NetJets Strike Passes By 93%

[JetProp]

.....

 

[Hogprint]

Some Dude is right:

Sounds really safe having guys doing 17 hour duty days because they are on the GO TO TEAM. Can't wait to read that accident report and see the Billion dolllar lawsuit that will follow. This company has a history of ethics problem.

This will be a huge black eye if (god forbid) something like this happend.

How will this jibe with we are the safest company out there theme?

 

[dsptchrnja]

You guys kill me. Defending anyone at the company who took gifts to change their schedules is wrong.

One more time for the slow guy...

NO ONE CHANGED ANYONE'S SCHEDULE BECAUSE THEY RECEIVED A GIFT.

yah, we know, you were part of the investigation... who cares?

...get over it already

 

[Some Dude]

Wrong Dispatcher, Why would anyone give someone a gift? Why didn't the other departments receive gifts from these pilots. Why were you so stupid to post company communication on an internet site? Do you not know that you can be terminated for that? Especially a memo that is for company personnel only. I would watch your posts. You don't have many friends on this site. You wouldn't want your posts of company communication to be forwarded to management. Personally, I wouldn't do that to you. But I do know a few persons who are seriously considering it.

 

[dsptchrnja]

Wrong Dispatcher, Why would anyone give someone a gift? Why didn't the other departments receive gifts from these pilots.

uuhhhh... for the same reason pilots bought us pizzas a few weeks ago? Or perhaps they had some extra nuts and wanted to share them because they were NICE? You mean you've had over a year to think about it and it still hasn't dawned on you that it was a friendly gesture?

You still don't get it.... it's over. Your questions have already been answered for over a year now by people who knew more about it than you. You're not just beating a dead horse here, you're digging it out of the grave and wacking at the bones now.

The thug image isn't suiting you either.

 

[Some Dude]

I'll make note to the pilots to stop feeding you pizza. I'm not the thug. You can be terminated for what you did. Do you not understand that? Don't forget who convinced the company to create a dispatch department. We did. You can be easily replaced.

 

[FamilyGuy]

I don't believe anyone has been threatened for pimping extended days. Many have been urged to not fly overtime by their peers through verbal communication... you know... just talking. Simply looking at the names on Company provides Duty Summary lists and talking to those pilots on the road does not constitute a threat.

Oh...just talking to them, no coercion, no threats....right

Why do you perceive the verbal communication from the chief pilots as threats and coercion but your "friendly little chats" with pilots who want to work overtime is just talking?

 

[FamilyGuy]

I am not in the manufacturing industry, much less the automobile industry. I have no clue how one motor company treats it's employees compared to another.

I did notice that you mentioned several US based companies as Unionized and several Foreign based companies as non Union.

Again, can't comment on the topic as I am not well versed in that industry.

The majority of Aviation employees in the US are Unionized. I CAN tell you that is a fact.

Cant comment since you are not in Manufacturing? Then why did you bring it up as an example when you tried to defend your lame argument?

Sounds to me like you're another victim of blindly repeating union dogma without truly understanding the message.

US based or Foreign Based is irrelevant. The point is that Ford, GM, Chrysler, Toyota, Honda, Mercedes, Hyundai all operate auto manufacturing plants right here on American soil, employing American citizens. The unions, which have a stranglehold on the Big 3 US manufacturers have been wholly unsuccessful in converting any of these transplant auto factories.

Again, either the unions have a compelling message or they do not. The facts clearly show that unions are in decline and have been fading to oblivion for 60 years!

As for aviation, yes, currently a majority of employees are unionized. But its just a matter of time before that changes. Read the news and check out the other sections of this board. There's widespread discontent with the union's inability to stop the erosion of wages, benefits, scope, and other advantages that unions have claimed in the past. If the unions cant deliver any advantages over non-union shops then its just natural that the employees will question the wisdom of giving some of their hard earned dollars to the union.

 

[FamilyGuy]

Family Guy-
So we've shot down all your arguments and now you're main argument is that unions are in decline and we should become non union? Let's do apples to apples. Show me a list of airlines that have gone from union to non-union. Leaving one union to go to another or start another doesn't count. They are still remaining in some sort of union. There isn't any.

