SWA culture!

[redflyer65]

YouBlow,

I don't have the data, but believe me SWAPA does. Is it fair for AAI guys to get ALL the gains of the SWAPA contract and CJ to take it in the shorts? Give me an honest answer if you can possibly pull that off..

 

[RLAblows]

YouBlow,

I don't have the data, but believe me SWAPA does. Is it fair for AAI guys to get ALL the gains of the SWAPA contract and CJ to take it in the shorts? Give me an honest answer if you can possibly pull that off..

No, I agree, but I don't think there isn't anybody on this message board that can truly define or predict the "gains" of this acquisition.

 

[Empennage]

You seem unwilling to acknowledge the link between seniority and career earnings expectations. For ATN pilots, your career earnings will increase dramatically regardless of your seniority. For SWA pilots, numerous seniority models will decrease our career earnings expectations. How you can think it's fair for some ATN pilots to earn an additional 1-2 million over their career while some SWA pilots take a loss is concerning.

It's not about beating the ATN pilots, its simply about protecting the career value of our pilots. It hardly seems unfair to protect our value while increasing yours.

Wow, this is a great Post MILF.

I will add its quite similar to what age 65 did to the SWA seniority list (or any airline list).

 

[redflyer65]

Just throwing it out there...a zero growth scenerio along with planned retirements of everyone at age 65? Would that be a good starting point?

 

[RLAblows]

It is this rationalization that pumps our concerns into the stratosphere.

Your crystal ball analogy is not something any SWA pilot will count on. We are going to protect our careers with what is known before we have any concern for yours. Gary shares our concerns and not yours. We are SWA and you are not, for now.

If you are a guarantee for increased profits and growth, why are your profits consistently anemic and recent growth marginal. Didn't you have guys on furlough last year or so? This deal could actually harm SWA. (a huge, rationalized concern for the pilots of SWA) There is no guarantees in the airline business. You are ignorant to think otherwise.

I hope both sides come to negotiated agreements with all their seniority based work groups. The alternative could be quite damaging to one our both of the interested parties.

Just like everything else on here, this has already been beaten to death. Our ex-CEO said publicly that the furlough was a huge mistake, but the brain trusts beneath him used it as a weapon. It back fired leaving us short of pilots during our peak season. We hired in 2009/2010, I believe it was 160 or so. We had planned growth. One destination we did add was Bermuda, and added frequency to our Caribbean destinations. We had other island destinations planned with the two deliveries we were taking. We made record profits over these years, but they aren't as big as SWA, but we aren't as big as SWA. Another point that has been beaten to death.
I'm not trying to argue with any of you, but AirTran has value. I for one just want to get this over with. Get my seniority number and blend into my new family. AirTran will be put in the rear view mirror, never to look back. I think the only time I'll mention AirTran is if somebody asks me about it. I look forward to the future.

 

[Bob Dylan]

Why do the trannies find it so hard to believe that SWA pilots don't deserve to lose anything. They belong to the stronger company and deserve to gain something out of this deal besides intangibles. After all, the trannies just hit the freakin jackpot!

A straight staple is as fair as it gets and is most probably the outcome.

 

[B727Driver]

Spot on Bob. The Valuejet guys did hit the jackpot. Especially the ‘line-crossers’.

 

[redflyer65]

Ouch!

 

[Bob Dylan]

Spot on Bob. The Valuejet guys did hit the jackpot. Especially the ‘line-crossers’.

Are most of the senior trannies Eastern strikebreakers who started ValueJet? Ouch is right. So much for getting what's coming to ya.

 

[B727Driver]

Truth hurts when it’s true. Rewarding bad behavior is not acceptable.

 

[RLAblows]

Truth hurts when it’s true. Rewarding bad behavior is not acceptable.

Not sure what Bob Dbag said, but are you saying there aren't any line crossers at SWA?

 

[B727Driver]

From what I have heard, 3 out of over 5700 to be exact.

 

[PCL_128]

Dude, AAI has the more rapid gain of relative seniority, not us. That is the biggest problem, unless I read your post wrong.

That is a problem that needs to be addressed, agreed. But, there are ways to address it, and I'm sure our MC will be making proposals that will address it. But again, those methods don't require a chunk of our pilots to be attached to the bottom of the list. There are other ways to skin a cat. Now, if SWAPA and the SWA pilots are truly only concerned about addressing those legitimate issues and protecting their career expectations, and aren't really concerned about some sort of ridiculous ego problem of having AirTran pilots mixed into their list without a group of us being stapled, then I'm sure a deal can be reached.

 

[Ty Webb]

If you are a guarantee for increased profits and growth, why are your profits consistently anemic and recent growth marginal.

Why don't you ask Gary? Apparently, he hasn't shared the answers with you. Maybe you should stick to flying planes and leave the Financial stuff to them.

Didn't you have guys on furlough last year or so?

No, did you? If you are so uninformed as to ask this, perhaps you ought to take some time to do some research, instead of just posting random crap.

This deal could actually harm SWA. (a huge, rationalized concern for the pilots of SWA) There is no guarantees in the airline business. You are ignorant to think otherwise.

You're right. That is why pay rates are transient, seniority is a constant.

I hope both sides come to negotiated agreements with all their seniority based work groups. The alternative could be quite damaging to one our both of the interested parties.

Only if you decide to behave like spoiled children. Follow the agreement you have signed. . . . . You agreed to Binding Arbitration; if it comes to it, then abide by it. Be a man. It really isn't that hard. Is it?

 

[SWAdude]

ty, ty ty, ty,

You are continuing to make a name for yourself.

 

[Ty Webb]

ty, ty ty, ty,

You are continuing to make a name for yourself.

Yes, I guess I should just be intimidated into silence.

 

[waveflyer]

Now, if SWAPA and the SWA pilots are truly only concerned about addressing those legitimate issues and protecting their career expectations, and aren't really concerned about some sort of ridiculous ego problem of having AirTran pilots mixed into their list without a group of us being stapled, then I'm sure a deal can be reached.

There you go again- always the passive aggressive alpa poisoning/raising discontent by calling out WN ego w/ no regard to AT's. Let's just shelve the ego thing and recognize most every pilot worth anything at all IS proud.

But this is now just you looking out for #1. I imagine YOU will end up below CJ, so you're about painting it as a staple no matter how many of your senior are ratio'd in.

Sorry, but there are a lot of arguments that end up with a good lot of FOs at the bottom of the snapshot- the biggest of which is that the SWA job takes 3-5 years longer than AT to get competitive. Are you saying you'll be pissed if those arguments are made and agreed to, PCL?
But here's what I don't like- I got a few hundred friends who'd love to be at the bottom of everyone, who have slim chances competing against 7000 other very well qualified applicants. It is that FACT that's annoying when AT guys get aggressive and are less than happy to be here. Especially since GK has reaffirmed again, no furloughs.

 

[Dash Power]

So sorry. Time flies when the stapler is swinging.

2 Years, 10 months, 3 days ago were the first furloughs. Like it makes a difference...

 

[Lear70]

Yes, I guess I should just be intimidated into silence.

What... you didn't get the memo?

 

[PCL_128]

But this is now just you looking out for #1. I imagine YOU will end up below CJ.....

That would be incredibly unlikely.