Pinnacle Air Services

[Downwind]

I don't know anything about a debit card nor have I heard anything about it from PA. I put everything on my card, collect the miles, and pay the bill with the per diem check. Anything outside of that I have no knowledge of.

I have stayed at a motel 6 twice this year. Days Inn, Comfort Suites, Fairfield, Holiday Inn, Redroof, Marriott, just about all. Some towns have Marriott and some have Chavez Inn. Where are you guys flying? IAH-JFK? LAX-ORD? We sometimes wind up in the most remote places with very little choices. Sometimes HoJo is as good as it gets. Sometimes better. I don't see the big appeal of Marriott. $99 for the room, plus 10 for internet, plus 15 for breakfast. Fairfield averages 69 for the room with internet and breakfast. With breakfast paid, lunch sometimes not possible, and dinner at 15, that's 40 in your pocket. Times 15. 600 in two weeks. Or add in lunch and total 120. That 20 to pocket times 15 and you bank 300. But to each their own. I challenge you to find one PA pilot that is losing money on our system.

I'm not saying the uniform issue is right or wrong, but it is how it is. I know some airline pilots who purchase their own uniforms, and from a lot lower salary. What is the company going to do with tailored unifiorms after you leave? Would you want to wear someone elses clothes?

Don't let the fear of the unknown cloud your mind too much. PA is a good place that is only going to get better. We're glad to have you guys onboard and look forward to working with ya. I'd say the majority of the pilots here are glad to be here. Not all. But when have you ever known pilots not to bitch.

Downwind

 

[MNR]

I understand that it wasn't mentioned but how do you, Pinnacle Group, justify paying Jetride pilots $300 a day OT and Pinnacle pilots only $100?

I'm just a JR pilot but if I were Pinnacle group I would bump it up to $300 across the board not lower it across the board. I was just saying that the current mngt has worked to make things better at JR my guess is that they will try to do the same across the board.

 

[MNR]

Downwind, It sounds to me like you're ok with compromising your QOL for extra dollars. I'm not. I certainly don't think I should plan on skipping lunch just so I can pocket a couple extra bucks. Thats fine under the proposed new system you and I can decide to stay where we like and you can decide to not eat. But, i certainly do not think it will put "a few extra bills in my pocket" and frankly I don't believe that is what per diem should be for. If I come out ahead great, but I am quite happy if I break even at the end of the day. If guys at PN are going to quit because they won't get their extra from per diem then maybe they should ask to be paid more to fly airplanes.

I will stress about these things because I want to know what going on. I will ask all sorts of questions and give mngt my input because thats the culture they have been attempting to foster at Jetride.

What I find interesting is that the company it putting forth this system in the effort to "save paperwork" At this point the only thing it gets rid of is me putting in for per diem (I guess it will be figured automatically) and no hotel reciepts to turn in. Were still going to do everything else and turn in all the other reciepts. I think at first the JR mngt thought they would not have to reimburse for tips or transportation either. Then they heard about captain's cash and how you guys pay for tip, taxis etc. The system PN uses currently is no less paperwork intensive than what JR uses. The only other reason I see to go to the PN way of doing per diem is so they can predict costs better.

Uniforms, if I was paid less at some other airline why would I want to pay for uniforms. This career is slowly becomeing a place people decide to leave because pilots do not value themselves enough. They work for peanuts or worse pay for their jobs, get stepped on, treated like dirt and then say "oh, thats ok at least I got to fly an airplane today." please. Bottom line is Airnet/Jetride has always given an allowance per year or paid for uniforms. We are not running around polo's btw. They don't want the stuff back because it wears out. I would hope that we would continue to get them paid for. If we don't then I will be on the phone again.

Lastly, did you ever think that maybe the reason you have staffing problems at PN is because of how they were doing things there? No communication, pay for your uniforms, $100 a day for overtime. In the long run people will vote with their feet. They will leave or more likely will look at the offer on the table aand decide they would rather not work at such a place. I think that is the biggest concern for Jetride pilots we have had it pretty good the last year or so. I think that most of the guys would agree with me about wanting it to stay that way. The DO at JR has even told me in the past they want Jetride to be a place where people will decide to stay long term, maybe retire from etc. The VP has assured us and told me personally that he is interested in maintaining current status quo or even maybe improve on the QOL If we however do not let them know when thing start to slip then they can't fix it.

 

[slickmagneto]

Let's see if we can set things straight. Pinnacle bought Jetride.(NOT MERGED). He who has the gold makes the rules. Pinnacle has the gold thus gets to makes the rules. If you don't like the rules you can go somewhere else. Looks plain and simple to me. And I'll bet a weeks salary that the day you tell Nelson your not going to work will be your last day. Trust me that I'm for better working conditions for all parties but I can tell you that you are playing with a loaded gun.

 

[MNR]

Kinda makes my point for me. Nelson's way of doing things is alot different from how things are done at Jetride. At least that is what I have heard from other PN pilots and what you seem to be indicateing above.