WHAT? I think those fumes are getting to you Diesel....I havent seen any arguments refuted. In fact, most of my points have been avoided, I must assume because you guys cant even mount a plausible counter argument.

But since you are clearly delusional I'll take pity on you and give you another chance to shoot down my more recent arguments that have not been refuted by sound, rational, facts yet...

Look at the auto industry - one of the largest manufacturing industries out there. Unions have been wholly unsuccessful in unionizing the transplant facilities that have been built in the US by Honda, Toyota, and others. Why?

Has all the auto manufacturing jobs that shifted from GM, Ford, and Chrysler resulted in a sacrifice of QUALITY? Face it....Toyota, Honda, and most other imports are vastly superior to the American product.

Who's claiming NO money? How could the company offer you higher wages than FlexJet, Flight Options, and Citation Shares if they were claiming no money?

Unions have been LOSING for 60 years! Is it really scheming by management or a tired, worn-out message that's no longer applicable?

Either the unions have a compelling message or they do not. It looks like Americans are voting with their feet and leaving in droves.

Or are you telling me that unions have their head stuck in the sand and cant recognize fundamental shifts in demographics and employment trends and adapt their message accordingly? Which is it?

Simple truth is that the facts dont lie. If these number crunchers had access to all the crew schedules and overtime records then that is all that is needed to determine if favoritism was present. Its either in the data or its not.

If you had a problem with the findings of these number crunchers then why didnt you call the ethics hotline 2 years ago? Why raise the issue on an internet board? Maybe because you know there is NO VALIDITY to your claims?

I see the union spinmeisters are out in force to try and explain why 400 of their own didnt participate in the recent strike vote.

you guys are trying hard but there is still something that doesnt ring true in the latest 'explanation'....

if its the old contact list from local 284 that's to blame for the 'no votes' then why was everyone able to vote in the election for a new MEC?

Everyone was able to cast a vote in the election of a new MEC, yet something happened to the list in the intervening 9 months?

Last I heard, total annual cost of crew meals was around $20 million....what is this magical pilot proposal that will save $20 million?

And my personal favorite...

I agree Hogprint, it is negotiations. But that doesnt mean that both groups cant be civil to each other.

And I still dont buy this argument that the company has stalled on this for three years. If the old MEC was a bunch of company stooges that gave the company everything they wanted and 9/11 has just occurred - throwing thousands of pilots out on the street, why wouldnt the Company immediately press for a kick-ass agreement in favor of the company? They were holding all the cards....why not drive the dagger home and get everything they wanted (like the legacy carrier managements are currently doing)?

IMO, the union didnt want to do a deal during 2002-2003 simply because the economy sucked and they wouldnt be able to get what they wanted.....so they waste time going over every single article in the contract and bide their time until the economy turns around. Then they start to kick up a fuss, complaining as loudly and widely as they can about the injustice of waiting 1300 days.

Take your own advice Hogprint and read between the lines....the union was stringing this whole deal out waiting for better economic times to bargain....

 

[Hawkered]

Family Guy

Whether you like it or not, you did accept a job with a company that had a union long before you came on the property. Maybe you were hired to bust the union, you have failed miserably.

I don't like the fact hat we have a union. I think the last union MEC botched the job completely and that you have cost the company millions in angry owners that won't renew. The reason I say this is because you literally screwed yourselves out of an opportunity by low-balling the last T/A. By doing this you've had worker discontent and angry owners waiting around for contract maintenance to change a cabin light bulb in broad daylight, you've had fatigue calls within 15 mins of a revenue flight and you've had guys that went for years without using sick time using nearly all of it.

Quite frankly, there's only one thing worse than a poorly organised union and that is bad management that can't measure the barometer of the workforce.

For crying out loud, GET 'R DONE!!!

Your basking in the failures of unions past or present while Rome is burning is doing nothing for the security of this company, NOR YOUR OWN JOB SECURITY!

I'm not a union guy, I'm not a family guy, I'm a pragmatist. You're all at fault, and you're all a bunch of idiots!