Strike Vote Called For at NetJets

[semperfido]

no i don't really think you are cheaper either. just a question.

 

[rvsm410]

Hey Guys,
Interesting discussion going on here. I have no axe to grind, not employed by NJA, though I was interviewed for a dX position recently, it sounds like it might have been a blessing to have not been selected...but I have a few questions.

With so many qualified pilots in the market, especially down south, if you guys do go on strike, what is to stop these other folks from filling in your spots? Would they be looked at as scabs down the road if they applied for airline jobs? would they care anymore in this day and age of pi$$ poor pay in the regional levels....

I can think of regional captains as well as Cargo Capts that dont make $86K a year....dont get me wrong, I believe all licensed aviators should be paid what their worth...God knows I feel this way about 121 dispatching....it sucks to be jointly responsible for $13 bucks an hour...but I degress, We all know the salary bar is dropping in the airline world everyday, i.e. Delta's addition of Mesa airlines into the connection family. These are all strategic moves designed to ward off future salary increases by their respective unions....

So what makes the NJA pilots feel they should be successful in earning 2 1/2 times the industry salaries when the NJA management knows they would have lines of pilots waiting to earn your salaries...

As for the NJA dispatchers, well I know when I interviewed there I was concerned about a fleet shut down that would put me on the street, I dont see anything changing that concern....

Good luck, maybe I just dont understand all the issuies for you pilots folk, but from an Airline guys stand point, it looks like you all have been doing pretty well already..

JMHO mind you.

 

[pilotyip]

-------CAPT/yr------F/O
YR 1 36K 27K
YR 2 40K 28K
YR 3 47K 29K
YR 4 56K 30K
YR 5 60K 32K
YR 8 70K 32K
YR 12 88K 32K

You have to stay there at while to get the $70K to $90K mentioned before. Source Airline Pilot Central rounded to a yearly wage.

 

[Live4flyng]

So what makes the NJA pilots feel they should be successful in earning 2 1/2 times the industry salaries when the NJA management knows they would have lines of pilots waiting to earn your salaries...

Just curious where you came up with 2 1/2 times industry salaries?

We all know the salary bar is dropping in the airline world everyday

NJA isn't an airline, and I would have to disagree with your statement. SWA pilots are doing just fine.

 

[Herculeus]

Can someone tell me what toys you can buy making $30K.How do you guys even afford a house.To all the Netjet pilots don't settle for anything less get what you want you deserve it.

 

[IFlyOU]

if a strike does happen, i'm about 90% sure the company is not going to budge.

and i'm also pretty sure you guys may lose your jobs...

if that does happen, and you're out on the street, would you regret it?

what would you do???

put it this way, when they were building the golden gate bridge during the great depression, the unemployed would sit and wait for workers to fall and die... that's kind of how i feel if you guys go on strike... I'm not saying you're going to die, but i'm almost positive that you will end up on the street...

i'm also concerned that NJA has turned into a bad investment to BH shareholders... WB may cut his losses and sell... word around the flight center... even heard it from an ACP. Check out BRK stocks... FEB 20th, it fell from a high of 92k a share...

right now: 83,999.90. 9% loss in less than 3 months...

-concerned pilot employed by NJA as a temp desk jockey while i dig myself out of thousands in credit card debt for a useless MEI...

 

[jpilot]

<<My friend who has worked for COEX for 5 years is making 31k as an SIC... He can't wait to come aboard...>>

I guess, Dispatcher, you have never worked for a union. As your COEX friend has, I'm sure they will not be crossing a picket line. Ask any pilot, it's the death of your career. Yes, we are all ready with our resumes. Heck, I can work at Costco and get by the same as my pilot wages. Add in not paying much for health insurance and being home every night, it's more than doable. The NJA pilots are unified in the same thoughts and their actions with a strike vote will show this. It's going to be bumpy ride for all of us.

 

[jpilot]

What a shame you edited your post while I was responding. Guess you rethought the COEX friend comment. Don't worry about us pilots. We can get jobs doing just about anything.

 

[IFlyOU]

What a shame you edited your post while I was responding. Guess you rethought the COEX friend comment. Don't worry about us pilots. We can get jobs doing just about anything.

lol yeah sorry, i did... he hates coex, and loves NJA

but yeah, my buddy has worked at coex for 5 years and makes 31k a year... he can't wait to come aboard

[see my previous golden gate example]

 

[Bad Monkey!]

if a strike does happen, i'm about 90% sure the company is not going to budge.

I'll put my money on the other 10%- Fact: no bucks, no Buck Rogers for our owners, they will seek blood from shamtulli's and buffett's hide!

and i'm also pretty sure you guys may lose your jobs...

I'd rather walk a picket line than work on my knees any more!

if that does happen, and you're out on the street, would you regret it?

Would I regret being home with the wife and kids and work a regular job making more than what Nutjets is currently paying? HELL NO!

what would you do???

