Midwest looking for 50 seat A/C

[Superpilot92]

You know that ERJ-XR gives me such wood. Sitting in that tube for 3+ hrs. God, I'm in ecstacy just thinking about it. Even up front, you can push the CLB button TWICE I tell you, TWICE!!

It's still an ERJ. It gives you 30 minutes of comfort over any CRJ, so that will amount to, at the outer limits, 2+00, before you want to pull your hair out. Now the ERJ pilot seats, there's a winner. About +45 of comfort!!

Not knocking XJET, but the "XR" is the poorman's E-Jet. Same range with half the comfort.

It will be interesting though. The less efficient, yet for once, lower acquisition cost CRJ vs. the more efficient ERJ from CoEx. I wonder if the 140 order would have any foreshadow...

Stay tuned and sit tight!!

Poor mans E-Jet? You must mean that the E-Jet is the poor mans 737 right!! No one here is saying anything about getting wood however you sound pretty hard up on the E-Jet.

 

[Alchemy]

Just because it can, does not mean that it should. I cringe at the thought of riding on some of your routes.

The ERJ is just as comfortable as a full 737....give me any seat on the RJ as opposed to the middle seat on a full 737 or A320 any day of the week. CRJ's are not that bad either....the dis-comfort factor on RJ's is way overblown unless you're obese....I guess that explains why Americans are complaining. To me a 10 hour road trip in a civic is no less comfortable than the same road trip in a full size van. No apologies for flying the RJ on long routes here.....if 50 seats is what the market supports then 50 seats they shall recieve.

People are just ignorant when it comes to aircraft.....This plane is so small! But it's also fast!

It's also fast? Where do they come up with this stuff......

That said, I doubt XJET will win the Midwest bid. I'm sure they will farm it out to TSA or Mesa or some other low baller, despite the supposed "customer service oriented corporate philosophy". The dollar is king.

 

[G2T]

To me a 10 hour road trip in a civic is no less comfortable than the same road trip in a full size van.

Just like the erj, I don't like sitting in the back of a civic for more than an hour either, just my opinion.

 

[BlueCanoe]

Poor mans E-Jet? You must mean that the E-Jet is the poor mans 737 right!!

I'll give you a 50% ratio. While there are 1500 nm 50 seat markets (IAD-IAH), the ERJ tube is not pax friendly. That's all I'm saying. I'm 5'8" and 165 lbs, I think the ERJ is uncomfortable for more than 2+00. It is an EXCELLENT piece of equipement for 2+00 and shorter. God knows on a 1+30 Flt the lav is full, I'd hope the jungle kings put a bigger holding tank in the XR. That'd be great. Over VUZ, the F/A locks the lav cause the bowl's half full. That's all I'm saying. I'll bet I have more ERJ time than you do, and I loved every minute of it. From a passenger's perspective, it's not a comfortable long range aircraft. There's no malice, just a fact. Have you deadheaded on a 2+30 or longer flight? If you had someone sitting next to you and you're against the window, tell me how much you loved it. Granted it's 100X more comfortable than a CRJ, but that's for another day. When it flies the mission it was designed for, it is a world-beater. However, just cause you can doesn't mean you should...

The E-Jet, I'd say is a plane Airbus or Boeing wishes they built, as the seats are the same size as Airbus coach seats. In other words, it's made for fat asses. Embraer got the passenger comfort right on this one. It is a very comfortable cabin, and what the passengers think count.

 

[U-I pilot]

The ERJ is just as comfortable as a full 737....give me any seat on the RJ as opposed to the middle seat on a full 737 or A320 any day of the week. CRJ's are not that bad either....the dis-comfort factor on RJ's is way overblown unless you're obese

I disagree... It also sucks for tall skinny guys like me. (6'3") I've Non-rev'ed on SWA and sat on ERJ and I have worlds more room on the 737, middle seat included. I get on an RJ or even some DC-9s and can barely get the tray table flat because of my knees in my throat....

After flying a bit and being in the airplane, I walk around with my head tilted sideways cause i can't stand up straight in the thing... Theres something to be said for a taller and wider cabin....

