It's Official...The 717's are going to Delta

[Homer Jay]

Does the DL TA not raise your rates dramatically? DL TA rates look like about a 50% pay increase for a 12 year United 320 FO.

Who gives a rats a$$ about rates when you give away so much flying!? I'm all for larger RJ's provided they are flown by mainline. I really hope the majority see this for what it is...a POS.

 

[KarmaPolice]

I look at what you guys are trying to do at UCAL with the RJs, and we just totally BONED you. We should be concerned about the welfare of our profession in general, and that means jobs at mainline. It will be purely selfish reasons if we at Delta pass this TA. I apologize in advance to the rest of you. I filled out my survey, I called my reps, I will vote no, but this P.O.S. will probably pass.

 

[waveflyer]

Which is what I was advocating a month and a half ago and is what got ALPA started developing contingency plans for this... it was the last thing I did on the NC before shuffling to CCC.

That's why we have a plan in place, and now that we know how the deal is structured, the MEC can move forward dealing with it. The only thing we know for sure, with the Southwest response to Jim's letter of yesterday, is that it's not going to be anything quick in terms of "benefit" to offset this massive loss.

Be patient, and try not to get your blood pressure up over things we can't control. They made a business decision that is different than what they told us during negotiations and road shows. How they deal with that and the fallout in terms of employee morale that they have to integrate remains to be seen.

I remain hopeful that something positive comes of this for all of us...

Hopeful, yet still thinking swa ( all of us not just mgmt) will respond in any other way if a group attempts to hold our culture as leverage against swa. This was always a probability Lear- you will do your members a disservice if you approach it too militantly- look out for yourselves- but what's bolder above is what got you a very real visit from herb and Colleen last time- our culture is NOT a point of leverage for ANY group here.

 

[nwaf16dude]

If this TA passes, it will be the selfish senior butt holes who sell out the entire pilot profession. THERE IS NO REASON TO GIVE ONE INCH ON SCOPE! WE ARE MAKING BILLIONS!!!!!

There's really not much in this TA for the senior guys. Pay raise is minimal, only 1% increase to the DC. Most of the benefit is to reserve guys and guys that might be able to upgrade to the left seat of a 717.

 

[humveedriver]

Hopeful, yet still thinking swa ( all of us not just mgmt) will respond in any other way if a group attempts to hold our culture as leverage against swa. This was always a probability Lear- you will do your members a disservice if you approach it too militantly- look out for yourselves- but what's bolder above is what got you a very real visit from herb and Colleen last time- our culture is NOT a point of leverage for ANY group here.

Stop posting this garbage. We are supposed to be on the same team now. You don't have an empathetic bone your body. Good for you. This still has to pass the Delta pilot group first.

 

[Jiminmem]

If this TA passes, it will be the selfish senior butt holes who sell out the entire pilot profession. THERE IS NO REASON TO GIVE ONE INCH ON SCOPE! WE ARE MAKING BILLIONS!!!!!

It will take more than the senior group to pass. There is also very little for the senior group to get very excited over.

 

[Lear70]

Hopeful, yet still thinking swa ( all of us not just mgmt) will respond in any other way if a group attempts to hold our culture as leverage against swa. This was always a probability Lear- you will do your members a disservice if you approach it too militantly- look out for yourselves- but what's bolder above is what got you a very real visit from herb and Colleen last time- our culture is NOT a point of leverage for ANY group here.

Don't look at me, I'm not involved anymore. I only do contract compliance, not involved in the direct negotiating anymore, the new MEC Chairman changed out the entire negotiating committee about a month ago, the formal MEC vote was last week ratifying the changes.

However, failing to realize the very REAL fallout in morale on the AirTran side of this would be a mistake. You cannot think that people who bid the 717, either because they wanted their relative seniority against each other bidding or because they wanted the CA seat can see this as a positive in any way, shape, or form.

In the future it likely will help with the bottom financial line with Southwest which, in turn, helps our job stability, but in the near-term, it costs hundreds of thousands of dollars to each displaced CA, and is contrary to everything we were told during the SLI voting.

You can't tell me you don't understand how that might upset people...? Really??? Southwest management has made a decision and the impact it has on those affected had to be realized and taken into account. Whether or not anything is done about it is the question... To act like there is no affect is simply disingenuous, just as if we acted as if there was no affect to the SWA pilots due to zero growth (or even net hull loss) over the next few years.

Not holding your culture hostage... just stating the very real truth that people are mad as hell, and SWA can either choose to ignore that or do something about it. What they choose to do or not do will affect how those people view their new employer. That's how life works.

 

[boeing717]

However, failing to realize the very REAL fallout in morale on the AirTran side of this would be a mistake. You cannot think that people who bid the 717, either because they wanted their relative seniority against each other bidding or because they wanted the CA seat can see this as a
Not holding your culture hostage... just stating the very real truth that people are mad as hell, and SWA can either choose to ignore that or do something about it. What they choose to do or not do will affect how those people view their new employer. That's how life works.

Please get over it. You are the cause of the fallout in morale. You will never be happy even though you wanted to be a SWA pilot all your life. They are tired of listening to you. Why not be like PCL. He accepted it and he is below you. Maybe you should talk to him and he can make you feel better.

 

[Lear70]

Please get over it. You are the cause of the fallout in morale. You will never be happy even though you wanted to be a SWA pilot all your life. They are tired of listening to you. Why not be like PCL. He accepted it and he is below you. Maybe you should talk to him and he can make you feel better.

So let me get this straight...

I post for people to standby, not get riled up, and wait to see what can be worked out, and *I* am the cause of the fallout in morale?

You don't think that taking away several hundred CA seats suddenly might have just a WEE bit of something to do with morale?

You've been calling me out specifically on multiple forums for years now, why don't you find a new hobby? Oh wait, you have one of those, the failing lawsuit against ALPA that's still pending...

 

[PCL_128]

So, the question remains.... Would this trigger the AirTran fragmentation policy allowing a certain amount of AirTran pilots to go to Delta under the ALPA merger policy?

PCL-128?

Well, I'm not an attorney, so I can't interpret the language as well as they could. But as best I can tell, since there is no overall reduction in the number of airframes, I don't think the language has been triggered. The language requires a reduction in the fleet equivalent to 30% of the system block hours to trigger the fragmentation clause.