Southwest Airlines Expands Atlanta Service With Two New Nonstop Destinations

[Dan Roman]

Can anybody name more than one ALpA carrier that hasn't been through at least one bankruptcy? I think ALpA is batting 100% on bankrupt carriers.

What profound ignorance that you somehow equate legacy carriers going through bankruptcy as an ALPA weakness? Had it not been for ALPA, the pilots would have been hammered even harder while various managements abused the BK courts. Had it not been foe ALPA salvaging what they could, carriers like SWA would be competing with airlines with even cheaper labor costs. You could even make a case that pilots going to work at LCC's like SWA and working longer hours for less pay while being willing to forego traditional retirement plans is what the legacies have had to deal with and has been the reason our profession has slipped backwards after years and years of gains made by the ALPA carriers.

 

[Dan Roman]

March 10, 2012; 4 SWA/AAI 737s non-stop to Vegas vs. 3 DAL 767-300's and 5 DAL 757-200s. I guess that's fights on, if that's what you're looking for.

Just remember, fare wars hurt the profit-sharing checks, but not the exec pay.

It's kind of sad that our profession has descended to pilots thinking kicking each others ass is a positive thing. Thank you SWAPA.

 

[Dan Roman]

Sure do. What's that got to do with anything? You realize you have been around a fraction of the time most airlines were building the current air traffic infrastructure don't you? You realize you guys were signing 10 year substandard contracts while big airlines were trying to better the pay and work rules for the industry don't you?

Sorry, no ill will toward most SWA employees. Just some of the self-righteous jackasses that seem to be prevalent lately.

I just got out of the water at Sunset Point and had 2 glasses of wine, you said it better than I.

 

[waveflyer]

I'll concede that SWA coming to ATL is an annoyance to DAL.

I'll concede that DAL would prefer that SWA not operate in ATL.

That being said, ATL is ATL because of DAL and their route network. It really could have been just about anywhere in the region.

Take out DAL and what ATL really is...the part that SWA is competing for, is just another 500k large O&D market. Right between Tucson and Albuquerque

The passenger that is flying from MCO-LHR via ATL is not going to all of a sudden be fying on SWA, regardless of how funny your FA PAs are.

With that it mind, it is hard to imagine SWA CRUSHING Delta when you won't even be competing for the majority of the passengers.

The bigger CRUSHING possiblity comes from the passenger that chooses to go MCO-DAL-LAX vs MCO-ATL-LAX. But that has always been there and has nothing to do with SWA getting into ATL.

Later

I agree with much of what you said- Atlanta city limits are relatively small- but business wise its largerthan it's population- and you have to see how that interacts w/ swa's desire to attain more business travel. With so many fortune 500 companies based in ATL- we can't ignore it.
ATL does have only about 500,000 people- small- but it's ranked 8th as an economic center in the US. It's also ranked 8 in terms of GDP per capita. Now multiply that by all the US population that does business in ATL.

List of cities by GDP

This is a list of the richest cities and/or their metropolitan areas in the world by GDP according to PricewaterhouseCoopers[1] and other sources.

For cities in the OECD, data are based on city-level GDP per capita estimates on 2002 data from the OECD’s Competitive Cities report (2006), projected forward by PricewaterhouseCoopers to 2008. For non-OECD cities, data are not readily available from a single source. In some cases GDP per capita estimates at city level were available from national sources, but in many cases PricewaterhouseCoopers was only able to make approximate estimates based on plausible ratios of city-to-national GDP per capita.[1]

As such, the 2008 urban agglomeration GDP estimates should only be taken as broadly indicative of relative economic size of these cities in both OECD and non-OECD countries, as through PricewaterhouseCooper's methods only. Other surveys and methodologies, such as surveys from national governments, or other private companies were not taken into account when this list was compiled.

Show List of cities in the world by GDP

Show Top 5 per region

Show Top 10 cities in the European Union

Hide Top 10 cities in the United States

Rank City State GDP in $ID B Population M GDP per capita $ID K Area
1 New York City *****New York $ 1,466 19.25 $ 78.6 M
2 Los Angeles *****California $ 792 12.22 $ 64.8 M
3 Chicago *****Illinois $ 574 9.80 $ 58.6 M
4 Philadelphia *****Pennsylvania $ 388 5.36 $ 72.4 M
5 Washington, D.C. *****District of Columbia $ 375 4.25 $ 88.2 M
6 Boston *****Massachusetts $ 338 4.72 $ 71.6
7 Dallas *****Texas $ 304 4.47 $ 68.0
8 Atlanta *****Georgia (U.S. state) $ 301 3.36 $ 89.6 C
9 San Francisco *****California $ 297 4.39 $ 67.7 M
10 Houston *****Texas $ 292 4.47

 

[Jay Jay]

Haven't really competed directly against them that much. Other than some SLC flying...very little direct overlap.

