AA717driver
A simpler time...
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Interview lunch went well I think
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TCThrottlebender
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English
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Thanks for the backup gear guy. I was referring to you in my post!
There are many naysayers who are ill-informed about corporate and charter ops, that just cannot believe "lowtimers" can be insured. I got into a heated discussion with a certain arrogant poster here about a former co-worker of mine that was a Citationjet captain (single pilot) at 1500 hours total time. Most of his flight time before the CJ was as a Conquest (turbine) PIC. He was easily insurable at 1500 TT. So, this stuff does happen all the time. The company hired based on how well one fit in, not on flight experience.
I was hired as a CJ 135 PIC (single pilot) at 2500 hours. That's low time in some books, but the way I see it, I was 1000 hours behind! Should'a gotten the job when I had 1500 hours, to keep up with my former co-worker.
There are many naysayers who are ill-informed about corporate and charter ops, that just cannot believe "lowtimers" can be insured. I got into a heated discussion with a certain arrogant poster here about a former co-worker of mine that was a Citationjet captain (single pilot) at 1500 hours total time. Most of his flight time before the CJ was as a Conquest (turbine) PIC. He was easily insurable at 1500 TT. So, this stuff does happen all the time. The company hired based on how well one fit in, not on flight experience.
I was hired as a CJ 135 PIC (single pilot) at 2500 hours. That's low time in some books, but the way I see it, I was 1000 hours behind! Should'a gotten the job when I had 1500 hours, to keep up with my former co-worker.
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LAZYB
Time wounds all heels.
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Insurance, it all depends...
There aren't that many hard and fast rules for min. pilot time and insurance. There does tend to be some average ranges. BUT most of these "rules" are for the newly started flight department - with unfamilar pilots on board, the "known" and nefarious operator, Pt 135 operators with a pilot turnover, etc,etc (there's always a story there somewhere).
Most of your Fortune 100 flight departments and quality VIP operations are going to have the rubber stamp - As approved by the Chief Pilot - for a pilot requirement.
There aren't that many hard and fast rules for min. pilot time and insurance. There does tend to be some average ranges. BUT most of these "rules" are for the newly started flight department - with unfamilar pilots on board, the "known" and nefarious operator, Pt 135 operators with a pilot turnover, etc,etc (there's always a story there somewhere).
Most of your Fortune 100 flight departments and quality VIP operations are going to have the rubber stamp - As approved by the Chief Pilot - for a pilot requirement.
English
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Don't sweat it man. I was just in the right place at the right time. It's surely not because I'm some super-pilot or anything. I feel blessed to have gotten the experience I have in a short time. I could not have done it without the help of my fellow aviators. Corporate is all who you know, and when you know them. It will happen....just keep plugging along and the right job will open up. BTW, I don't care what job you get, we'll still complain. Can I get an Amen?Throttlebender said:
flyfastinmy10
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Guys,
Don't worry about insurance or time. Everyone hears the stories of low time pilots getting hired. It happens. It happened to me. I was hired as a C560 Fo with 979 hours. I flew my azz off and upgraded 10 months later. six months after that I was typed in the X at 1800 hours. At 4300 hours I got hired by a major and I'm now back in the right seat only this time it's an A320.
This is not one of those stories that happened 30 years ago. I started flying professionally 5 years ago.
Insurance companies have waivers and allow competent operators to make that call.
Good Luck and don't worry about the GIV ride, they are just looking for basic skills.
Don't worry about insurance or time. Everyone hears the stories of low time pilots getting hired. It happens. It happened to me. I was hired as a C560 Fo with 979 hours. I flew my azz off and upgraded 10 months later. six months after that I was typed in the X at 1800 hours. At 4300 hours I got hired by a major and I'm now back in the right seat only this time it's an A320.
This is not one of those stories that happened 30 years ago. I started flying professionally 5 years ago.
Insurance companies have waivers and allow competent operators to make that call.
Good Luck and don't worry about the GIV ride, they are just looking for basic skills.
Throttlebender
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Flying Illini
Hit me Peter!
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low time
This is not corporate, but I am an F/O on a 727 flying night cargo, hired at 550 hrs, upgrading this summer with ATP mins and 1000 hrs in the right seat, never had a problem with low time, all about who you know and how u fit in. Got a job offer for pt 91 Hawker 800XP F/O, turned it down due to low pay. I agree with the others, I am living proof that you can be hired with no time. Good Luck! If you want it bad enough you can have it!
