Southwest off the runway at MDW

[SWA/FO]

You have shown us all your true colors and dont have any class either based on your previous comments. You need to learn to contain yourself, act like an adult and be respectful of others. Dont use the F word again here.

Mud Eagle..........yah, I agree with you but not in a public venue like this. There are some simple rules on this site that we out of common respect towards others should follow. What SWA/FO said was unacceptable and if you noticed, he had to change his previous F word to stars. You really shouldnt have to ask this sort of question.

For the record, I find it amazing that my choice of words was even a topic, here. By-the-way, I didn't change it..the flightinfo.com police did. This popular word (in some parts of the world) was only in honor of the few that took cheap shots at SWA.

 

[AKAAB]

Regarding the FedEx MD-11 at EWR and the misinterpretation of the runway and performance data: http://www.ntsb.gov/publictn/2000/AAR0002.pdf see paragraph 2.2.2.7 on page 60.

 

[Guitar rocker]

For the record, I find it amazing that my choice of words was even a topic, here. By-the-way, I didn't change it..the flightinfo.com police did. This popular word (in some parts of the world) was only in honor of the few that took cheap shots at SWA.

Your choice of words and your demeanor are unacceptable. I CANT believe that someone has to spell it out for you, but why cant you play by the simple rules on this site???? Have some common respect and courtesy for others. You can say whatever you want elsewhere, but here, act as an adult and try and be a professional. Even the police/mediators on this site had to take out your F word. Doesnt that tell you something?

Just because your on this site doesnt give YOU the right to use profanity. I seriously hope that the mediators stick you in that penalty box, right where you belong. If you were a big boy, you could apologize right here for using the language you did to the specific individual that was asking a simple question. My guess is that you wouldnt even think of it. Last but not least, really only one person took a cheap shot at SWA. Dont label the rest of us as having done so. We all have the crew, SWA employees and the boy that was killed in our prayers. If your going to use profanity, do it somewhere else!

 

[satpak77]

Did he have the viz?

Not a flame....trying to learn from this, lets discuss this as professionals.

Here are the METARS prior and after the accident time, obtained from

http://www.met.tamu.edu/met/Weather/weather.html

The weather observed at CHICAGO, IL (KMDW) at 04:53 PM CST was:
The skies were cloudy.
The weather reported was light snow and fog.
Temperature: 27F ( -3C) Dewpoint: 23F ( -5C) Relative Humidity: 86%
Winds from the E (090 degs) at 14 mph.
Pressure: 1021.6 millibars. Altimeter:30.12 inches of mercury.
The prevailing visibility was .75 miles.
There was 0.00 inches of precipitation in the past 6 hours.

The weather observed at CHICAGO, IL (KMDW) at 05:53 PM CST was:
The skies were unobserved.
The weather reported was moderate snow and fog.
Temperature: 26F ( -3C) Dewpoint: 24F ( -4C) Relative Humidity: 92%
Winds from the E (100 degs) at 10 mph.
Pressure: 1020.7 millibars. Altimeter:30.09 inches of mercury.
The prevailing visibility was .25 miles.
The maximum temperature in the past 6 hours was 26F.
The minimum temperature in the past 6 hours was 22F.
There was 0.00 inches of precipitation in the past 6 hours.

The weather observed at CHICAGO, IL (KMDW) at 05:53 PM CST was:
The skies were unobserved.
The weather reported was moderate snow and fog.
Temperature: 26F ( -3C) Dewpoint: 24F ( -4C) Relative Humidity: 92%
Winds from the E (100 degs) at 10 mph.
Pressure: 1020.7 millibars. Altimeter:30.09 inches of mercury.
The prevailing visibility was .25 miles.
The maximum temperature in the past 6 hours was 26F.
The minimum temperature in the past 6 hours was 22F.
There was 0.00 inches of precipitation in the past 6 hours.

