SWA culture!

[dicko]

Dude, AAI has the more rapid gain of relative seniority, not us. That is the biggest problem, unless I read your post wrong.

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I completely understand the age differences and the inequity of the retirement numbers. More importantly; so do the Merger guys. They are working on it.

 

[dicko]

You just make it worse.

The truth often does. You'll be ok.

 

[waveflyer]

I understand exactly what you're saying, and there are several ways to address that in ISL models that won't harm either group. And it doesn't require doing what wave continually demands, in placing hundreds of AirTran pilots below Mr. Johnson. There are solutions to this, as long as people think rationally instead of emotionally.

"Demands"? Really?

Besides a general disagreement on this 1 topic PCL, and your willingness to actually PFT and look for all career short cuts, and your love for all things ALPA and unwillingness to critique it at all, and defense of ALPA in all things, and your lack of leadership and blaming pilots for any issue ALPA has, and your disappointment in losing ALPA, and scheming to retain ALPA, or at least your role in ALPA, and your apparent dislike of flying at all much less flying a solid line (I guess one doesn't have to like flying if they don't have to fight and scrap for those initial hours).... Besides that, there is only one difference between you and I, PCL: I KNOW I'm not important and in no position to "demand" anything of this great company.
I have complete trust in GK, SWA, SWAPA, and our NC/MC and will open-mindedly look at any proposals they present.
Who I don't trust is an ALPA national officer who stands to lose that position and was recalled for interfering in the SLI. I'll have a beer with you and talk women and sports and life- I won't give much credence or time to your thoughts on the SLI.

 

[jball2]

Thanks for fixing that Dash!

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[RLAblows]

Everyone needs to re-read this post, because from a Southwest perspective...this is where the rubber meets the road.

If CJ's upgrade is delayed by one month, two months, etc.. he has been harmed and his career earnings potentially decreased by a younger AAI group that could be ratioed ahead of him.

As stated before, it is completely quantifiable and I'm sure been presented to SW management and the AAI MC.

Spot on post MILF.

When was CJ's planned upgrade before the AirTran aquisition? We would need to know that, but remember, no speculation about the future. Those aren't my rules, it just gets repeated by every SWA pilot on this board.

 

[redflyer65]

YouBlow,

I don't have the data, but believe me SWAPA does. Is it fair for AAI guys to get ALL the gains of the SWAPA contract and CJ to take it in the shorts? Give me an honest answer if you can possibly pull that off..

 

[RLAblows]

YouBlow,

I don't have the data, but believe me SWAPA does. Is it fair for AAI guys to get ALL the gains of the SWAPA contract and CJ to take it in the shorts? Give me an honest answer if you can possibly pull that off..

No, I agree, but I don't think there isn't anybody on this message board that can truly define or predict the "gains" of this acquisition.

 

[Empennage]

You seem unwilling to acknowledge the link between seniority and career earnings expectations. For ATN pilots, your career earnings will increase dramatically regardless of your seniority. For SWA pilots, numerous seniority models will decrease our career earnings expectations. How you can think it's fair for some ATN pilots to earn an additional 1-2 million over their career while some SWA pilots take a loss is concerning.

It's not about beating the ATN pilots, its simply about protecting the career value of our pilots. It hardly seems unfair to protect our value while increasing yours.

Wow, this is a great Post MILF.

I will add its quite similar to what age 65 did to the SWA seniority list (or any airline list).

 

[redflyer65]

Just throwing it out there...a zero growth scenerio along with planned retirements of everyone at age 65? Would that be a good starting point?

 

[RLAblows]

It is this rationalization that pumps our concerns into the stratosphere.

Your crystal ball analogy is not something any SWA pilot will count on. We are going to protect our careers with what is known before we have any concern for yours. Gary shares our concerns and not yours. We are SWA and you are not, for now.

If you are a guarantee for increased profits and growth, why are your profits consistently anemic and recent growth marginal. Didn't you have guys on furlough last year or so? This deal could actually harm SWA. (a huge, rationalized concern for the pilots of SWA) There is no guarantees in the airline business. You are ignorant to think otherwise.

I hope both sides come to negotiated agreements with all their seniority based work groups. The alternative could be quite damaging to one our both of the interested parties.

Just like everything else on here, this has already been beaten to death. Our ex-CEO said publicly that the furlough was a huge mistake, but the brain trusts beneath him used it as a weapon. It back fired leaving us short of pilots during our peak season. We hired in 2009/2010, I believe it was 160 or so. We had planned growth. One destination we did add was Bermuda, and added frequency to our Caribbean destinations. We had other island destinations planned with the two deliveries we were taking. We made record profits over these years, but they aren't as big as SWA, but we aren't as big as SWA. Another point that has been beaten to death.
I'm not trying to argue with any of you, but AirTran has value. I for one just want to get this over with. Get my seniority number and blend into my new family. AirTran will be put in the rear view mirror, never to look back. I think the only time I'll mention AirTran is if somebody asks me about it. I look forward to the future.

 

[Bob Dylan]

Why do the trannies find it so hard to believe that SWA pilots don't deserve to lose anything. They belong to the stronger company and deserve to gain something out of this deal besides intangibles. After all, the trannies just hit the freakin jackpot!

A straight staple is as fair as it gets and is most probably the outcome.

 

[B727Driver]

Spot on Bob. The Valuejet guys did hit the jackpot. Especially the ‘line-crossers’.

 

[redflyer65]

Ouch!

 

[Bob Dylan]

Spot on Bob. The Valuejet guys did hit the jackpot. Especially the ‘line-crossers’.

Are most of the senior trannies Eastern strikebreakers who started ValueJet? Ouch is right. So much for getting what's coming to ya.

 

[B727Driver]

Truth hurts when it’s true. Rewarding bad behavior is not acceptable.