The guys who do have the gold do certainly make the rules (which is why we are all getting uniforms) They also could have put Nelson into VP position, they went with Wynn instead.

The culture at Jetride is such that I will actually call in the day before my 2 weeks starts and let them know I am avaiable if a trip comes up thats going to go over into my rotation. Yes, the extra $300 is nice if I start a day early. I do it also just because it helps the company out. They scratch my back I scratch theirs.

If the current culture at Jetride changes to mimic something similar to what I percieve goes on at Pinnacle (I could absolutely be wrong with my perception btw) Then I believe I can safely say that some Jetride pilots will go elsewhere. With Wynn at the helm I do not think that will happen. Only time will tell however.

 

[starcheckdriver]

And I'll bet a weeks salary that the day you tell Nelson your not going to work will be your last day.

What do you mean by this? Does this mean calling in sick and being asked to work on a day off? If that is the case, Nelson should be fired and get a swift kick in the a$$ on his way out the door.

If you are refering to people not working for dumb reasons or refusing flights for stupid reasons, then Nelson is doing a good job. I speak for myself when I say, I won't work when I am sick and I won't work on hard days off unless they are paying me the $250 a day. Flying when sick is not safe, pure and simple. It is also not fair to my Captain who will most likely get sick from being stuffed in a cockpit with me.

Our JR pilots work hard enough on their days on and are gone so much during their on-time that asking to work a day off is only acceptable if the overtime pay is offered.

It is also my understanding that going forward, JR pilots are only taking orders from our DO and CP and Pinnacle pilots from theirs. Maybe in the future, if and when the certificates merge, JR pilots will take orders from Nelson. But, it will be a cold day in hell if he expects people to work when sick or on a day off without overtime pay.

 

[JJET44]

Let's see if we can set things straight. Pinnacle bought Jetride.(NOT MERGED). He who has the gold makes the rules. Pinnacle has the gold thus gets to makes the rules. If you don't like the rules you can go somewhere else. Looks plain and simple to me. And I'll bet a weeks salary that the day you tell Nelson your not going to work will be your last day. Trust me that I'm for better working conditions for all parties but I can tell you that you are playing with a loaded gun.

Nevermind, it's not worth it

 

[slickmagneto]

Here is one thing to remember for both PN and JR crews. JR was not alot of fun to work at when I first started. The mngt team had a very low opinion of a pilots worth and treated u you as such. Our attrition rate was terriable. The old mngt punched out DO, CP, VP and his assistant and the new mngt came in. This includes the current Jetride DO and CP as well as the current VP for Jetride who is now the boss for both JR and PN. They have done a great job imho of turing around pilot morale. The PN crews can make up their own minds about it but I think most of the JR pilots would agree with me about the overall improvement in the QOL at Jetride over the last year. In the long run these things like debit cards, per diem and uniforms will get worked out and if past performance from the current VP equals future results I think the future combined company will be a decent place to work.

Pinnacle lost a lot of people in the early days and things eventually changed. There is plenty of room for improvement now. Making threats and playing the "I'm sick" card will only work once. It appears from all the positive comments that the addition of Mr. Wynn will be a great asset to the combined companies and the pilot group. It's too early to judge anything or anybody. Everyone needs to sit back and wait. I'm sure that in the end it's going to be a great place to work for all those who wish to ride it out.

 

[TennLear60]

Let's see if we can set things straight. Pinnacle bought Jetride.(NOT MERGED). He who has the gold makes the rules. Pinnacle has the gold thus gets to makes the rules. If you don't like the rules you can go somewhere else. Looks plain and simple to me. And I'll bet a weeks salary that the day you tell Nelson your not going to work will be your last day. Trust me that I'm for better working conditions for all parties but I can tell you that you are playing with a loaded gun.

Wow! I'm...speechless.

 

[slickmagneto]

Wow! I'm...speechless.

I doubt that! And you know I know you know I know.

 

[JJET44]

Let's see if we can set things straight. Pinnacle bought Jetride.(NOT MERGED). He who has the gold makes the rules. Pinnacle has the gold thus gets to makes the rules. If you don't like the rules you can go somewhere else. Looks plain and simple to me. And I'll bet a weeks salary that the day you tell Nelson your not going to work will be your last day. Trust me that I'm for better working conditions for all parties but I can tell you that you are playing with a loaded gun.

The more I read this the more I get fumed
Either this is Nelson himself or his Mini-Me!!!!

 

[slickmagneto]

The more I read this the more I get fumed
Either this is Nelson himself or his Mini-Me!!!!

Your file is now in the hands of GOD himself.

 

[Flybet3]

Your file is now in the hands of GOD himself.

