Jet Blue firing???

[Capn Mike]

$350,000 to hire and train one pilot? I thought you guys are efficient....better get that cost down!

But Airbus is picking up the tab along with the airplanes, fuel and gate expenses.

I could use a new rollaboard. Does anyone know if Airbus has an account set up with Travelpro???

 

[B-atch]

"I told you so" (to be placed in a time capsule for future refference)

 

[8vATE]

Hmmmm....


Unions are a "safety net" according to B-Atch....???



I was an ALPA member for 14 years with three different companies...
There were some advantages/benefits and costs/disadvantages in my opinion during my membership...

A LOT depended on your local leadership..... the pilot group's relationship with management and the type of carrier you worked for ... (regional, major or freight... I did all of them...)

As far as unions being a "career" safety net...

Ask the EAL, PAA and AAA pilots how they feel.....
gone, gone, and almost gone (retirement definitely gone)....

At my present employer which is non-union.... some of the biggest voices FOR ALPA are some characters with poor attitudes and even worse piloting skills...... I believe they just want a union to protect them from getting
rightfully disciplined or terminated....

 

[B-atch]

Imagine what would HAVE happened if A union were not present at these carriers...You are right, a union is as good as it's members and it's elected officials. As far as protecting a few bad apples goes, yes occationally it does occur. But wait untill you are charged with a questionable infraction by the FEDS, who is going to defend you then. JB mngt. I DON'T THINK SOOOO! You are on you'r own....Loss of license insurance?

 

[B-atch]

OH, I forgot....Merger and aquisitions..Ask the non-union carrier folks (that are still employed) what seniority they now hold at their new carrier(ex. Challenge Air Cargo, among others) What does JB SCOPE clause say pertaining to this LITTLE subject...Perhaps IGNORANCE is one of the sought after qualities that the JB HR people seek..

 

[Capn Mike]

OH, I forgot....Merger and aquisitions..Ask the non-union carrier folks (that are still employed) what seniority they now hold at their new carrier(ex. Challenge Air Cargo, among others) What does JB SCOPE clause say pertaining to this LITTLE subject...Perhaps IGNORANCE is one of the sought after qualities that the JB HR people seek..

So should you also ask the TWA pilots their view of how they faired on the merger/aquisition???

 

[sleeve]

all I can say is I'll take any airline where the CEO and founder of an airline has it in him to ask how a gate agents mom is feeling because he knows she's been feeling ill..How many CEO's at other airlines know gate agents by first name....even at my lolely regional the management is to important to carry on a normal conversation with the little people...

its not the money or future predictions...i want to be treated good now...

its amazing how every pilot becomes and instant financial advisor or career advisor whenever they want to....I might as well go to Wall Street now so i can make some real money....

 

[FDJ2]

If for some reason the management/labor formula ever breaks..all bets are off!

By then it's too late, with no contract management could change pay, benefits, work rules, etc. at will. By the time you got a union certified, the damage has already been done. Until your hastily put together union files a section six letter, management can proceed at will permantly changing all of the above until you manage to get your first PWA several years later. Good luck if that ever happens.

 

[FDJ2]

So should you also ask the TWA pilots their view of how they faired on the merger/aquisition???

The TWA pilots voted away their own PWA protections on the promise that the APA would be fair. This was done in order to fascilitate their acquisition by AA. With no contract language protecting their rights the TWA pilots had to rely on the generousity of the APA, much like any other pilot group that has no successorship/change of control language in their PWA. Your example only reenforces the need for strong contract language protecting your rights.

 

[thav8r]

Thats true about scope...

BUT there is a major poison pill provision with our contracts that would make a merger beyond expensive. If that happens, Im fine with that and if someone wants to activate the poison pill of oru scope provision so be it.

As a former merged ALPA member (various times now) there werent too many things I would want to take advantage of ever again with that provision.

Im not ignorant, nor am I unfamililar with the law. I have lived mergers, been through court (and arbitrators) agreements. Besides...didnt do much good for the TWA American folks. Not much love there and no one would say they were ignorant.