Proposed List of 100 Netjets Crew Bases

[skiandsurf]

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There is NOTHING in the propsal about PTO being vacation time. Nothing.

Sick Time
PTO
Vacation.

3 different animals.

Don't worry, you'll like the system when you get it.

Under the current contract, we get sick time and vacation time. If you are on the reserve system, you can bid for 4 "H days" (days off) per month...or 48 days a year. As I understand it, the PTO days will replace these, but you only get 8 (?) per year. The payrate will be at 75% for the PTO days. So, in a different view, you are now getting paid for those "H days" (days off)....this is sounding better as I type. The problem with PTO days, you have to plan them out in advance, bid for them, and be awarded them, otherwise its going to be a sick call.

Sick days still get paid at 100%.

And vacation will still be 15 day minimum (for a 7 day vacation), on 15 or 18 day sched. 21 days for 7/7 schedule.

 

[gunfyter]

Are you $%*%ing kidding me. You have lost all credibility. Or maybe I missed something. Tell me I missed something. Did I miss something? Or are you being a *************************?
Selling out already.
I must have missed something.

If not you are not much of a "fyter".

Did you miss that it was in response to this?

Originally Posted by gutshotdraw ​

Dy'a think somewhere, somebody is giggling their butt off watching the unified pilots of 1108 rip each other up in the middle of a bargaining period? Divide and conquer my friends. Divide and conquer.​

Yes I think someone is laughing his butt off as the union prepares to give away my schedule and HBA rights.

Trading Single Carrier is worse than that?

What kind of "fyter" gives away hard fought for schedules and basing rights.... Basing NJI has ... we should have the same they have.

I made the statement to highlite this point.

 

[Fozzy]

Ya I did miss that. Little blurry eyed last night. Probably figured that by the rant.
Oops.

Lets sweat the details on the 1st.
Later.

 

[172driver]

Under the current contract, we get sick time and vacation time. If you are on the reserve system, you can bid for 4 "H days" (days off) per month...or 48 days a year. As I understand it, the PTO days will replace these, but you only get 8 (?) per year. The payrate will be at 75% for the PTO days. So, in a different view, you are now getting paid for those "H days" (days off)....this is sounding better as I type.

Where do people come up with this stuff? Do you even work at NJA?

We will still get 12 days a year. They can be used for PTO or illness. The difference is that to use them as PTO, you must give the company at least one week notice and the day must be available for PTO -- e.g. not a blackout day and only x amount of pilots in your seat can take PTO on the same day for obvious reasons.

If you give the company the advance notice they desire, they will only charge you .75 days against your bank. You get paid for a full day while only using .75 and they get to preplan for your absence.

 

[RNObased]

From my perspective: Jumping from 5 domiciles to 100 bases is a lot of forward progress. True, the company could open more, but as they haven't it seems we should stop holding out hope that they will. At best all they have to do is match the other fracs if hiring is a problem. I'd like NJ pilots to have 100 choices, not just 20 or so.

I'm all for more scheduling options for our families. For some 7 days is too long to be gone. It seems reasonable that they can work out the bugs enough to get a deal to pass. No one should be surprised the company wants to fix areas of the contract they don't like. The good news is that NJ pilots get to negotiate and then to vote.

The company has to know that the pre-rat crowd won't be thrilled w/100 bases compared to the HBA system, and that many resist change when they're happy with what they have....soooo....that only leaves a pay raise to persuade the no-voters. I think they'll make the deal too tempting to refuse. The company has the money to do that. Management has seen the re$ult$ of having a motivated pilot force. It's illogical to think that they wouldn't want that to continue. So it stands to reason their offer will be designed to ensure that motivation remains high.

I am hopeful that the problems can be addressed at the table; they're certainly putting in long enough hours. Perhaps we're not hearing from the silent majority? Maybe some of you are understandably short on optimism when negotiations take place? I, personally, don't see why they can't work out a deal that will please the majority of the NJ pilots. The 2005 CBA tells me that they should know how to do that.

Best Regards,
Netjetwife

Well NJA wife, your post prettly much hit the nail on the head, with a lot of "the comany" this and the "the company" that.

This thing is great for "the company" not so good for the pilots. Of course we all know pilots will sell their souls for 100.00 so if the "company"
throws a bone like 5K out, people will forget what they are giving up and jump all over it. Then sometime down the road they want to do something that used to have the right to do and they will wonder what the hell happened.