Some- really? I think Delta has seen this before. Just a refresher-

Morris Air was a low-fare airline based in Salt Lake City, Utah, USA. It began operations in 1992. It was sold to Southwest Airlines in December 1993 for over $130 million.[1] The airline officially became part of Southwest in Summer 1994.

You really crushed Delta with that purchase, how many departures do you have from your previous staple job's hub? (35). Most of you SW A-holes seem to suffer from a severe case of arrogance and are a little delusional.

 

[slaquer5]

March 10, 2012; 4 SWA/AAI 737s non-stop to Vegas vs. 3 DAL 767-300's and 5 DAL 757-200s. I guess that's fights on, if that's what you're looking for.

Just remember, fare wars hurt the profit-sharing checks, but not the exec pay.

You might want to visit economics. A fare war, when one is making money,the other ,loosing money, is good business .



PS Dan R. I see your hate SWA is strong as ever. You might want to get out and enjoy life. All I see is post after post from you,sometimes 3 in a row

 

[redflyer65]

Some- really? I think Delta has seen this before. Just a refresher-

Morris Air was a low-fare airline based in Salt Lake City, Utah, USA. It began operations in 1992. It was sold to Southwest Airlines in December 1993 for over $130 million.[1] The airline officially became part of Southwest in Summer 1994.

You really crushed Delta with that purchase, how many departures do you have from your previous staple job's hub? (35). Most of you SW A-holes seem to suffer from a severe case of arrogance and are a little delusional.

Jay,

Morris had 20 planes...that's it. I wouldn't say a big operation. As a matter of fact, the cost of 130 million was thought to be high for what SW got.

As for SLC...other than ski season, there just isn't alot of O&D traffic there. Southwest isn't going to throw resources at a city if it can't support it(you know, to make money). The Delta operation is mostly connecting flights......mostly on RJ's. It's very similiar to Memphis for Delta, but MEM is worse. Not a dig a Delta, but it is what it is.

 

[fareview]

Dont have a dog in this fight BUT..

Not an objective mind in the industry that could say this is good for DAL.

Two free checked bags, cheap fares and friendly FA'a...

Gonna be fugly down the road for DAL - because if anyone thinks that this is anything but the beginning of a major assualt on the hub, you are sorely mistaken -(cue AAI).

And before you launch attack, all my buds are at DAL.

Sorry boys - strap yourselves in.

fv

 

[737 Driver]

What profound ignorance that you somehow equate legacy carriers going through bankruptcy as an ALPA weakness? Had it not been for ALPA, the pilots would have been hammered even harder while various managements abused the BK courts. Had it not been foe ALPA salvaging what they could, carriers like SWA would be competing with airlines with even cheaper labor costs. You could even make a case that pilots going to work at LCC's like SWA and working longer hours for less pay while being willing to forego traditional retirement plans is what the legacies have had to deal with and has been the reason our profession has slipped backwards after years and years of gains made by the ALPA carriers.

So other than AirTran and Alaska, are there any other ALpA carriers bankruptcy-free with happy employees? Many carriers have shed union contracts, including ALpA contracts by going into bankruptcy because their costs and spending was too high. How many ALpA carriers have never furloughed? These are not bellwethers for future ALpA contracts but it does display ALpA doesn't save the industry.

I also think your ALpA "traditional " retirement plan thingy isn't working so well for the retired UAL and UsAirway dudes. I'm certain many of those retired/broke pilots would have worked longer hours for less pay to have control of their retirement plan. ALpA usually has inefficient work rules that cost the company money requiring the company to hire more pilots but there is up side for ALpA, more pilot$ mean$ more in due$.

'I have to beat my wife or she'd be totally out of control.' Is that how ALpA "strength" that saves both pilots jobs and the rest of airline industry?

Your ALpA mahantra has a couple holes in it. I've paid ALpA dues and ALpa does a few things(safety and medical) well but helping pilots keep their jobs by working with the companies for long term employment, they are not so good. The length of job is suppose to be a marathon not a sprint. ALpA does have a shiny magazine!

