SkyWest - USA Today

[~~~^~~~]

This is about unity.

You either want to be a member of a greater group trying to promote your profession, or you don't.

Those of you who have known "Fins" on this board know that I have been very critical of ALPA's errors. If there was a good reason for a SkyWest pilot to not want ALPA representation, I would make that arguement. No such arguement exists.

SkyWest pilots have a chance to join the greater good for their profession that I think far surpasses individual reasons for wanting to "save" a insignificant amount of dues money.

If SAPA was interested in serving the SkyWest pilots they would have provided leadership on this issue. Specifically the SkyWest pilots could benefit by forcing ALPA to make certain promises (as FedEx did when they joined ALPA).

Fact is, ALPA is a force in this business. Being a member of the club helps. It really helps if the forecasts for RJ flying decreasing are correct. It is hoped that ALPA has learned lessons from the disabling arrogance it has shown in the past and becomes a more inclusive union.

If that is the case, a SkyWest pilot group does not want to have excluded themselves from negotiations where an inclusive union is negotiating to protect its' members' interests.

The dues are cheap admission to the club and a bargain for what you get.

 

[~~~^~~~]

My point there was ALPA is suppose to be a union!! Where the hell was the unity then!!

Remember........ ALPA is a political machine!!!

You make an excellent point.

Going forward, ALPA will benefit by more political power being evenly distributed and SkyWest's vote can help balance things out.

 

[XPOO]

How do you know what pilots want XPOO, the only contact you ever have with them are when they call and tell you to put more fuel on.

You guys are hilarious. Sorry, never went to flight school, never wanted to be a pilot. High school aptitude tests showed that I lacked the required god-complex and self-righteousness in order to sit behind a mic and metal stick all day with another person in a cramped space bitching about no APU or an autopilot deferred, while also having to beg my dispatcher for another 5 minutes of fuel on my way to LAN where the weather is P6SM SKC. Also, my back would never be able to put up with a different hotel bed every night. I'm also pretty sure my skin couldn't withstand the amount of radiation a pilot gets subjected to flying around all day. Let alone, I'm definately sure my heart couldn't withstand the amount of stress envolved in worrying about the next management carrot hanging over my head as if the amount of money the company pays me is the lone deciding factor on if the airline is going to turn a profit or not. I've just never been able to put myself ahead of anyone else they way you guys can. That's why I dispatch, this way I can help 20-30 of you pilots out at the same time. This way I can get you to your overnight on time, so you'll have more time to hit on that hot flight attendant while your away from teh wifey on a 4-day. You'll be well-rested and ready to go the next day. I'd much rather just sit back and be the Teller to your Penn. I'll be the guy that sets you up to look good day in and day out, so you can go to management and thump your chest and tell them how valuable YOU are to the company and how much more money YOU need to make. We in dispatch support the pilots, its good to see you guy could care less about us. I can do my job without you, its you who can't do your job without me.

 

[PBRstreetgang]

That must make you part of the "vocal minority group of selfish, self serving clowns who want" ALPA, then right? Because there's no way ALPA would ever be the minority. I mean SkyWest has never had a minority of the pilots vote for them. NEVER, right?

You finally are right, I have been one of those for more than one union drive. I just happened to see the writing on the wall before some of the others. As far as being greedy, you bet! Who wouldn't want more money, better days off and a set of work rules that remains intact between contracts. In fact if we unionize I will be the first to vote to take more money from the company and would prefer to take it from you personally. If that causes you to not be able to attend the next NAMBLA conference, so be it. I guess if you save real hard, really hard you can go to the airport and learn to fly, instead of the MS flight sim on your PC. But guess what, you don't fly and most likely couldn't. Now quit being a wanna be and start planning for your next trip to hang with the NAMBLA fellas.
PBR

 

[SpyFlysDOTs]

What an goof.

 

[PBRstreetgang]

I'm also pretty sure my skin couldn't withstand the amount of radiation a pilot gets subjected to flying around all day.

LOL,
From a "guy" who lives down wind from the largest US nuclear above ground testing area. Howz that extra arm in the center of you back working out? Bet it doesn't help with the keyboard, but I bet it is pure magic for scratching your a$$ crack though!
PBR

 

[XPOO]

Haha, I used the NAMBLA thing on you yesterday and now you wanna come to the thread and throw it out there like you thought it up to begin with? Why are you Pile-Its so unoriginal?

 

[siucavflight]

You got to be kidding me, I could not do my job without you? I flew 91 for a long time, you know who did the dispatching then, me, you see I can do both of our jobs, you can only do one of them.