This is not corporate, but I am an F/O on a 727 flying night cargo, hired at 550 hrs, upgrading this summer with ATP mins and 1000 hrs in the right seat, never had a problem with low time, all about who you know and how u fit in. Got a job offer for pt 91 Hawker 800XP F/O, turned it down due to low pay. I agree with the others, I am living proof that you can be hired with no time. Good Luck! If you want it bad enough you can have it!
XSWANN@240
Watch this! hold my beer
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Throttlebender
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Throttlebender,
Good luck with your job prospect! Like you mentioned before, alot of finding a good 91 corporate job is networking and being there at the right time and place.
With 3000 hrs, ATP and some jet time you should have no problems.
I recently had a part 135 checkride in a Challenger 604 at F.S. For the ride, I was paired with a young 650 hr F.S. intern as my copilot. I was a little concerned when I was informed of this fact. I was actually surprised when the guy did an excellent job for me. The guy knew the a/c systems, checklists, SOPs, and callouts. I made it a point to tell him what a great job he did and wish him a good career in the future.
(THIS IS THE PART WHERE I'LL CATCH HECK)
Now that being said, there is no way a 1000 hr pilot should be in the right seat of a professionally flown GV corporate jet in my opinion! Most large F-500 departments will hire only co-captians for an a/c. If a 91/135 company is hiring such a lowtime pilot for such a position......they are more concerned about saving money then passenger safety in my opinion.
I previously mentioned that my F.S. intern copilot did a great job in the 604 sim. But there is no way I would put my family on an a/c with him as a crew. (This is a litmus test for me.) When it comes down to it, there is not the level of experience and decision making skills to be considered a profesional flight crew. What if the PIC was incapicitated, there was an emergency, and the weather was down.
OK, let me have it! Am I right or wrong?
SCT
PS- Don't compare military pilots to what we are doing. It's apples and oranges.
Good luck with your job prospect! Like you mentioned before, alot of finding a good 91 corporate job is networking and being there at the right time and place.
With 3000 hrs, ATP and some jet time you should have no problems.
I recently had a part 135 checkride in a Challenger 604 at F.S. For the ride, I was paired with a young 650 hr F.S. intern as my copilot. I was a little concerned when I was informed of this fact. I was actually surprised when the guy did an excellent job for me. The guy knew the a/c systems, checklists, SOPs, and callouts. I made it a point to tell him what a great job he did and wish him a good career in the future.
(THIS IS THE PART WHERE I'LL CATCH HECK)
Now that being said, there is no way a 1000 hr pilot should be in the right seat of a professionally flown GV corporate jet in my opinion! Most large F-500 departments will hire only co-captians for an a/c. If a 91/135 company is hiring such a lowtime pilot for such a position......they are more concerned about saving money then passenger safety in my opinion.
I previously mentioned that my F.S. intern copilot did a great job in the 604 sim. But there is no way I would put my family on an a/c with him as a crew. (This is a litmus test for me.) When it comes down to it, there is not the level of experience and decision making skills to be considered a profesional flight crew. What if the PIC was incapicitated, there was an emergency, and the weather was down.
OK, let me have it! Am I right or wrong?
SCT
PS- Don't compare military pilots to what we are doing. It's apples and oranges.
XSWANN@240
Watch this! hold my beer
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SCT,
I do agree. There is a big difference between the simulated world of the box and the real thing. There is no replacement for the real world experience. But, if it was you that had that lucky break in the early stages of your career you wouldn't think twice of it. As I am one who paid my dues in this profession I have no objection for others who did skip along. As long they are not cocky about it. Yes, I would think twice about an low time co-pilot in a G-IV but wouldn't blame him for obtaining his position. Think about.... Who does the hiring in a flight department?
Only my 2 cents.....
I do agree. There is a big difference between the simulated world of the box and the real thing. There is no replacement for the real world experience. But, if it was you that had that lucky break in the early stages of your career you wouldn't think twice of it. As I am one who paid my dues in this profession I have no objection for others who did skip along. As long they are not cocky about it. Yes, I would think twice about an low time co-pilot in a G-IV but wouldn't blame him for obtaining his position. Think about.... Who does the hiring in a flight department?
Only my 2 cents.....
Throttlebender
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In general I would agree. There is NO substitute for experience. However, there are those people out there that have a "cool head". You know, those that you can just tell stay calm dury crisis. That's who I want as a second crew member. It doesn't matter if they have 500 or 5000 hrs. It's if you know they can take care of business when necessary. Now, the trick is to be able to regonize them when they come along. I've run across some real bone heads and also across some really impressive people. Have a base line but also be smart enough to see talent and maturity.
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