Skywest may finally have a reasonable chance of voting a union in...

[urflyingme?!]

You get what you pay for.

 

[sstearns2]

Well after a decade at Skywest I think its funny that you and I have been flying with and talking with two totally different pilot groups. Not all, but surprisingly many of the pilots (especially the constant stream of new guys from 97 to 07) didn’t have even a cursory knowledge of the issues and what was being lost.
Would you argue against the fact a legally binding contract would at least have given the pilot group some rights not present with Sapa? That there would be a better medium to fight the gimmme, takes and erosion laid down by management?

I suppose we've had different experiences regarding the pilots we flew with. I had many long and in depth discussions with knowledgeable Skywest pilots about ALPA and UPA. I would also venture that a considerable majority of former union members I talked with did not support a union for Skywest pilots. A poll I started on the SAPA website at the time also supported this.

The Skywest pilots would, under ALPA or UPA, have stronger grounds and a far better support system which we could use to sue the company for breech of contract, which I think is what your getting at.

The implication always seems to be that ALPA has some kind of mythical strength and power over management that I just don't see. What did they do for the Midwest pilots? What about pushing for age 65 when the majority of their own group opposed it and now all of our careers are on pause at best? Should I go on?

Cheers,
Scott

 

[Tarzan]

The implication always seems to be that ALPA has some kind of mythical strength and power over management that I just don't see. What did they do for the Midwest pilots? What about pushing for age 65 when the majority of their own group opposed it and now all of our careers are on pause at best? Should I go on?

Cheers,
Scott

ALPA certainly has its own issues to deal with. But for you to insinuate that there is mythical power belief is ridiculous. Its is a legal buffer between to the company, the FAA and you. It's also called a contract and guess what? Jerry Atkins has one. Why don't you?

 

[DoinTime]

This rule can be used in reverse to toss unions. All it will take to decertify is the same majority of voters. This will end up tossing more unions than putting them in place.

How many decertification drives (elimination of representation not just switching to another Union) have there been in the past 20 years under the RLA? I think if you still have one of your hands left you'll be able to count them.

 

[PBRstreetgang]

This rule can be used in reverse to toss unions. All it will take to decertify is the same majority of voters. This will end up tossing more unions than putting them in place.

Never has there been truer words said, that being said, be careful what you vote for. Wanna see where not having contract will get you? Look at SKYW, I won't list the losses, to many and numerous to list without crying in my beer. Those of us who tried to get a union on board are the victims, to the apathetic losers who parroted the daves and F&H, you are getting exactly what you voted/not voted for. I do notice your pathetic arguments have quieted down a lot.
PBR

 

[TailHeavy]

I'm not so sure ALPA was pushing hard to get the age 65 thing to pass. It was a ICAO deal, that the FAA decided to accept. ALPA changed their tune after it was going to be a sure thing. Helped shape the regs...not push for them.

 

[WayBack]

The Skywest pilots would, under ALPA or UPA, have stronger grounds and a far better support system which we could use to sue the company for breech of contract, which I think is what your getting at.

I've always loved hearing that out of a reps mouth.
Who signs the paycheck? Not ALPA.
Who's company is it to run? Not ALPA.
Who's company is it to shutdown after losing a big lawsuit? Not ALPA.

The fact that these ALPA chest thumpers actually believe that they can keep an airline from shutting down, accepting or declining aircraft....they need to pull their heads out of the sand.
Management has been pushing ALPA around for the last 75yrs. No? Look at all the pay cuts the pilots have taken and all the multi million dollar bonuses management gets.

 

[Regul8r]

Its is a legal buffer between to the company, the FAA and you.

These are ancillary benefits. The primary purpose for ALPA was to ensure decent wages for the pilots....not just the executive officers and Prater's fat ass.

 

[Tarzan]

These are ancillary benefits. The primary purpose for ALPA was to ensure decent wages for the pilots....not just the executive officers and Prater's fat ass.

Don't you think that the buffer of which I spoke, included something called the RLA? Work rules, safety, etc all ancillary? Get that word from the thesarus?

 

[Regul8r]

Don't you think that the buffer of which I spoke, included something called the RLA?

The primary purpose of ALPA was pay. Everything else was/is secondary. Didn't you read Flying the Line?

 

[PCL_128]

This rule can be used in reverse to toss unions. All it will take to decertify is the same majority of voters. This will end up tossing more unions than putting them in place.

Incorrect. Under the current rules, apathy was far more likely to result in a decertification being successful. If you go to a decertification vote under the current rules, all it took was 50% +1 to forget to vote, and all representation would be decertified. Under the new rules, that risk disappears, and it's far easier for an incumbent union to protect their bargaining rights at the carrier.

 

[PCL_128]

The primary purpose of ALPA was pay. Everything else was/is secondary. Didn't you read Flying the Line?

Also incorrect. When created, ALPA's primary purpose was protecting its members from getting killed in incredibly unsafe working conditions. Pay was secondary.

 

[Regul8r]

Also incorrect. When created, ALPA's primary purpose was protecting its members from getting killed in incredibly unsafe working conditions. Pay was secondary.

Don't piss on my leg and tell me it's raining. Read Flying the Line and Hopkins spells it out for you. Safety was a byproduct. You need me to quote it for you?

 

[PCL_128]

Don't piss on my leg and tell me it's raining. Read Flying the Line and Hopkins spells it out for you. Safety was a byproduct. You need me to quote it for you?

Go right ahead, hot shot.

 

[pilotyip]

After the union drive

Intervewing ton's of ex union airline pilots right now, all trying to gets jobs flying on-demand air cargo out of YIP. ABX, DHL, Midwest Express, NJ and others. Union did wonders for their careers.