 

[SpyFlysDOTs]

How many days is a dispatchers training?
How many thousands of hours of flight time does one have prior to application?
If you follow the company line, they in fact say, employees should try and advance to a job of greater pay within the company.
There are a few rampers, to FAs, to FOs to Capts in our business. I gather to guess, there are probably even a few Dispatchers to FO to Capts.
Your insults show lack of class.
Your posts show lack of education.

 

[XPOO]

LOL,
From a "guy" who lives down wind from the largest US nuclear above ground testing area. Howz that extra arm in the center of you back working out? Bet it doesn't help with the keyboard, but I bet it is pure magic for scratching your a$$ crack though!
PBR

Are you trying to say that I was alive back in the 1940's? Are we talking about phantom radiation that just somehow is still magically floating in the air around here? Let me know how those melanoma treatments go in few years, ok?

 

[PBRstreetgang]

You guys are hilarious. I can do my job without you, its you who can't do your job without me.

You are right you can do your job without pilots, it's called working welfare. You are to aviation as teats are to a boar hog. If you wanna see you future in aviation, research careers for flight engineers.
Enjoy that welfare!
PBR

 

[XPOO]

You got to be kidding me, I could not do my job without you? I flew 91 for a long time, you know who did the dispatching then, me, you see I can do both of our jobs, you can only do one of them.

Oh sorry, I thought maybe you moved up the ladder of success to part 121 operations. Let me see you do a 121 flight without a dispatcher name on your release, then we'll talk.

 

[XPOO]

You are right you can do your job without pilots, it's called working welfare. You are to aviation as teats are to a boar hog. If you wanna see you future in aviation, research careers for flight engineers.
Enjoy that welfare!
PBR

Enjoy all those swaps and reduced rests. Courtesy of you know who!

 

[PBRstreetgang]

Are you trying to say that I was alive back in the 1940's? Are we talking about phantom radiation that just somehow is still magically floating in the air around here? Let me know how those melanoma treatments go in few years, ok?

Nahhha,
That stuff has a half life of 10 minutes or so, so don't worry about it. Above ground testing, downwind ect.
Plutonium, uranium ect. Melanoma, in a few years I will have enough to retire, hopefully after the union drive I will have even more(off of your paycheck). I am thinking about a house in the Bahamas or a 50-60 ft sailboat.
PBR

 

[Exskydiverdrivr]

X-cerpt from X-Poo-in a cramped space bitching about no APU or an autopilot deferred, while also having to beg my dispatcher for another 5 minutes of fuel on my way to LAN where the weather is P6SM SKC. Also, my back would never be able to put up with a different hotel bed every night. I'm also pretty sure my skin couldn't withstand the amount of (radiation) a pilot gets subjected to flying around all day. Let alone, I'm definately sure my heart couldn't withstand the amount of stress envolved in worrying about the next management carrot .

And you still wonder why some folks are trying to make their lives a little better? Try sitting in a full plane on the ramp for an hour with no APU my friend. Listen to the hostility of the pax towards your FA. Your a dispatcher dude and I can respect what you do. You however, seem to be viewing us as a bunch of prima-donnas. Walk a mile in our shoes, as the saying goes..

 

[XPOO]

Can't wait until ALPA steps in and finally, magically fixes all those pesky little APU's and somehow gets the FAA to enact an FAR making an autopilot deferred aircraft a no-go item. Hell, I can't even wait for ALPA to fix all those darn little aircraft swaps and I'll bet with ALPA's help we can eliminate flow programs altogether. And with ALPA's help you can all fill the tanks to the brim with fuel and go where ever you want. Yes an ALPA filled life will be so grand, it'll make you all wanna say golly-gee jeepers that sure it swell.

 

[PBRstreetgang]

Go back to cubicle!
PBR

 

[XPOO]

Get back in your right seat!

 

[siucavflight]

Well XPOO for whats its worth, I do have my dispatchers license, not that I have ever used it, so yes technically I could do your job, while you could not do mine.
And why do you think that ALPA has anything to do with APUs, or fuel? It has everything to do with enforcing a contract and protecting your job, thats it, thats what they do. They dont have anything to do with aircraft swaps either, are you really this uninformed?

 

[yellowfever]

Can't wait until ALPA steps in and finally, magically fixes all those pesky little APU's and somehow gets the FAA to enact an FAR making an autopilot deferred aircraft a no-go item. Hell, I can't even wait for ALPA to fix all those darn little aircraft swaps and I'll bet with ALPA's help we can eliminate flow programs altogether. And with ALPA's help you can all fill the tanks to the brim with fuel and go where ever you want. Yes an ALPA filled life will be so grand, it'll make you all wanna say golly-gee jeepers that sure it swell.