The weather observed at CHICAGO, IL (KMDW) at 06:53 PM CST was:
The skies were cloudy.
The weather reported was moderate snow and fog.
Temperature: 26F ( -3C) Dewpoint: 23F ( -5C) Relative Humidity: 88%
Winds from the E (100 degs) at 13 mph.
Pressure: 1019.6 millibars. Altimeter:30.06 inches of mercury.
The prevailing visibility was .5 miles.
There was 0.00 inches of precipitation in the past 6 hours.

The weather observed at CHICAGO, IL (KMDW) at 07:53 PM CST was:
The skies were unobserved.
The weather reported was moderate snow and fog.
Temperature: 25F ( -4C) Dewpoint: 23F ( -5C) Relative Humidity: 92%
Winds from the SW (230 degs) at 3 mph.
Pressure: 1019.1 millibars. Altimeter:30.04 inches of mercury.
The prevailing visibility was .5 miles.
There was 0.00 inches of precipitation in the past 6 hours.

The weather observed at CHICAGO, IL (KMDW) at 08:53 PM CST was:
The skies were cloudy.
The weather reported was light snow and fog.
Temperature: 24F ( -4C) Dewpoint: 22F ( -6C) Relative Humidity: 91%
Winds from the SW (230 degs) at 3 mph.
Pressure: 1018.3 millibars. Altimeter:30.02 inches of mercury.
The prevailing visibility was 3 miles.
There was 0.00 inches of precipitation in the past 6 hours.

the approach plate indicates that 4000 RVR or 3/4 mile is needed for this (unless I had a brain fart and am missing something...)

http://myairplane.com/databases/approach/pdfs/00081ILD31C.PDF

again, professional comments please.....just putting this out there for discussion

If lives can be saved and accidents avoided in the future because of this, thats what is called "learning every day" in aviation

 

[FN FAL]

Refrain from giving these clowns an inch.

why would the clowns need an inch when the line pilots have already provided a mile...

http://msnbcmedia.msn.com/j/msnbc/Components/Photos/051209/051209_planecrash_runway_vmed.widec.jpg

 

[Vladimir Lenin]

http://www.kvia.com/Global/story.asp?S=4225607

 

[Donsa320]

Not a flame....trying to learn from this, lets discuss this as professionals.

Here are the METARS prior and after the accident time, obtained from

http://www.met.tamu.edu/met/Weather/weather.html

The weather observed at CHICAGO, IL (KMDW) at 04:53 PM CST was:
The skies were cloudy.
The weather reported was light snow and fog.
Temperature: 27F ( -3C) Dewpoint: 23F ( -5C) Relative Humidity: 86%
Winds from the E (090 degs) at 14 mph.
Pressure: 1021.6 millibars. Altimeter:30.12 inches of mercury.
The prevailing visibility was .75 miles.
There was 0.00 inches of precipitation in the past 6 hours.

The weather observed at CHICAGO, IL (KMDW) at 05:53 PM CST was:
The skies were unobserved.
The weather reported was moderate snow and fog.
Temperature: 26F ( -3C) Dewpoint: 24F ( -4C) Relative Humidity: 92%
Winds from the E (100 degs) at 10 mph.
Pressure: 1020.7 millibars. Altimeter:30.09 inches of mercury.
The prevailing visibility was .25 miles.
The maximum temperature in the past 6 hours was 26F.
The minimum temperature in the past 6 hours was 22F.
There was 0.00 inches of precipitation in the past 6 hours.

The weather observed at CHICAGO, IL (KMDW) at 05:53 PM CST was:
The skies were unobserved.
The weather reported was moderate snow and fog.
Temperature: 26F ( -3C) Dewpoint: 24F ( -4C) Relative Humidity: 92%
Winds from the E (100 degs) at 10 mph.
Pressure: 1020.7 millibars. Altimeter:30.09 inches of mercury.
The prevailing visibility was .25 miles.
The maximum temperature in the past 6 hours was 26F.
The minimum temperature in the past 6 hours was 22F.
There was 0.00 inches of precipitation in the past 6 hours.