My $.02

 

[Alchemy]

You're standing up in the cabin for what, maybe 2 minutes total during boarding and deboarding? I'm 6'0" myself and my hair scrapes the ceiling if I stand up straight...but it's not terrible.....as far as the knees on the tray table...it's the same thing on a 737....I ride to work on one every week. Sure we'd all like 747 serivce between Des Moines and Milwaukee, but I'd also like 3 beautiful women waiting in my bed at the end of every 4 day....don't see either happening anytime soon.....

 

[pilotmyf]

According to our dir of ops voicemail we will be biding on a request for flying on 25 a/c for Midwest.

There is no way Midwest wants 25 planes!!!!!!!

 

[pilotmyf]

I disagree... It also sucks for tall skinny guys like me. (6'3") I've Non-rev'ed on SWA and sat on ERJ and I have worlds more room on the 737,

You would say that about a Seminole if you were still driving them.

 

[JetLinkin Park]

There is no way Midwest wants 25 planes!!!!!!!

Really?!

So what are the industry insiders telling you Benny? You seem to be firmly planted in the trenches on this one.

Oh yeah, let me add "!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!".

 

[Superpilot92]

There is no way Midwest wants 25 planes!!!!!!!

The 25 plane request is straight from our Director Of Flight Ops weekly message. He stated that Midwest came to us and asked for a proposal from us for 25 airplanes. He said we are working on that right now and should know something soon. So "way" midwest wants 25 planes. Thats all we know right now so we will see.

 

[BoilerUP]

So the XJTers are confident they are getting this flying because they offer such a premium product and they fly the super-duper XR wonder pencil. I'm average height (5'11") and the 145 is not comfortable for me over 1+30, single or two-seat side. The CRJ is marginally more comfortable for me, but once again not real nice over 1:30. Never been upfront in the Emb, but their seats can't be worse than the CRJ. EMB jumpseat SUCKS, even worse than the CRJ...but if it gets me home or to work, I could care less.

AWACers know it only makes since to get the flying, because they have a MKE MX base, a ton of crewmembers live <2 hours away, they already operate CRJs that can be picked up CHEAP from the desert, Wisconsin is in the name plus all the management cheeseheads and HQ is 1.5 drive north on US41.

You know what all this means?

Neither company is gonna get the flying...

 

[Superpilot92]

So the XJTers are confident they are getting this flying because they offer such a premium product and they fly the super-duper XR wonder pencil. I'm average height (5'11") and the 145 is not comfortable for me over 1+30, single or two-seat side. The CRJ is marginally more comfortable for me, but once again not real nice over 1:30. Never been upfront in the Emb, but their seats can't be worse than the CRJ. EMB jumpseat SUCKS, even worse than the CRJ...but if it gets me home or to work, I could care less.

AWACers know it only makes since to get the flying, because they have a MKE MX base, a ton of crewmembers live <2 hours away, they already operate CRJs that can be picked up CHEAP from the desert, Wisconsin is in the name plus all the management cheeseheads and HQ is 1.5 drive north on US41.

You know what all this means?

Neither company is gonna get the flying...[/quote]

Your probably right its probably going to go to Mesa.

 

[BluDevAv8r]

Considering we were the launch customer for the a/c we got them at a better rate than anyone else anyway. The 200 "basis point" only equals 2% increase in the lease rate.....which puts it very close to the other 50 seat operators.

According to our dir of ops voicemail we will be biding on a request for flying on 25 a/c for Midwest.

McPickle,

Just for clarification...the 200 basis points isn't a 2% increase in the lease rate but rather - the interest rate that the lease rate is calculated off of.

From the 2005 XJT 10K (annual report):

On December 28, 2005, Continental notified us that it would withdraw 69 aircraft from the capacity purchase agreement beginning in December 2006 and ending in June 2007. The capacity purchase agreement gives us up to nine months from the notice date to decide if we want to retain the aircraft. If we choose to retain the aircraft, the capacity purchase agreement contains a provision for the interest rate implicit in calculating the scheduled lease payments we make to Continental to increase by 200 basis points.