Don't get all pissy, I'm just pointing out a couple negative points about your beloved union.

 

[nwaf16dude]

You might want to visit economics. A fare war, when one is making money,the other ,loosing money, is good business .



PS Dan R. I see your hate SWA is strong as ever. You might want to get out and enjoy life. All I see is post after post from you,sometimes 3 in a row

That may be true, but my point is still valid. Your profit sharing check will be smaller than it could have been if your company didn't start a fare war. It may be a moot point though; so far the fares on the competing routes look to be about the same or higher than the market is currently charging.

 

[737 Driver]

That may be true, but my point is still valid. Your profit sharing check will be smaller than it could have been if your company didn't start a fare war. It may be a moot point though; so far the fares on the competing routes look to be about the same or higher than the market is currently charging.

I'd take a big fat zero profit sharing check for the next nineteen years if I have a paycheck clear, from the same employer, on the 5th and the 20th.

For me, this job is about long term employment. This career is a marathon, not a sprint!

 

[Grandpa +65]

Dont have a dog in this fight BUT..

Not an objective mind in the industry that could say this is good for DAL.

Two free checked bags, cheap fares and friendly FA'a...

Gonna be fugly down the road for DAL - because if anyone thinks that this is anything but the beginning of a major assualt on the hub, you are sorely mistaken -(cue AAI).

And before you launch attack, all my buds are at DAL.

Sorry boys - strap yourselves in.

fv

Really?? Cheap fares!. SWA is no longer considered a discount airlines. In fact, most of its regular fares are more expensive than other major airlines.

 

[Capn Butthead]

Grandpa...you are correct until you do the math...by looking at straight fares we are often higher. But you add all of the fees and we are usually the lowest by far. That is a fact. And when the new stupid passenger bill of rights pass all airlines will have to show their fees up front. Good for swa not so much for others.

 

[SLUF4]

Dont have a dog in this fight BUT..

Not an objective mind in the industry that could say this is good for DAL.

Two free checked bags, cheap fares and friendly FA'a...

Gonna be fugly down the road for DAL - because if anyone thinks that this is anything but the beginning of a major assualt on the hub, you are sorely mistaken -(cue AAI).

And before you launch attack, all my buds are at DAL.

Sorry boys - strap yourselves in.

fv

we'll see how well people like them when crews write everything up and taxi slow because they're mad at SWA. Also good luck with 30 minute turns in ATL.

 

[e=mc2]

So the Delta and AAI response to this is screw the passenger?

Typical and the reason people love SWA.

 

[jonjuan]

Grandpa...you are correct until you do the math...by looking at straight fares we are often higher. But you add all of the fees and we are usually the lowest by far. That is a fact. And when the new stupid passenger bill of rights pass all airlines will have to show their fees up front. Good for swa not so much for others.

Unless you have a credit card or are a frequent flyer which gives you free bags (i.e., no fees), hundreds of clubs around the country (even walked by and seen how packed they are = popular with business dudes), assigned seats, ability to fly F, fly international, etc, etc...Thems are facts.

http://travel.usatoday.com/flights/post/2011/09/southwest-delta-us-airways-slot-swap/545616/1

Southwest cries over "anti-competitive" slot swap. :smash:

 

[Dan Roman]

You might want to visit economics. A fare war, when one is making money,the other ,loosing money, is good business .



PS Dan R. I see your hate SWA is strong as ever. You might want to get out and enjoy life. All I see is post after post from you,sometimes 3 in a row

Funny you should say that when my third post was saying to noserider that I just got out of the water ( Judging from his avatar I'm sure he knows were Sunset is) and had two glasses of wine!

I don't hate SWA at all. I've met plenty of good SWA folks over the years. Just as many good people there as any other airline. But like so many on here I'm pretty tired of the arrogance. You guys rival UAL in the 90's.
Just because someone doesn't agree with you it doesn't mean they hate you.

 

[Whataburger]

Really?? Cheap fares!. SWA is no longer considered a discount airlines. In fact, most of its regular fares are more expensive than other major airlines.

Shhhhhh!! You're not supposed to tell anyone.

 

[Grandpa +65]

Shhhhhh!! You're not supposed to tell anyone.

Don’t worry, I won’t.

 

[Noserider76]

I just got out of the water at Sunset Point and had 2 glasses of wine, you said it better than I.

Nice!!! Lucky dude.