The weather observed at CHICAGO, IL (KMDW) at 06:53 PM CST was:
The skies were cloudy.
The weather reported was moderate snow and fog.
Temperature: 26F ( -3C) Dewpoint: 23F ( -5C) Relative Humidity: 88%
Winds from the E (100 degs) at 13 mph.
Pressure: 1019.6 millibars. Altimeter:30.06 inches of mercury.
The prevailing visibility was .5 miles.
There was 0.00 inches of precipitation in the past 6 hours.

The weather observed at CHICAGO, IL (KMDW) at 07:53 PM CST was:
The skies were unobserved.
The weather reported was moderate snow and fog.
Temperature: 25F ( -4C) Dewpoint: 23F ( -5C) Relative Humidity: 92%
Winds from the SW (230 degs) at 3 mph.
Pressure: 1019.1 millibars. Altimeter:30.04 inches of mercury.
The prevailing visibility was .5 miles.
There was 0.00 inches of precipitation in the past 6 hours.

The weather observed at CHICAGO, IL (KMDW) at 08:53 PM CST was:
The skies were cloudy.
The weather reported was light snow and fog.
Temperature: 24F ( -4C) Dewpoint: 22F ( -6C) Relative Humidity: 91%
Winds from the SW (230 degs) at 3 mph.
Pressure: 1018.3 millibars. Altimeter:30.02 inches of mercury.
The prevailing visibility was 3 miles.
There was 0.00 inches of precipitation in the past 6 hours.

the approach plate indicates that 4000 RVR or 3/4 mile is needed for this (unless I had a brain fart and am missing something...)

http://myairplane.com/databases/approach/pdfs/00081ILD31C.PDF

again, professional comments please.....just putting this out there for discussion

If lives can be saved and accidents avoided in the future because of this, thats what is called "learning every day" in aviation

We'll have to see what the tower gave him as he approached the Final Approach segment but I've heard that SWA has a Heads Up Display in that airplane which gave him special minimums of 3000ft RVR. Or the RVR was 4000ft when he started the approach. It'll come out in the investigation.

DC

 

[banned username 1]

OK everybody, now that we've vented and taken our shots and armchair quarterbacked and analyzed this accident to death from our vantage points from afar, let's be done.

We're seeing all of the traits of a pilot coming into play here: irreverance, curiosity, empathy, ego, and a large helping of pig-headdedness.

I think all sides have had their say and this thread could be a learning experience for everyone involved when sadly, this sort of thing happens again. It's an example of how to, and NOT how to contribute to a dialog.

What we're after here on these forums is looking for more "light" and less "heat". That would be a better use of our time. Someone looking to sucker punch a guy when he's down has my personal invitation to participate somewhere else. We're all professionals and as such means it's incumbent to act that way.

Frankly, you've beaten this subject to death given the amount of information that you have. It's not fun for the guys who we involved to see the second-guessing, nor for the guys who know them to see it either- especially when everybody's credentials are only as good as their honesty in their profile.

The more experience you have, the faster you'll not be drawn into commenting specifically about an accident like this, because you know that you don't have all the information. You'll also not comment because you've done things in your career where you know you did everything right and still came out with a less-than-anticipated outcome. But perhaps the biggest reason you'll shy away is because you've learned that sometimes s___ does actually happen.

Please, let's leave the heat behind now and concentrate on the light.

Thanks
UAL78

 

[SuperFLUF]

I respect your SOP's and can understand your statement. Can you just tell me do you guys use Auto-Brakes?

According to the 737-700 flight manual, in all braking conditions, max manual braking allows for a quicker stop than max autobrakes. So this is a moot point.

 

[A Squared]

Heavier aircraft, better braking abilities, and more powerful reverse thrust.

As an aside, being heavier desn't help. The increase in braking force due to additional weight is exactly negated by the additional inertia from the additional weight. Other things like reverse, ground spoilers, antiskid obviously do help.