Skywest may finally have a reasonable chance of voting a union in...

120% Torque

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http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=20601103&sid=aCke89dDAcbU

This policy change will not allow the apathetic pilots that never take time to find out whats going on to hurt a vote. Also it will make it more difficult for the David Livingstons under the direction of Ford/Harrison to parrot "dont pick up the phone".

The majority of those who vote yes or no will decide but you have to vote to be counted as a yes or a no. Good news!
 

MYFpilot

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I think we may have a pretty good chance of at least certifying SAPA. The "we have it better over here" mentality is rapidly changing at SkyWest. I know we are in the great recession but the erosion of benefits and quality of life here over the last year or so have been enormous.

Thanks for all you do
 

NoJoy

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Whatever you do, don't vote in ALPA!
 

Cuban B.

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Carriers have de facto corporate unions in the form of the ATA and RAA. Why should we not have an organization protecting our interests? It seems like a bit of a double standard.
 

Ben Dover

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I think we may have a pretty good chance of at least certifying SAPA. The "we have it better over here" mentality is rapidly changing at SkyWest. I know we are in the great recession but the erosion of benefits and quality of life here over the last year or so have been enormous.

Thanks for all you do
While most of what you say is true. I'm wondering why you think THIS TIME management has gone too far? Management has a long and successful track record of screwing the employees just enough to make them mad, but not enough for employees to do anything about it.

Clearly management HAS gone too far, but the bottom line is the score is about 10 - 0 in favor of mgmt. You'd have to be a sucker to bet that employees will actually take any action.
 

LazyLightnin'

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....to be voted off every regional carriers property and get their own representation that looks out for their interests. Not ALPA's.
I may have never met you before, and I know I'm totally sh!tfaced at the time, but I think I have my first bro-mance.
 

sstearns2

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http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=20601103&sid=aCke89dDAcbU

This policy change will not allow the apathetic pilots that never take time to find out whats going on to hurt a vote. Also it will make it more difficult for the David Livingstons under the direction of Ford/Harrison to parrot "dont pick up the phone".

The majority of those who vote yes or no will decide but you have to vote to be counted as a yes or a no. Good news!
I've been through two union drives at Skywest. I asked a lot of Skywest pilots for their thoughts on UPA and ALPA during those times and I didn't find anyone who was 'apathetic'. All the pilots I talked to had a good understanding of the issues. The issue is not that a majority or even some of the pilots were apathetic. A majority of the pilots at Skywest made the conscience and informed decision not to vote for ALPA or UPA.

If I were to think about it a bit I would probably be insulted at your insinuation that the only reason why someone would not have wanted ALPA or UPA at Skywest was a lack of concern for their future, their career or our profession. I have never found any evidence to support the idea that the union drives failed at Skywest due to some of the pilots being too lazy to pick up the phone.

Cheers,
Scott
 

BankAccount=0$

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....to be voted off every regional carriers property and get their own representation that looks out for their interests. Not ALPA's.
As appealing as that sounds, you might want to look into the economics of ALPA as it pertains to where the money comes from. I have, and the "majors" basicly support the regionals in the ALPA world. Don't get me wrong, I'd love to have a seperate union to represent the Regional airline pilots, but the economics just are not there. The regional pilots as a whole take much more from ALPA than we contribute to ALPA in the form of dues. There is a possibility that with some really creative alliances (ie. APA, SWAPA, USAPA, and the IPA) that the regionals might have a chance at finally getting some stand alone representation, but it wouldn't be in the near future. Of course with anything there has to be a start to the whole idea, and this comes from the pilots themselves. If you think Regionals can do it better on their own, then I would encourage you to voice this to your reps and MEC officers....
 

120% Torque

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I've been through two union drives at Skywest. I asked a lot of Skywest pilots for their thoughts on UPA and ALPA during those times and I didn't find anyone who was 'apathetic'. All the pilots I talked to had a good understanding of the issues. The issue is not that a majority or even some of the pilots were apathetic. A majority of the pilots at Skywest made the conscience and informed decision not to vote for ALPA or UPA.

If I were to think about it a bit I would probably be insulted at your insinuation that the only reason why someone would not have wanted ALPA or UPA at Skywest was a lack of concern for their future, their career or our profession. I have never found any evidence to support the idea that the union drives failed at Skywest due to some of the pilots being too lazy to pick up the phone.

Cheers,
Scott
Well after a decade at Skywest I think its funny that you and I have been flying with and talking with two totally different pilot groups. Not all, but surprisingly many of the pilots (especially the constant stream of new guys from 97 to 07) didnt have even a cursery knowledge of the issues and what was being lost.

Would you argue against the fact a legally binding contract would at least have given the pilot group some rights not present with Sapa? That there would be a better medium to fight the gimmme, takes and erosion layed down by management?
 

vtech

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Hey, 120%, tell me what thoughts go through your head when you taxi past that monument to ALPA success at KCVG depicted on the 10-9 as "Terminal C?" Remember how busy that used to be? Remember all those RJ's parked there and the constant movement of planes, passengers, bags, equipment, busses to and from the main terminal? Today, Terminal C is closed. No planes, no passengers, no bags, no equipment. The busses are still there. Just parked out front of the terminal. The bus drivers and all the employees who worked in the terminal aren't there, though. Their jobs are gone, too.