I've said it many times and I'll say it again...Nelson, do the world a favor and make your self disappear! You intolerable, arrogant, small d**ked bastard! The only reason you are still flying is b/c you screwed good people and got lucky. Your day will come... *******s

 

[FL410guy]

Let's see if we can set things straight. Pinnacle bought Jetride.(NOT MERGED). He who has the gold makes the rules. Pinnacle has the gold thus gets to makes the rules. If you don't like the rules you can go somewhere else. Looks plain and simple to me. And I'll bet a weeks salary that the day you tell Nelson your not going to work will be your last day. Trust me that I'm for better working conditions for all parties but I can tell you that you are playing with a loaded gun.

I just want to say that PN bought JR ideas and procedures. Why? Cause we have one of the highest reputations in the charter business. We fly our asses off and make tons of cash doing it. Airnet simply wanted to get rid of the dept JR planes had caused. So, PN know's this is a steal and buys us. So, why would PN want to change something that has produce millions in profit every year?

Oh, buy the way. Our boss is now your boss. You can decide to have better QOL or leave for some other peanut picking job.

 

[CFI4LIFE]

I sense this thread turning to "us" vs "them," and I think thats unfortunate because up till now things seemed to be going pretty smooth between both pilot groups. Fact is no one really knows what is going to unfold when the deal is done and behind us. JR guys know what we have in our management, and the kind of ethics Wynn brings to the table. I would hedge my bets that he will continue to act with integrity and make this as painless as possible for all involved. I don't know Nelson, and I'm not going to make any preconceived notions about him, I have heard he is "fair" and until proven otherwise I will give him the benefit of the doubt. I will say that all of the PN pilots I have met have been very friendly, positive, and people I look forward to working with. So, all that being said, hopefully we can keep this thread on a positive track.

 

[starcheckdriver]

I sense this thread turning to "us" vs "them," and I think thats unfortunate because up till now things seemed to be going pretty smooth between both pilot groups.

I agree with you. We don't want to head down the road of us vs. them. This is typical Flightinfo style and no good will come from it. I only met one Pinnacle crew and they were great to be around and talk to.

I said some things in earlier posts regarding working on days off and not willing to do so. If this was conceived as arrogant or being a jackass, I am sorry. It was not my intention. I think there are good things to come and that the Pinnacle pilots will see an improvement in their QOL.

Needless to say, JR and PN pilots are all in this together and it will be a bumpy road of changes. If we stick together and stand by each other, we can make this a great place to work!

 

[TennLear60]

I just want to say that PN bought JR ideas and procedures. Why? Cause we have one of the highest reputations in the charter business. We fly our asses off and make tons of cash doing it. Airnet simply wanted to get rid of the dept JR planes had caused. So, PN know's this is a steal and buys us. So, why would PN want to change something that has produce millions in profit every year?

Oh, buy the way. Our boss is now your boss. You can decide to have better QOL or leave for some other peanut picking job.

The goal of the Pinnacle Group "4" was to be the largest most successful 135 operator around. To do this they had to buy a company that was larger and had been around longer with experience and logistics to make it work and work well. Looks to me that with was not just a purchase of a company but also a purchase of know-how and logistics. This could not have been a better move on behalf of the Pinnacle Group. Especially for those of us working on the line. Our benefits have improved. Possibly OT will improve. Who knows what is to come. The way it looks to me is that is that our company is improving itself to the standards of JetRide. So, yeah, our company had the "gold" to buy JR. I look forward to the future. You guys bring a lot to the table that will make this fledgeling company improve and grow faster than it has in the past. This company has made exponential improvements since I have been here. A little rocky at times. With this new acquisition between between JR and PA we will see even more improvements. Especially for us on the PA side I hope to see a better means of communications.

 

[pushntin]

Your file is now in the hands of GOD himself.

Well G, that was well put. They obviously have not worked at PA and they can't figure out who Nelson is or Dave. So let let the ignorance continue to compile into one steaming pile.

Peace Out!

 

[JJET44]

Hey pushin Fudge
Who's They

 

[starcheckdriver]

I see that we will no longer be getting the per diem debit cards. Instead, the per diem money will be direct deposited into our personal bank account. It will still be the standard rate based on the IRS CONUS High-Low method.

I e-mailed the Pinnacle Accounting Manager regarding expense reports and how per diem will be paid with this new system. She told me that they will deposit the per diem based on the flight schedule they receive from Dispatch. She also said there will be no need for expense reports. This leads me to a few more questions that maybe some Pinnacle guys/gals can answer....

1. Without an expense report, how do we get reimbursed for tips, taxi rides, rental cars, etc?

2. Do the Pinnacle pilots get reimbursed for tips, taxis, etc. now, under the current system?

I still think we are going get hosed on this new per diem system. We are in PBI this week, which qulifies for the low rate of $141. The PIC and I looked online and talked to the FBO and the best rate we could get around here is $90 a night before taxes/fees for a hotel within 10 miles of the airport and one that had shuttle service. So, the daily bill will be about $107 after fees, which leaves me with $34 a day for food. That's a bad deal IMHO. We are getting $36 a day now.