I don't ever remember hearing guys on the ALPA Organizing Commitee saying ALPA will fix this stuff. They want a contract so that things don't continue to spiral downward while the company rakes money in hand over fist. Have you ever experienced a regional airline pilots lifestyle?

 

[XPOO]

Look, PBR has a hard-on for me or something and came in and flamed me first. He has for the longest time now. But now you all want to come in and bash, why? Because I'm not going to rollover and let you win? So in your mind being a pilot is far superior to being a dispatcher? Well, thats you. You can make fun of my profession all you want. See, you are all the first one's to attack my ability to dispatch. But I never attack any of your abilities as pilots. Whose being more childish? I have never and currently dont want to be a pilot. And seriously, if being a pilot means having to act like you guys, I'll never want to be a pilot. Having a dispatch license and actually dispatching are two different things. Possessing a license just entitles you to legally put your name on a release. When DEN shuts down for two days affecting every other hub, lets see you step in and pick up the pieces and get everyone and every plane where they need to be and start all over again. I'm sure you learned how to do that to obtain your license right?

 

[John Pennekamp]

XPOO,

Look, man, sometimes we agree, sometimes we disagree, sometimes we share a laugh, and sometimes we make fun of each other. But in this argument you're wrong.

You're defending a bad position, and you have no evidence to back your argument up. You're arguing something that is frankly, none of your affair. We at ASA have union DXs. When y'all look into PAFCA, then we'll include you in this discussion.

And let's ALL stop with the pilot/DX superiority complex too. We both know we need each other.

 

[yellowfever]

Look, PBR has a hard-on for me or something and came in and flamed me first. He has for the longest time now. But now you all want to come in and bash, why? Because I'm not going to rollover and let you win? So in your mind being a pilot is far superior to being a dispatcher? Well, thats you. You can make fun of my profession all you want. See, you are all the first one's to attack my ability to dispatch. But I never attack any of your abilities as pilots. Whose being more childish? I have never and currently dont want to be a pilot. And seriously, if being a pilot means having to act like you guys, I'll never want to be a pilot. Having a dispatch license and actually dispatching are two different things. Possessing a license just entitles you to legally put your name on a release. When DEN shuts down for two days affecting every other hub, lets see you step in and pick up the pieces and get everyone and every plane where they need to be and start all over again. I'm sure you learned how to do that to obtain your license right?

I never dissed your profession. I just asked if you had ever experienced the lifestyle that regional pilots do. It's harder than some people think. Skywest has been making hundreds of millions of dollars at the same time SKWY pilots pay and quality of life are backsliding. They have made some of this money on the backs of labor who they deceived with broken promises. I could list all of the policy violations and broken promises, but I'm sure you could search for them here on FI. Anyone who takes pride in their profession should be ashamed of a company that only offered them a 1% / 0% pay raise.

 

[siucavflight]

XPOO, I think what rubs everyone the wrong way is that you are so worried about something that does not affect you. The ALPA vote is something that is up to your pilots, some of them want to do something to help themselves out. Why do you get so angry about it, why are you so anti-union? ALPA is a good thing and will be good for your pilots, why not leave it alone, it is not your fight.

 

[Redan]

Airline Pilots Must Take the Iniative to Look Out for Themselves

You guys are hilarious. Sorry, never went to flight school, never wanted to be a pilot. High school aptitude tests showed that I lacked the required god-complex and self-righteousness in order to sit behind a mic and metal stick all day with another person in a cramped space bitching about no APU or an autopilot deferred, while also having to beg my dispatcher for another 5 minutes of fuel on my way to LAN where the weather is P6SM SKC. Also, my back would never be able to put up with a different hotel bed every night. I'm also pretty sure my skin couldn't withstand the amount of radiation a pilot gets subjected to flying around all day. Let alone, I'm definately sure my heart couldn't withstand the amount of stress envolved in worrying about the next management carrot hanging over my head as if the amount of money the company pays me is the lone deciding factor on if the airline is going to turn a profit or not. I've just never been able to put myself ahead of anyone else they way you guys can. That's why I dispatch, this way I can help 20-30 of you pilots out at the same time. This way I can get you to your overnight on time, so you'll have more time to hit on that hot flight attendant while your away from teh wifey on a 4-day. You'll be well-rested and ready to go the next day. I'd much rather just sit back and be the Teller to your Penn. I'll be the guy that sets you up to look good day in and day out, so you can go to management and thump your chest and tell them how valuable YOU are to the company and how much more money YOU need to make. We in dispatch support the pilots, its good to see you guy could care less about us. I can do my job without you, its you who can't do your job without me.