 

[RNObased]

You are correct in that, and that's why they put this out. For those of you saying NO at this point, you didn't learn the word yesterday, so stop deciding. This is where they are going. They need feed back and someone thought this would be a good idea...to put it out to everyone and get the responses. This thing isn't finished yet. The limitations on HBA's is odd and needs to be changed. I retract my comment on H-days in my previous post (see, I'm learning too!). They need to remain. The "crew rot" potential must be addressed if they are throwing out FRDA. That's why this is out there though. Tell them your concerns and then wait to see what they ultimately come up with. YOU voted these people into office...trust them to represent you...all of you. But remember, it IS a negotiation. If they move backwards, vote it down. I won't complain. If they go forward, maybe slightly diagonally, but forward nonetheless, then vote yes if you feel ok. The point in this isn't to divide and make people angry, although it already is doing just that. Voice your opinion to those to whom it matters. Don't complain to your junior F/O when you go back out on the line. Be careful around whom you b!tch. If you have decided NO already, with this incomplete "test the waters" draft, then tear up the union card and go away. Use your head and talk to those who need to hear your comments...the UNION, and don't make up your mind until we see a final product. And if you think about it...we may not even get a final product if the company screws around too much. The MEC could simply fold up the table and walk away and say they will wait until 2010. The point of all that is to just keep an open mind. I am. I have already re-thought some issues I posted on a few pages back.

and RNOPilot, or whatever your name is, I'm from South Carolina and not even WE say things like "sweet fancy jesus"! Give me a break and pass the sweet tea!!!

Dork Boy or whatever your name is, sorry to offend you sothern gentalmen, I was trying to make a point.

A couple of points, parts of the MEC and the E-board are doing the talks with company. If the MEC got up and walked away only a portion of the team doing the talks would leave.

Anyway we will see if the whole MEC endorses this thing. That is in serious doubt.

Telling people to tear up their union cards, well I guess that is one way to do things.

 

[Diesel]

This thing is great for "the company" not so good for the pilots. Of course we all know pilots will sell their souls for 100.00 so if the "company"
throws a bone like 5K out, people will forget what they are giving up and jump all over it. Then sometime down the road they want to do something that used to have the right to do and they will wonder what the hell happened.

Pretty much sums up this pilot group and any other pilot group. Sadly.

 

[skiandsurf]

Anybody think that all of this is just a tease? RTS and BO keep saying that they want this to be the best "job in aviation". How can they claim that with this stuff that they give us. I havent read anything about the regional bidding, that was so heavily discussed. And why all of this (the showing, the phone surveys), when this is supposed to be out to is in a month.

I like the increase in bases and the rumors about more pay, but other than that, it doesnt look all that good. I like the current 7/7 and the reserve option.

 

[old*art]

Everything is so fluid now in negotiations that nothing is definite. Anyone posting here to the contrary is guessing or trying to cause trouble. This is the most impressive group representing us I have ever seen and I have total confidence in them until they prove me wrong. Based on past results I don't think that will happen.

 

[DO-82 driver]

The fact that our negotiators are hand us bits and pieces of info is a sign that they truely have our interests in mind and track our thoughts on the union message board.

They are professionals in every sense of the word. I'll reserve my final judgement until I read and discuss the final proposal.

Regardless of how I vote I will always respect them for the selfless work and sacrafices they make on my behalf.

 

[hopalong]

The fact that our negotiators are hand us bits and pieces of info is a sign that they truely have our interests in mind and track our thoughts on the union message board.

They are professionals in every sense of the word. I'll reserve my final judgement until I read and discuss the final proposal.

Regardless of how I vote I will always respect them for the selfless work and sacrafices they make on my behalf.

Amen brother!

 

[brokeflyer]

yeah there is no incentive for the crew on this thing.....At first I though it was a joke....like "here is what were giving the company......."

the IBB is great for the company......and its gonna take more than 5k to sell it.....we got a lot beat up pilots that will not take any more crap. If I see 30k raise then I may read it again....its gonna take a lot for me to throw my HBA and my 7&7 out the window forever, cause once we give them up we'll never be able to negotiate it back in.

the power is in the vote.....and mine is NO

 

[Mach92]

yeah there is no incentive for the crew on this thing.....At first I though it was a joke....like "here is what were giving the company......."

the IBB is great for the company......and its gonna take more than 5k to sell it.....we got a lot beat up pilots that will not take any more crap. If I see 30k raise then I may read it again....its gonna take a lot for me to throw my HBA and my 7&7 out the window forever, cause once we give them up we'll never be able to negotiate it back in.

the power is in the vote.....and mine is NO

Please educate me on how your losing 7&7. Nobody is selling ********************. If you read it ask questions and still don't like it then make an educated vote. Better yet I expect to see your name for MEC in 2009. Be part of the solution or part of the problem your choice.