So what lessons do you take away from Comair ALPA's 89 day strike and the aftermath over the last nine years or so? Pretty powerful and protective stuff, those ALPA regional unions, wouldn't you agree? They protect jobs, benefits, everything. And the vocal minority over at SkyWest who are whining, bitching and moaning about losses they've had while their pilot group has pretty much trippled in size over the same period of time want to start another union drive. Yep, that'll solve everthing. Let's get ALPA onboard over there. Great idea. Just taxi past Terminal C at KCVG and see the glory.

Nevermind. I'm probably just being narrow minded or exposing my ignorance.
 

Rez O. Lewshun

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Hey, 120%, tell me what thoughts go through your head when you taxi past that monument to ALPA success at KCVG depicted on the 10-9 as "Terminal C?" Remember how busy that used to be? Remember all those RJ's parked there and the constant movement of planes, passengers, bags, equipment, busses to and from the main terminal? Today, Terminal C is closed. No planes, no passengers, no bags, no equipment. The busses are still there. Just parked out front of the terminal. The bus drivers and all the employees who worked in the terminal aren't there, though. Their jobs are gone, too.

So what lessons do you take away from Comair ALPA's 89 day strike and the aftermath over the last nine years or so? Pretty powerful and protective stuff, those ALPA regional unions, wouldn't you agree? They protect jobs, benefits, everything. And the vocal minority over at SkyWest who are whining, bitching and moaning about losses they've had while their pilot group has pretty much trippled in size over the same period of time want to start another union drive. Yep, that'll solve everthing. Let's get ALPA onboard over there. Great idea. Just taxi past Terminal C at KCVG and see the glory.

Nevermind. I'm probably just being narrow minded or exposing my ignorance.

You are going to have to be more specific as to how ALPA shut down Terminal C in CVG.
 

Raoul Duke

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This rule can be used in reverse to toss unions. All it will take to decertify is the same majority of voters. This will end up tossing more unions than putting them in place.
 

Gr82Aviate

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Well after a decade at Skywest I think its funny that you and I have been flying with and talking with two totally different pilot groups. Not all, but surprisingly many of the pilots (especially the constant stream of new guys from 97 to 07) didnt have even a cursery knowledge of the issues and what was being lost.

Would you argue against the fact a legally binding contract would at least have given the pilot group some rights not present with Sapa? That there would be a better medium to fight the gimmme, takes and erosion layed down by management?





Don't try and bring logic and common sense into this!
 

urflyingme?!

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You get what you pay for.
 

sstearns2

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Well after a decade at Skywest I think its funny that you and I have been flying with and talking with two totally different pilot groups. Not all, but surprisingly many of the pilots (especially the constant stream of new guys from 97 to 07) didn’t have even a cursory knowledge of the issues and what was being lost.
Would you argue against the fact a legally binding contract would at least have given the pilot group some rights not present with Sapa? That there would be a better medium to fight the gimmme, takes and erosion laid down by management?
I suppose we've had different experiences regarding the pilots we flew with. I had many long and in depth discussions with knowledgeable Skywest pilots about ALPA and UPA. I would also venture that a considerable majority of former union members I talked with did not support a union for Skywest pilots. A poll I started on the SAPA website at the time also supported this.

The Skywest pilots would, under ALPA or UPA, have stronger grounds and a far better support system which we could use to sue the company for breech of contract, which I think is what your getting at.

The implication always seems to be that ALPA has some kind of mythical strength and power over management that I just don't see. What did they do for the Midwest pilots? What about pushing for age 65 when the majority of their own group opposed it and now all of our careers are on pause at best? Should I go on?

Cheers,
Scott
 

Tarzan

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The implication always seems to be that ALPA has some kind of mythical strength and power over management that I just don't see. What did they do for the Midwest pilots? What about pushing for age 65 when the majority of their own group opposed it and now all of our careers are on pause at best? Should I go on?

Cheers,
Scott
ALPA certainly has its own issues to deal with. But for you to insinuate that there is mythical power belief is ridiculous. Its is a legal buffer between to the company, the FAA and you. It's also called a contract and guess what? Jerry Atkins has one. Why don't you?
 

DoinTime

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This rule can be used in reverse to toss unions. All it will take to decertify is the same majority of voters. This will end up tossing more unions than putting them in place.
How many decertification drives (elimination of representation not just switching to another Union) have there been in the past 20 years under the RLA? I think if you still have one of your hands left you'll be able to count them.
 

PBRstreetgang

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This rule can be used in reverse to toss unions. All it will take to decertify is the same majority of voters. This will end up tossing more unions than putting them in place.
Never has there been truer words said, that being said, be careful what you vote for. Wanna see where not having contract will get you? Look at SKYW, I won't list the losses, to many and numerous to list without crying in my beer. Those of us who tried to get a union on board are the victims, to the apathetic losers who parroted the daves and F&H, you are getting exactly what you voted/not voted for. I do notice your pathetic arguments have quieted down a lot.
PBR
 
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