These comments, as well as the majority I see from this person, reflect the perspective of many or most who have never taken a seat on a flight deck. Just as a soldier who has experienced combat finds it difficult or impossible to relate the experience to others, and will usually give up trying, an airline pilot typically will do the same thing. The experiences can truly only be conveyed to fellow pilots.

Just as this person will consider the pilots to be spoiled, whiny crybabys, others outside the profession, perhaps most including the majority of other airline employees and management, probably feel the same way. These outsiders are not the ones taking the $20+ million jet six miles into the stratosphere with 50 plus passengers. These folks are not the ones facing a CAT II night approach in a multiple MEL'd jet after five or six legs, nearing the end of a 14+ hour day. These folks do not have the career committment at stake that a pilot does. I'm sure we all are well aware that outsiders to the pilot profession do not have the perspective of the committment required to fly, even at the regional level.


As I sat in the jet the other morning at one o'clock proof-reading a dispatch with multiple discrepancies, and trying to explain to the dispatcher how arriving at our destination with its single 10,000 foot runway, at that hour, with minimum fuel, and a deferral requiring a runway of that length was maybe not a good idea. How according to forecasts on his dispatch, yes we did also need an alternate for weather. And unfortunately, how the performance figures he's provided present us with a terribly difficult weight and balance problem. And yes, the dispatch will need to reflect the correct crew names.
It was apparent the dispatcher was becoming impatient with me. He most likely did consider me to be a whiny crybaby. What I have learned at this point, is that I cannot expect others to share a pilot's perspective. Just as the combat soldier returning from the conflict can't expect others the share his perspective...not even other soldiers who've yet to experience combat. Others, including airline employees, simply don't appreciate ours, especially management. If an accident occurs, even if it results in the airline being shut down, you can rest asssured all in management will have generously provided for themselves and their families after any eventuality.

There simply are very few professions which hold so many potholes. A minor paperwork oversight can be career ending. Not even a neurosurgeon faces the level of scrutiny an airline pilot does...he doesn't have the PRIA, threat of a Fed showing up at any moment, or multiple checking events in a year. This, my friends, is why I have no intention of becoming employed at a carrier without representation BY PILOTS AND FOR PILOTS. Additionally, this is why I feel, as others have suggested, that this person calling himself XPOO or whatever, who claims to be a dispatcher would be respectfully advised and requested to discontinue trolling pilot threads and limit his numerous and voluminous comments to subjects pertaining to himself and his profession.

 

[XPOO]

Your right, it's not like we all work for the same company or anything. I'm sure all those people that deliver brand new Chryslers as they roll off the assembly line are sitting at home not worried about a thing right now. Not at all. Because it's not their fight, and it could never affect them, right?

 

[siucavflight]

XPOO, then tell me how will it affect you, why are you scared of a union at OO, I was seeing a girl who works for OO as a CS trainer, and she is also very scared of the pilots organizing, what do you see being the negative of having ALPA?

 

[PCL_128]

And let's ALL stop with the pilot/DX superiority complex too. We both know we need each other.

Exactly. There's no need to be attacking dispatchers in general. These guys have a job to do, and there's no reason for us to be attacking their profession.

If you want to attack XPOO, then there's plenty of ways to do it without attacking his entire profession. He's just a dumbass. That's all there is to it. He's completely ignorant about this subject. He's spouting all kinds of incorrect information. Attack him on that basis. Don't bring his entire profession under attack. There are good dispatchers out there that do a great job, and yes, there are even plenty of unionized dispatchers out there.

 

[DontFeedTheBear]

XPOO,

Look, man, sometimes we agree, sometimes we disagree, sometimes we share a laugh, and sometimes we make fun of each other. But in this argument you're wrong.

You're defending a bad position, and you have no evidence to back your argument up. You're arguing something that is frankly, none of your affair. We at ASA have union DXs. When y'all look into PAFCA, then we'll include you in this discussion.

And let's ALL stop with the pilot/DX superiority complex too. We both know we need each other.

I wonder if he is trying to keep his job just a bit easier. If ALPA or any union is on property, SKYW pilots will actually say "NO" to some flights that they do not feel comfortable with. Right now, if mngmt says fly it, most do just that.

Yogi

 

[XPOO]

XPOO,

Look, man, sometimes we agree, sometimes we disagree, sometimes we share a laugh, and sometimes we make fun of each other. But in this argument you're wrong.

You're defending a bad position, and you have no evidence to back your argument up. You're arguing something that is frankly, none of your affair. We at ASA have union DXs. When y'all look into PAFCA, then we'll include you in this discussion.

And let's ALL stop with the pilot/DX superiority complex too. We both know we need each other.

John,

I respect you and your opinions, but I guess since I work for an un-unionized dispatch center we'll never see eye-to-eye. Sorry you feel you have to segregate us that way.