Interview lunch went well I think

[slowtation capt]

I would have to agree with SCT that a 1000 hr pilot at a professional company is a little to low. Can someone with that time fly the aircraft. Sure they can, all planes fly the same. But what about going into TEB at 5pm when the weather is down and NY ATC is doing their usual. Where is this person going to be, probably back at the airport where they took off from.

How do the commuters train their pilots, well use the autopilot at 400' agl after takeoff until DH. No thinking involved on their part, company does all their planning and have you ever heard on the radio, "stby have to check with company" They don't think, they are monkeys.

 

[English]

How do the commuters train their pilots, well use the autopilot at 400' agl after takeoff until DH. No thinking involved on their part, company does all their planning and have you ever heard on the radio, "stby have to check with company" They don't think, they are monkeys.

I take it you've never flown for a part 121 carrier?

The only place that ever trained me to turn the autopilot on after takeoff was FlightSafety, single pilot for a CE525.

I was a 1000 hour pilot in the right seat of a Saab for a regional (I take it you mean commuter to be the same as a regional airline). Within my first three months there, I was flying out of DFW, MIA, JFK, BOS and LAX. I wasn't lost - no big deal, really. Hand flying was the norm until 10,000 feet, autopilot on, then off during the descent. Now, I'm sure my first few captains kept an eye on me, but I flew the plane the same as everyone did. No one knew my flight time unless I volunteered it.

It's not brain surgery, it's flying an airplane.

 

[Stearmandriver]

It's not brain surgery, it's flying an airplane.

My point exactly. Seems like some people try to make this job out to be more than it is. I'm not saying we aren't highly trained professionals (who should be paid and treated accordingly), but c'mon, what we do isn't a moonshot back in the days of slide rules. It's not launching off a boat at night in horrible weather and going into combat alone. It's not driving a DC-3 from one grass, oil-can lit strip to another in horrible icing conditions. We fly big, stable, reliable, and (in most cases) wonderfully equipped airplanes straight and level from one modern airport to another, most of the time above the significant weather.

As for this:

I would have to agree with SCT that a 1000 hr pilot at a professional company is a little to low. Can someone with that time fly the aircraft. Sure they can, all planes fly the same. But what about going into TEB at 5pm when the weather is down and NY ATC is doing their usual. Where is this person going to be, probably back at the airport where they took off from.

I do that with new FO's all the time, only into EWR which is probably worse. Most of the time new guys like to handfly approaches, and I can't say I've ever had a problem with it. I mean, if you can't handfly a busy approach in low weather, what training department is gonna turn you lose on line?

Anyway, whatever, it doesn't matter to me. I suppose the more people there are out there that regard lower time guys as incompetent, the less competition there is for mid-time guys like myself. Just doesn't seem quite fair, is all. How many times have you heard that good departments don't hire the pilot, but the person? I think if I were hiring someone, I'd sooner take the lower time guy I liked (assuming demonstration of basic skills) and accept that he might have some learning to do, before I'd take the higher time guy that just didn't seem like he'd fit in as well. But, what do I know...

 

[FracCapt]

I was a 1000 hour pilot in the right seat of a Saab for a regional (I take it you mean commuter to be the same as a regional airline). Within my first three months there, I was flying out of DFW, MIA, JFK, BOS and LAX. I wasn't lost - no big deal, really.

The way I look at it is....if there's a place for a 1000 hour CFI to be flying jets, it's at a 121 carrier, where things are extremely structured and fewer decisions to be made. The corporate world(which generally has very little structure, except for some flight depts that generally do NOT hire low timers anyways), in my not so humble opinion, is no place for those guys. I admit, I've flown with some low timers as SIC's on contract gigs, but I knew in advance I was essentially single pilot. Yes, those pilots went through FSI for the SIC checks in those aircraft....but some were very low time, and way behind the airplane. Of most would probably say I'm a total pr!ck of a Captain....and they would be right....but at least I bought the beer!