 

[fly4funcrj]

HBAs have worked fine and are still working fine for NJI, so that myth is busted.

Sure it is.. BUt they don't have half of what we do. I know, lets get nji basing and we can have their contract.. oh wait.. they don't have one.. That's right, their extended days suck, pay sucks, vacation, sick days, the list goes on and on..
So, what's the nji basing worth to us? I for one will not give up what we have now just to have basing from any airport.. that is just plain stupid.. If joe bloe wants to live in the middle of nowhere, he should have to drive more then a few minutes.. Why the hell should the company, and union for that matter, cater to him? 90% of all the pilots live close to the list of 100. I'd much rather see guys drive 1 hour then 6.

And the post about pre rat guys made 29k and had gateways and the new guys make 40k so they should shut up is a very dumb statement.. EVERYTHING has gone up almost 4x yet the starting salary has gone up what? 1.5x? Gas was how much back then? taxes were how much? tires, wear and tear, oil, etc.. See my point? Also guys are spending up to 10k a year to commute while you had 25 gateways and probably didn't spend that much.. Maybe you did since I do not know you, but to think new guys make more today then you did?!?! They are making less actually.. do the math

 

[fly4funcrj]

yeah there is no incentive for the crew on this thing.....At first I though it was a joke....like "here is what were giving the company......."

the IBB is great for the company......and its gonna take more than 5k to sell it.....we got a lot beat up pilots that will not take any more crap. If I see 30k raise then I may read it again....its gonna take a lot for me to throw my HBA and my 7&7 out the window forever, cause once we give them up we'll never be able to negotiate it back in.

the power is in the vote.....and mine is NO

WHat a moronic statement. I guess you have the insiders knowledge huh? You have seen the complete package even though our union doesn't have one? This kind of attitude will cost you down the road. I will make an educated vote based on all available information. I will also take into account the unknown future that 2010 could bring. We all might be fighting just to keep what we have now in 2010 if the economy takes a really bad dive. Even some of our owners would be affected..

 

[fly4funcrj]

The fact that our negotiators are hand us bits and pieces of info is a sign that they truely have our interests in mind and track our thoughts on the union message board.

They are professionals in every sense of the word. I'll reserve my final judgement until I read and discuss the final proposal.

Regardless of how I vote I will always respect them for the selfless work and sacrafices they make on my behalf.

We have a winner.

So many are so quick to sell out our union leaders... If it wasn't for them, we probably wouldn't have half of what we do now..

 

[Gator1999]

I have faith that my IBB is barganing for our interests as a whole. I participated in the Wilson Polling and would encourage anyone else who gets called to take the 10 minutes to participate. I don't know where all this talk about pay increases is coming from...I read the 9/1/07 IBB update and didn't see any mention of pay increases or signing bonuses, only that they are anticipating a pay increase. That doesn't say very much to me. Based on what I see, I don't think that it's enough to pass but unfortunately I agree with Diesel and think that sadly if the company throws a 5K bone it will probably be enough to sweeten the deal for the majority of the pilots on the list.

I'll be waiting for the final proposal and the vote before I make up my mind either way...until then it's all hearsay and I don't really care to think about what may or may not happen.

 

[Hawker dude]

fly4funcr

I like your style man.

gator, I don't thing 5k is enough to swing a yes vote. might get ya a good weekend in vegas but that's about it.

Unless you want to buy yourself one of dem der new trailer homes.

 

[brokeflyer]

ok your right.....

 

[fly4funcrj]

Hey sorry about the moronic statement.. I was a little angry at something else from the union board. I still stand by the other stuff. No one can make any decision right now though, period.. Hell, the package could have a bj clause where once a year a selected pilot would have to give a bj to a netjets manager and in exchange for such service he/she would receive a 100k bonus.. I bet it would pass