not appreciably) as what I was making at my former job, with more upside potential. I came here for that potential. I am working to make the potential a reality.

Yep, trying hard to forget it.

Crawl back over to the corporate board. Why do you care what we make or how we go about improving our contract? How exactly does it affect you? I'll tell you one way it might - when we finally take your God's-Gift-to-Aviation advice to move on, and start taking up whatever corporate job openings there are, there'll be a whole lot fewer chances for you to move on yourself. As the saying goes, be careful what you wish for - you just might get it.

 

[squonk]

pathetic.

Trying to make it better? maybe not taking the job for loser wages in the first place would have been the right start? huh? thats the shady past every Netjet pilot wants to forget about.....and its the nail in your coffin.

Now all of a sudden you are worth 3X the amount you agreed to a few years ago? no wonder your management keeps handing you guys your asses and you are the laughing stock of the industry.

Union shop...negotiating instead of kissing ass? who is kissing ass? If my employer does not keep me happy with dough I prove my worth, expect what I need and, if not happy.....move elsewhere that would suit me..free marketplace... and you? Hows that "negotiating" working for you?

All you morons do is come on here and argue with a couple of dispatchers and make threats to "Shut the F'er down".

What a joke.

Man are you dense. Grump explained it to you and you still don't get it.

Oh and one more thing TWO THOUSAND clubber. Get a life.

 

[Gulfstream 200]

Sorry certain words, even though spelled creatively are not allowed here. Too bad, the word was used for effect and not for content too... didn't need it to make your point.

Take three days off to cool down and re-think your participation style. Feel free to report other posters who engage in the same tactics which got you banned.

UAL78

Man are you dense. Grump explained it to you and you still don't get it.

Oh and one more thing TWO THOUSAND clubber. Get a life.

let me guess....you are another 32K/yr netjets pilot?

take corporate jobs? xxxxxxxx...you fools have branded yourselves the chumps of the trade. Not too many places will touch you or you would have left a LONG time ago.....hell even the lower end 135 outfits (who still outpay you badly) wont touch you because you consider them SCABS right? remember that? oh you are so organized.....

whatever.

good luck with the contract boys.

 

[Diesel]

Hey G200. Some of us enjoy working here. The pay isn't great but I don't work that much so it's a trade off.

I don't have any skeletons in the closet. I'm just trying to make where I am a better place.

Your condescending attitude is nice though. Thanks.

Hey Mark put in spell check. now that's cool.

 

[FlyFlyFly]

I'm not "blaming" my employer. I am pointing out to the company stooges why the latest offer from the company is inadequate.

It SURE sounds like you are blaming your employer AND calling them names. No wonder they are so fond of their pilot group, if you are an example.

Their offer must not be inadequate enough, as there are still a large number of pilots tolerating the situation.

 

[Ultra Grump]

It SURE sounds like you are blaming your employer AND calling them names. No wonder they are so fond of their pilot group, if you are an example.

Do you know what "blame" means? It's what GW does on a daily basis, as in "It's not my fault, it's someone else's."

NetJets is my employer. Going up the chain, I suppose you could include my CP, our DO, BB, RTS, and WB. I sincerely doubt any of them are the fools who create new screen names each week to spout B.S. They are the "stooges" to which I was referring. Nice try, thanks for playing, don't let the door smack you in the ass on the way out.

Their offer must not be inadequate enough, as there are still a large number of pilots tolerating the situation.

You might want to re-read that again, slowly, and see if even you understand it.

To get back on topic, $70,000 per year is required in most of California, and many other states, just to pay the most basic bills. Under the latest proposal, a pilot here would not hit that until their 4th year. Inadequate.

 

[Heavy Set]

Do you know what "blame" means? It's what GW does on a daily basis, as in "It's not my fault, it's someone else's."

NetJets is my employer. Going up the chain, I suppose you could include my CP, our DO, BB, RTS, and WB. I sincerely doubt any of them are the fools who create new screen names each week to spout B.S. They are the "stooges" to which I was referring. Nice try, thanks for playing, don't let the door smack you in the ass on the way out.

You might want to re-read that again, slowly, and see if even you understand it.

To get back on topic, $70,000 per year is required in most of California, and many other states, just to pay the most basic bills. Under the latest proposal, a pilot here would not hit that until their 4th year. Inadequate.

I think that number is low for the LA and SFO areas. I can't imagine how people can actually own decent homes in either area. Living on a NJA salary for the first few years of employment in those areas would be very difficult indeed. I guess you would need to either leave altogether or commute as much as feasible (or allowable). Thankfully NJA offers other gateways - but that might be difficult to consider if you are a native Californian...