Don't throw that tired old argument that military pilots are in command of a single seat fighter at 300 hours....last I checked, civilian training is NOWHERE NEAR that of military training. Plus, those single seaters don't carry pax, and all have an option we don't have in the civilian world.....ejection..

 

[FracCapt]

I do that with new FO's all the time, only into EWR which is probably worse.

Ok...I've seen you make numerous comments about flying with low time FO's all the time...your "Current position" in your profile shows E145fo. How long have you been a Captain on the ERJ?

 

[English]

Of most would probably say I'm a total pr!ck of a Captain....and they would be right....but at least I bought the beer!

Hey, no name calling of the guy who buys the beer!

 

[FracCapt]

Hey, no name calling of the guy who buys the beer!

It's fair if they call me certain names....after all, those names are things that I call myself in my initial brief with a new pilot. They can't say I didn't give 'em fair warning!

 

[Stearmandriver]

Ok...I've seen you make numerous comments about flying with low time FO's all the time...your "Current position" in your profile shows E145fo. How long have you been a Captain on the ERJ?

LOL thats pretty old... maybe someday I'll update it. I was a prop captain for a couple years before 9/11, downgraded to the right seat of the rj for a while following 9/11 so as not to have to sit reserve... been back in the left seat (of the jet) for around a year now.

 

[bigD]

These threads always interest me because my flight time puts me in the "incompetent low time pilot" category that people talk about. I meet the minimums of all the regionals now, and sometimes I think about how I'd manage flying some regional jet, or Saab, or whatever else. The Type A pilot in me wants to say, "of course, I can handle it!"

But then I find myself getting slam dunked into HOU at 9pm, the rain hitting the windshield is deafening, the plane is bouncing around to the point where I can't get a good grab on the PTT to tell approach that my vector is gonna put me into some red. The frequency is jammed with everyone else b!tching about their vectors as well. Meanwhile I'm cursing the controller for keeping me so high, the finicky RAM engines and the 50 degree CHT range that the chief pilot dictates to me, the 140 knot Vle, the approach plates that just fell to the floor, the fact that I'm having to rap on the glass of the HSI to get the glideslope to unstick, my INOP autopilot, and finally my football team for its inability to beat Oklahoma.

And so I gotta admit - at times like these, I'm pretty close to the limit of what I can handle. And this is in a cabin class piston twin. Not some fast complicated jet, or even a turboprop. Back when they had just over a 1000 hours, Stearmandriver and English were likely better pilots than I am now, so for them, maybe they're right. And really, the job *is* easy 95% of the time. But every once in awhile weather, fatigue, or whatever else makes me happy that I'm flying what I am, and not being a liability in something larger and faster.

 

[SCT]

BigD,

I think you would find flying a small jet easier in some aspects, then flying a cabin class piston twin. I don't think 1000hr pilots are incomp., but like in any career they are learning and gaining exp. (And I know that you cannot lump everyone's experience into one basket.) When I was at 1000-1500 hrs and flying a light twin, I was not ready to jump into a large jet.

I just don't see a trend of large 91 departments hiring 1000hr pilots into the right seats of large corporate jets. (Yes, there are exceptions.) Most seem to be hiring middle age guys with jet time who will fit into their "company mold". There are plenty of these guys unemployed to pick from that pool. If a chief pilot is hiring a 1000hr pilot into the right seat of a Gulfstream, Falcon, etc they are more interested in saving money then safety. I would like to see him explain his decision to the CEO and his family when they are getting on the a/c. In my experiences, the CEOs I've flown for are alot more interested in safety then money.

If this was a trend, my boss could get rid of 1/2 of us overpaid middle age guys and replace us with CFIs from the local FBO......this move would offset the higher fuel prices in his budget for the year. I'm sure they would sit in a 604 for 30K a year.......but this WILL also drag down the industry wages.

Just my opinion, but my ex thinks I'm an idiot, anyway!!
SCT