We fly the richest most powerful people in the world, who, by the way, are being told by the company that we pay $x amount only to have the money skimmed off our paychecks to front higher wages for our non-union pilots at other divisions that are losing money. How about our expansion into China and South America? who do think is going to pay for that? how about NetJets Europe? NetJets Middle East? NetJets Russia? Just where do you think the money has come from? I'll tell you-From the sweat off of my back and the backs of my brothers and sisters.

put it this way, when they were building the golden gate bridge during the great depression, the unemployed would sit and wait for workers to fall and die... that's kind of how i feel if you guys go on strike... I'm not saying you're going to die, but i'm almost positive that you will end up on the street...

Sorry, we are not 200 pilots anymore, there is no way in hell to replace 2300 pilots overnight, not even happining in a year!

i'm also concerned that NJA has turned into a bad investment to BH shareholders... WB may cut his losses and sell... word around the flight center... even heard it from an ACP. Check out BRK stocks... FEB 20th, it fell from a high of 92k a share...

I guess you missed the SEC report the company filed, in the last year we made almost an aditional $billion dollars, Total $3.42 billion! Your drinking the company kool-aid!

right now: 83,999.90. 9% loss in less than 3 months...

So your trying to tell me that WE, NJA brought shares of BRK down?? Your drinking the kool-aid again!

-concerned pilot employed by NJA as a temp desk jockey while i dig myself out of thousands in credit card debt for a useless MEI...

It's only useless if you don't use it! I think you have answered your own question!

WB bought NJA and paid a 3/4 of a billion dollars for it ( you bought a MEI) the company has, since WB bought us, spent close to $6 billion throughout the entire system (you continue to work in order to pay for your credit card debt) WB's NetJets and aviation division made $3.42 billion last year, it would be prudent to say that by this time next year revs could reach $5 billion at current trends. Now with that said why would WB want to sell a cash cow? Knowing that you have a MEI and could use it to generate money for yourself would you really consider selling, or giving back to the FAA your MEI? I don't think so.

Strikes on my friend!

 

[El Chupacabra]

if a strike does happen, i'm about 90% sure the company is not going to budge.

and i'm also pretty sure you guys may lose your jobs...

if that does happen, and you're out on the street, would you regret it?

what would you do???


​

It sure does seem they want us to Strike.
What would I do? Fly for somebody else.

 

[IFlyOU]

sorry guys, very very doubtful the company will budge.

if you go on strike, and if the company cans you, don't think that makes you eligible for unemployment.

i would beg everyone to reconsider... but it'll just fall on deaf ears.

best of luck to you all... flame on

 

[Bad Monkey!]

Now I know you are a management puke!

insert middle finger here-

 

[IFlyOU]

q: am i management?
a: no, i'm on the other end of the company triange, w/ salary less than almost all the crewmembers

q: why won't the union allow a 3rd party investigation of other fractional companies?
a: because the union wants us to look at the 3 or 4 airplane companies, not flex jet, CS, or FlightOptions. sure we can give you the same pay as the small time companies, but doing so would mean the owners would pretty much own you as well.

q: so why don't NJA, FJ, CS, and FO crewmembers make as much as the small time guys?
a: simple: because a very small handfull of people in their "casino" handle catering, travel, IFP, owner services, crew services, helpdesk and technology, schedule planning, crew planning, MX control, pager support, quality control, people department, cheif pilots (never ACP's), security, and of course, scheduling... not a couple thousand... most of these departments are rolled into 2 or 3 people. the more complex the operations get, the more people you need to have, while at the same time providing a competitive and attractive price to the owner.

q: besides management, who makes the most money at NJA?
a: helpdesk... by far

i wish it was different, but the larger the fractional company gets, the more walmart-like it becomes... seems to be the general trend anyway

edit: before you flame me, please see words depicted in bold... thx

 

[kilroy]

I hate to see anyone strike especially a fellow pilot but some one has to set an example and raise the bar for what they deserve professional salaries for professionals. We all bust our a$$es and spend to much money on getting were we are today.We can'taccept Mcdonalds wages for a profession that puts peoples lives and well being in our hands on a daily basis. They wouldn't like to think there doctor is making the same as the guy making fries when he's/she is on relying on medical treatment that might affect there life. Good luck guys I wish you the best.

 

[pilotyip]

Crossing picket line does not have to mean the death of a career

Crossing picket line does not have to mean the death of a career. There are exceptions, look at the CAL guys from 1983. Yes they may be refereed to a scabs, but they had a complete career as a major airline pilot, pay, benefits, and retirement. As stated above this is new strike territory, the outcome is not known. I elected not cross that line in 1983, because my ALPA buddies in my reserve outfit told me if I did that I would branded a scab and end up working for some non-sked at Willow Run. Here I am at YIP, and the guys who crossed had a great career.

 

[BlackPilot628]

Good Luck to you NetJets guys! You deserve everything your asking for!

 

[pilotyip]

Yes the pilots may deserve it, but that is not the question. BH has a target rate of return, if the company can not produce that rate of return, Bh does not need that company. Like I said before this is uncharted waters and no one knows where the sand bars are.

 

[El Chupacabra]

Pay attention.

There is currently a boom in business aviation. There are jobs for pilots typed with thousands of hours in the most popular business jets on the market.

