Hogprint said:
I too wish the dialogue wasn't so contentious. Some of your cited posts are WAY over the top. It looks bad on the surface, but unless you go back and read all the posts over (something I don't have the time to do) and put them in CONTEXT, then you can't just throw an abject statement up and use it as gospel. It did not go unnoticed that you went back almost a year for some of your examples. Some right in the middle of the first TA release when everything was coming to a head and tensions were at their highest. Can you blame a brother for spouting off after waiting three years for that?
Hogprint - Old posts or New, you should know as well as I do that most people are forming their opinions of the NetJets pilots based on what they are reading here. The fact that some of those posts are nine months old just makes it more aggregious. People have had nine months to come to their senses and go back and edit their posts to remove the more inflammatory and derogatory responses, yet they've chosen not to. Why? I can only surmise that they dont want to because it is truly representative of how they feel, even when removed from the 'high tensions' at the time.
As a former officer in the army I'm sure you are well familiar with the phrase - Praise in public, d*mn in private. It should go without saying that this is a public board and everyone should act accordingly.
I also find it amusing that you try and brush off these vilifying comments with the line about "can you blame a brother for spouting off after waiting three years for that?" So we are supposed to 'forgive and forget' these comments because it happened nine months ago and it was in the 'heat of the moment'????
Your position on this raises an interesting question in my mind....Does your forgiving nature extend to others outside of your union? I've seen several references on these boards to alleged comments by Mr. Santulli after the last contract was negotiated, usually along the lines of "you could have done much better". I was here when the last contract was reached and I've never seen or heard any comments by Mr. Santulli along those lines, nor do I think he would ever say anything like that - he's too savvy of a businessman to say something that incriminating when he knows that he will be negotiating with that same group three years down the road....it just doesnt make any sense.
I've personally gone through 2 union negotiations and watched multiple others from the outside over the years. IMO, this alleged comment by Mr. Santulli is more likely urban legend that's been perpetuated as bulletin board material to simply enrage the rank and file. Regardless of whether the comment is factual or fantasy, this is something that happened over 6 years ago! Are you willing to forgive and forget this transgression in the same manner that you dismiss these far more recent posts from your union brothers? If you can't then you're just being hypocritical.....
Since I am trying to keep an open mind here, and I'm also curious, I'd like to extend the same challenge to you that you gave to me.... Provide any link you can that shows Mr. Santulli telling the union that they could have done much better. I'd be satisfied with a newspaper article or a video of the statement. Surely something that provocative has to be preserved for posterity somewhere......
Hogprint said:
I'm still waiting for your response to spreading disinformation on this forum. I guess I could start posting some of the companys spin on here, but you have even covered that.
I already answered your question on the vilifying posts, so I take it you are refering to the point I made about the old and new union leadership both promising kick ass pay.
I dont care if you call it kick ass pay, industry leading pay, 90th percentile pay, etc...its just semantics. You want to split hairs and argue that the new MEC didnt use that exact language? Fine....they didnt use that exact language. Just remember.....a rose by any other name is still a rose. Your MEC's actions reveal that they are still aiming at the same target. Call it what you will, but you've got a proposal in front of you that, from my perspective, looks like a 25% increase and everyone is bemoaning the fact that its not enough. When 25% isnt enough that tells me everyone still has dollar signs in their eyes and are still thinking kick ass pay.