 

[FamilyGuy]

OK, you may have a point there. How about we make a stand to get a raise and if it doesn't work out, then go out and get a raise?

squonk - no one has a problem with the pilots negotiating for more money. They do have a problem with the way many of the pilots are going about it....stating STFD, slowing down, writing up things that they normally would not, etc....

Keep it professional - like anyone else asking for a raise - and most people will respect that.

Some have been furloughed one too many times. Some just want to put down roots and not be an aviation nomad.

If this is accurate, then these individuals should be the first ones calling for reasonable offers from both sides and putting a muzzle on the radicals yelling STFD. You would think these people would be sharing their furlough stories and bringing some much needed common sense into the negotiations.

If people truly want to put down roots then they should be aiming for a livable wage that is sustainable in the long run....not demanding a 100% raise and $200,000 bonus.

 

[FamilyGuy]

Dude, you need to chill out. I am tired of your ranting - what do you have in this fight? For years I have been reading your posts - 98% are condescending and your holier-than-thou attitude is getting tiresome. You add very little value - you just shoot others down. Boy, you're so cool!

At the end of the day, this is a forum people use to educate themselves, communicate with others and to vent their frustrations. Viewing this forum is voluntary - don't feel compelled to participate. Most people agree that the NJA guys are getting the royal $haft - so, let them vent. If you don't like the commentary, go back to the corporate board and show us all how important you think you are....

Six - what do you have in this fight? Last I checked, you didnt work at NetJets either.

Its a public board....if you dont like the negative feedback then dont read it.

If the NetJets people want to come on here and 'vent' as you describe it, then they should know and expect that they will get feedback - both positive and negative.

And I wouldnt characterize the NJA guys as 'getting the royal shaft'. Read Grump's own words....his only complaint is pay...everything else is good from his viewpoint.

 

[FamilyGuy]

I have never said "STFD."

I have never said I should be paid 3x my current pay.

You haven't said you should be paid 3x your current pay, but one of your 'negotiators' Tom Gasta did in his 3 page diatribe that was written for the benefit of all NetJets employees.

You've already said you support the union's position on negotiations, and describe them as 'solid proposals'....so what's the difference whether you said it or not?

Your union speaks for you? isnt that how it goes?

 

[FamilyGuy]

To get back on topic, $70,000 per year is required in most of California, and many other states, just to pay the most basic bills. Under the latest proposal, a pilot here would not hit that until their 4th year. Inadequate.

Yes, let's get back on topic....

So $70,000 is required just to pay the most basic bills?

Hmmm....if that's the case, then there seems to be some incongruities in your previous statements that need to be resolved...

You currently make $37,560 per year, yet you are able to afford 'basic bills' like USC Trojan Season tickets, health club dues, and martial arts dues....

If these are the 'basic bills' then what do you consider to be the frills?

Let me know how you are able to swing the Trojan season tickets....I'm still trying to figure out how to afford Buckeye season tickets....and the cost of living here in CMH is much lower than LA.

 

[Ultra Grump]

You haven't said you should be paid 3x your current pay, but one of your 'negotiators' Tom Gasta did in his 3 page diatribe that was written for the benefit of all NetJets employees.

Really? Nice try - here's the language to which you're referring:

How can the Company afford “three times current payroll”.
Answer: First, the payroll is only 2 times as much...

You've already said you support the union's position on negotiations, and describe them as 'solid proposals'....so what's the difference whether you said it or not?
Your union speaks for you? isnt that how it goes?

Yep.

 

[Ultra Grump]

Yes, let's get back on topic....

So $70,000 is required just to pay the most basic bills?

Hmmm....if that's the case, then there seems to be some incongruities in your previous statements that need to be resolved...

You currently make $37,560 per year, yet you are able to afford 'basic bills' like USC Trojan Season tickets, health club dues, and martial arts dues....

If these are the 'basic bills' then what do you consider to be the frills?

Let me know how you are able to swing the Trojan season tickets....I'm still trying to figure out how to afford Buckeye season tickets....and the cost of living here in CMH is much lower than LA.

I actually never said what I make here. I compared my former salary as a regional FO to a first-year captain at NetJets. Never said I was one. But I'll play along...

I never said I am paying the "basic bills." My wife works as well - 2 incomes allows us to live where we do. I could have Lakers, Dodgers, and Angels season tickets right now as well, if I wanted to. (Maybe if your boyfriend had a job, you could afford those Buckeye tickets...) But if we decide to start a family and have my wife stay at home, we could no longer afford to live here. We could not afford the "basic bills."

Under the current CBA, I would not be able to afford it as a 1st-, 2nd-, 3rd-, 4th-, 5th-, 6th-, or 7th-year captain. Under the latest proposal, I would not be able to afford it as a 1st-, 2nd-, or 3rd-year captain, and just barely as a 4th-year.

Is that congruous enough for you?