National Seniority Protocol

[GeekMaster]

Every other airline would have to do the same, eliminating any competitive problems. All airlines would be stuck with the same system. Yes, DAL would be paying 12 year wages to all new hires, but so would CAL, ALA, etc...

Advantage, double set point- AA, SWA, Airtran

 

[PCL_128]

Advantage, double set point- AA, SWA, Airtran

Agreed, and that's where the true problem is with this whole thing. Without a true national union, this just won't work well. If we had all pilots in this country under the ALPA banner, then this might be able to work, but with a bunch of independent unions, ALPA's pissing into the wind. Priority one should be organizing other pilot groups and merging them into ALPA. An NSL probably won't work until that takes place.

 

[GeekMaster]

Agreed, and that's where the true problem is with this whole thing. Without a true national union, this just won't work well. If we had all pilots in this country under the ALPA banner, then this might be able to work, but with a bunch of independent unions, ALPA's pissing into the wind. Priority one should be organizing other pilot groups and merging them into ALPA. An NSL probably won't work until that takes place.

And I agree that with this attempt, ALPA would be pissing in the wind. But, I also believe that nothing would get the RLA changed by Congress faster than a pilot group with unchecked power demanding a nationwide standard wage thereby eliminating a free market economy.

I also believe that the majors won't even be able to agree amongst THEMSELVES on this resolution. Afterall, it's not ASA or PCL's job the United boys want. It's all future positions at DAL, CAL, FEDex, etc. Let's see'em sell it to THOSE first officers and junior captains.

 

[PCL_128]

But, I also believe that nothing would get the RLA changed by Congress faster than a pilot group with unchecked power demanding a nationwide standard wage thereby eliminating a free market economy.

Are you aware that many unions already have such a system? Nothing is unusual about such an idea. We're the unusual ones within the labor community with our non-transportable seniority and longevity.

 

[Jar Jar]

We need an organized airline pilot labor CARTEL. Call it OAPL.

Set it up in Mexico..

 

[JoeMerchant]

Are you aware that many unions already have such a system? Nothing is unusual about such an idea. We're the unusual ones within the labor community with our non-transportable seniority and longevity.

......no? .....really? I've been saying that for years.....This is only coming up now because a legacy group is about to lose their jobs and wants to make a lateral move.....

 

[PCL_128]

......no? .....really? I've been saying that for years.....This is only coming up now because a legacy group is about to lose their jobs and wants to make a lateral move.....

I'm not disagreeing with you on that. But that doesn't change the fact that this is an important step to take. The motivations of the proposing pilot group aren't relevant.

 

[GeekMaster]

I'm not disagreeing with you on that. But that doesn't change the fact that this is an important step to take. The motivations of the proposing pilot group aren't relevant.

UHHHH YES THEY ARE!!!! Any job protection they gain at my expense or any other pilot at ASA is totally unacceptable. They want this thing to have ANY CHANCE AT ALL? Take out the "benchmark" clause and change the representation to "each airline has one rep" and no Prater as a tiebreaker.

 

[PCL_128]

UHHHH YES THEY ARE!!!! Any job protection they gain at my expense or any other pilot at ASA is totally unacceptable. They want this thing to have ANY CHANCE AT ALL? Take out the "benchmark" clause and change the representation to "each airline has one rep" and no Prater as a tiebreaker.

Why are the motivations of the authoring pilot group important? They don't get write the final resolution, remember? All that matters is how the final resolution ends up. Until that point, it is ridiculous for anyone to be against the general concept. You can have issues with certain language in the draft resolution, but that resolution is in no way binding on anyone. Keep that in mind before you blow your top.

 

[McNasty]

You're going to stop supporting a good idea just because you think the mainline guys might try to screw you? Do you even listen to yourself? This is ridiculous. It's a good idea. You should support the idea until you find out that they're actually doing something to screw you. Preemptive anger is absurd.

Mainline pilots screwed the profesional pilot career already when they scoped themselves out of flying small planes. They were greedy and short sighted and indirectly created this whole RJ monster that they constantly complain about. That's what happens when arrogant pilots think they are smarter than management.