I fly for MONEY not because I like to. This is not a hobby.

Those 1983 linecrossers will burn in Hell when they die. You will be going to Heaven.

 

[pilotyip]

Oh! I feel so good I have been blessed by an A-4, late model at that

 

[Ace-of-the-Base]

Church and State and NetJets

Those 1983 linecrossers will burn in Hell when they die. You will be going to Heaven.

WOW, you actually want to bring God and Heaven into this? It's just a f'ing labor dispute!!! You actually think GOD is concerned with Unions??? You think that is a factor in whether you go to Heaven or Hell???

What an idiot!

Ace

 

[h25b]

Pay attention.

There is currently a boom in business aviation. There are jobs for pilots typed with thousands of hours in the most popular business jets on the market.

I fly for MONEY not because I like to. This is not a hobby.

Those 1983 linecrossers will burn in Hell when they die. You will be going to Heaven.

Exactly the mentality I'll never understand ...

It's usually the ones that scream outloud, "I could go somewhere else and do the same thing for more money" that stick around whining.

You're claiming that you fly for MONEY while spending your time sticking with NetJets during a "boom in business aviation" and while there's jobs "for pilots typed with thousands of hours in the most popular business jets on the market." Huh ???

A hobby is an activity in which a person participates to occupy one's mind or for some type of enjoyment with no financial reward. If you're truely standing on the sidelines during this supposed "boom" you're treating your career like a hobby.

As for SCABs burning in hell ... Give me a small break please ... Go run that type of logic passed some of these "owners" of yours, see if it gets you that raise (I'll bet they're big union supporters ). Truth is people like you wouldn't last 1 week in a typical Fortune 500 flight department whose wages you desperately seek, which is why you're here da*mning the rest of the world to "hell" ...

 

[El Chupacabra]

Nobody assigned the "Rest of the World" to hell. Only the line crossers.

This does not involve you. Thanks for your opinions, you may continue to offer them, however just so you know... I am not particularly interested in them.

 

[Gulfstream 200]

Pay attention.

There is currently a boom in business aviation. There are jobs for pilots typed with thousands of hours in the most popular business jets on the market.

I fly for MONEY not because I like to. This is not a hobby.

Those 1983 linecrossers will burn in Hell when they die. You will be going to Heaven.

You fly for money? and your a NETJETS pilot?? hows that work?

You been filling jobs for 1/3 the expected wage for years....

hope nobody does that behind you during the "strike" ....that would be just terrible wouldn't it? putting someone out of work by flying for less money....

good luck.

 

[h25b]

Nobody assigned the "Rest of the World" to hell. Only the line crossers.

O.K. dude, thanks for clarifying... You make so much more sense now ...

I am not particularly interested in them.

That certainly cuts both ways pal ...

You fly for money? and your a NETJETS pilot?? hows that work?

You been filling jobs for 1/3 the expected wage for years....

hope nobody does that behind you during the "strike" ....that would be just terrible wouldn't it? putting someone out of work by flying for less money....

good luck.

LMAO ...

 

[El Chupacabra]

Good one G 200,

The sarcasm only goes to show that the Strike is justified.

see ya.

 

[Gulfstream 200]

Good one G 200,

The sarcasm only goes to show that the Strike is justified.

see ya.

yup. I agree with ya.

But it should have been done by nobody taking the job.

But....now...nobody is taking anything away from you, you already demonstrated what you are worth to a corporation - they have "the most experienced and best trained pilots in the world" --FOR 33% the PRICE!!- what a farkin bargain guys! no wonder Warren is rich..

They may come back and give you a 5-8% raise like everywhere else in the world...but why would they double your salary? This is not airline management you are dealing with - this is a profitable top company..how did they get that way?

Everyone would love to see you triple you salary, its just your arguement is non-existent (read some NJwife posts...wow) and I just cant see how a strike is going to be beneficial to the whole...

but either way, really, good luck.

 

[El Chupacabra]

Oh! I feel so good I have been blessed by an A-4, late model at that

Omni Omni VOR. I have always believed there are always paybacks. I much rather be you than anyone who who crossed the line.... I rather fly non-sched from Willow.

A few years ago I took a jumpseat on Continental. The Captain welcomed me into the cockpit. He introduced himself. I am Frank, he said. Oh this is Bill... he's a S....

Not how I would have liked to complete a career at a major.

So yes I rather be you... then Bill.

 

[casino wife]

Not real sure on this whole union/strike thing works, but doesn't the company have the option of firing everyone if they strike? If all of the pilots are fired, then there is no picket line to cross.

How can they be labeled scabs if they are now accepting a "non-union" job you no longer have?

 

[El Chupacabra]

Good question. The line will still be there.

I actually believe that is exactly the plan. When we strike everybody will be fired. We are prepared.

How long will it take to train and relese to the line 2100 pilots?

Good morning Mr Owner. I am Capt Jim. I just got my Citation X type rating yesterday. This is great. A few weeks ago the biggest plane I have ever flown before was a Cessna 441. I am not too sure how all these buttons work on the FMS. We're going green needles today.