Remember guys, we are talking about how we calculate the interest rate...not the lease rate itself (or monthly aircraft rent line). Those are 2 different things. Aircraft leases are typically calculated off of LIBOR (London Interbank Offered Rate) plus some basis point premium and often are adjusted either quarterly or semi-annually. Lastly, if you look at the XJT 10K a second time, you will see some information on this isse, pasted below:

As of December 31, 2005, we had firm commitments to acquire eight Embraer regional jets, which we expect to sublease from Continental (three of which have been delivered as of February 27, 2006). Changes in interest rates may impact the actual cost to us for the related leasing transactions in the future. However, under our capacity purchase agreement, Airlines' block hour rates will be adjusted higher or lower to reflect any changes in its aircraft rental rates. We also have potential interest rate exposure with respect to our loan agreement with EDC, which bears interest at the six-month LIBOR plus 1.75% per annum. We no longer have any interest rate exposure related to our note payable to Continental as we expect to pay off this obligation on March 31, 2006 and the interest rate applicable was set in December 2005. The impact of market risk is estimated using a hypothetical increase in interest rates by 100 basis points for our variable rate long-term debts. Based on this hypothetical assumption, we would have incurred an additional $1.0 million and $2.0 million in interest expense for the years ended December 31, 2005 and 2004, respectively. However, we believe that interest rate increase on our variable rate long-term debt would be offset by increases in interest income. We do not hold long-term interest-sensitive assets and therefore the value of our assets is not subject to interest rate fluctuations. We do not purchase or hold any derivative financial instruments to protect against the effects of changes in interest rates.

I hope this stuff helps. It might actually end up confusing some...but at least this isn't information based on conjecture or rumor but rather - factual SEC filings.

-Neal

 

[145 Lawndart]

Damn it Neal, How many times do I have to tell you.

Stop confusing us with the facts! It takes all the fun out of it.:laugh:

I hope training is going well.

Say hello to Jimmy and AJ for me.:angryfire

 

[punkpilot48]

I think you guys are forgettikng the point about airplanes.....all of the seats suck.

If your on a rj its small and cramped and you have to listen to the guy next to you complain how he is too important to be on an airplane this small.

If you are on a 737 or A320 you are going to be in the middle seat where the headphone jack does not work and you have to hear the guy next to you tell you all about how he travles all the time and how he thinks an airline should be run.

If you are on a 757 or 767 you are on an exit aisle where even though the gate agent is happy to have hooked you up with the leg room of the exit aisle it is severly taken up by the huge door.

Whenever you ride in first class you seem to have gotten the seat that is broke and the guy next to you keeps you up the whole time telling you that he is to important to fly on one of these airplanes he should have a smaller personal airplane and he tells you how the airline should be run.

And if you are on one of your own companies airplanes...well dang. They want you to sit up front where the sun blinds you and you always have distractions away from your sleeping or your usa today.

 

[DOJET1]

Poor mans E-Jet? You must mean that the E-Jet is the poor mans 737 right!! No one here is saying anything about getting wood however you sound pretty hard up on the E-Jet.

get a life relax ...

 

[DiverDriver]

There is no way Midwest wants 25 planes!!!!!!!

Well, that's COEX and AWAC has put out a statement also saying the bid is for between 15-25 aircraft.

Who knows. How do you know it's not 25?

 

[ils2minimums]

how about this?

Maybe the 25 airplanes are intended to replace the ENTIRE Skyway fleet and just lease the whole commuter unit instead of owning it...

 

[DiverDriver]

Maybe the 25 airplanes are intended to replace the ENTIRE Skyway fleet and just lease the whole commuter unit instead of owning it...

Eastshore aviation just sold off stock in US Air and might be looking for a place to invest it. It worked with US Air maybe they are going to try a repeat. Invest in Midwest Airlines or buy Skyway then put in our -200s which would free up room on the US side to add 900s?

I'm going with that rumor. Yes, I started it.

 

[pilotmyf]

Well, that's COEX and AWAC has put out a statement also saying the bid is for between 15-25 aircraft.

Who knows. How do you know it's not 25?

Midwest is too damn cheap for:
1. COEX or AWAC ---- you guys are too expensive!!!!!

2. Shell out money for 25 a/c!!!!

15 a/c is a big difference from 25 a/c