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mt2 said:
Is it possible some of hiring delays are due to this integration of NJI/NJA lists ??
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I highly doubt that. If it is going to delay anything, it is going to delay upgrades. I anticipate those upgrade delays to be minimal. Not too many NJI guys are going to come to NJA. Anyone want to back me up on this?
 
That'll depend on how long it will be before integration is complete and how many upgrade within the Gulfstream fleet in the interim. I'm guessing there will be a few that might bid a smaller fleet, including a few that are sick of international flying. The more interesting question for me is how many junior guys will leave the company (as some have said they will) if they miss out on the left seat of the IV.
 
gutshotdraw said:
how many junior guys will leave the company (as some have said they will) if they miss out on the left seat of the IV.
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That will depend directly on how many positions are available in the market place. A 1 or 2 year FO could potentially make hundred's of thousands more over a 20 year period on the "open market". But we all know the risks that move entails.

When its all over... 99% of the FO's will make their decision (in this order) based on:

  • needs of their family
  • quality of life issues
  • job protection
  • long term benefits
  • salary
But that's just my .02.


Wolf

(ps. had a wonder hour long talk with the X crew in VNY two days ago... we need to keep these open dialogs going, so I encourage both groups to actively seek out the other when we cross on the ramp).
 
I would like to know how long you NJA guy's think this merge is going to take? I also think it's going to be a long time, and would like to see it happen within a yr. I can't wait to see the extra bene's coming our way. My truck is a yr old, I could use another one soon.:laugh:
 
True enough BV. But I've had two junior F/O's tell me already they'll punch out if they don't make the cutoff date. I'm hoping they will re-evaluate once the details are published since I believe they would be better served long term by sticking around, even if it means upgrade in 3 or 4 years on a different fleet.
 
gutshotdraw said:
True enough BV. But I've had two junior F/O's tell me already they'll punch out if they don't make the cutoff date. I'm hoping they will re-evaluate once the details are published since I believe they would be better served long term by sticking around, even if it means upgrade in 3 or 4 years on a different fleet.
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I believe that is pretty short sighted of them. If they think they can make more, have better benefits, more time off and better QOL on the open market then let them go. Or maybe they are so hung up on being G-whiz capts that they can't see the forest through the trees.
 
That's a lot of practice rounds amigo....
 
RTRHD/GUT/Wolf, Not sure if ya'll heard this yet,

I just got word that some info on the merge may be announced as early as next week. Only the VSL will be addressed at this time. No changes of any kind until 2010 is expected as of now. If this is all true, RTS is going to drag this out as I stated in an earlier post. :)

 
I hope they don't expect us to start paying dues until we're getting hourly overtime, holiday pay, etc. It'll be a long wait otherwise.
 
And yes, I had heard about the announcement earlier. Still waiting to see something official before I pass judgement.
 
:) I'm thinking the same thing. NO changes until 2010, is what I was told, which means to me that no one is going to be in a hurry. No dues, No hour O.T. No holiday pay, etc. This is going to cost the company money, so they will drag their feet I think. Most of the NJA guy's think this is going to happen fast. There are a lot of questions that need to be answered
 
NOTHING but making the VSL official is going to happen shortly . . . WAY too much to negotiate to make anything else happen . . . couple years is the word.
 
We've had the VSL for months now - if nothing else is going to change whats the point of making it 'official'?
 
Dirty Dingus said:
RTRHD/GUT/Wolf, Not sure if ya'll heard this yet,

I just got word that some info on the merge may be announced as early as next week. Only the VSL will be addressed at this time. No changes of any kind until 2010 is expected as of now. If this is all true, RTS is going to drag this out as I stated in an earlier post. :)
Click to expand...

RTS can drag his feet all he wants, remember that NJASAP can and will file a single carrier petition with the NMB as soon as November of 2008 if they feel in any way that RTS is going to play games! I am not priviledged to know what NJASAP plans on doing at this juncture, but I assure you that they won't stand for any bs. If the decision is placed in the hands of the NMB, it might not turn out so well for either side.
 
I think I'll just wait and see what will happen. Where are you guy's getting that everything has to happen Nov 08????? And why do ya'll even care, Your not in a G, and most likely won't be there for a long time, even if you wanted to. No flame, just wondering why everyone is so concerned about NJI, and this VSL list. Most everyone is going to move DOWN about 300 numbers. This is great entertainment boy's, Please keep GUESSING, what's going to happen Nov 08 :laugh:

:beer:Cheers
 
I pretty much feel how you do Dingus, if Im reading it right.

Lets break it down;

I think I'll just wait and see what will happen. Where are you guy's getting that everything has to happen Nov 08?????

I think that was part of the IBB deal with RTS. Nov 2008 is when we can file for the single carrier status. (I think?)

And why do ya'll even care, Your not in a G, and most likely won't be there for a long time, even if you wanted to.

I don't, doesn't really effect me that I know of.


No flame, just wondering why everyone is so concerned about NJI, and this VSL list. Most everyone is going to move DOWN about 300 numbers.

Yep, thats about it as far as I go.

Have a good one.
 
;) Semore, You got it right buddy, NOTHING is GOING to happen by NOV 08, other than the merge of the VSL. That is just a deadline to be able to file for single carrier, Nothing MORE!!!!(that's what I understand). If anyone at NJA thinks we at NJI will pay any kind of dues without getting all the same bene's as NJA, WELL MY FRIEND THAT IS A BIG laugh!!! LET"S keep guessing, like I said, this is great entertainment :laugh:
 
Why would people at NJA think you (NJI pilots) would not receive the same benefits if you become dues-paying members? The idea is that we become one list, one pilot group. We all pay dues and are all under the same rules and benefits. Honestly I have no idea where you come up with this stuff.
 
Why should a NJI pilot join NJASAP? All I see is a decrease in pay by paying dues and no additional benefits. The holiday pay wouldn't even make up for the dues
 
tk855 said:
RTS can drag his feet all he wants, remember that NJASAP can and will file a single carrier petition with the NMB as soon as November of 2008 if they feel in any way that RTS is going to play games! I am not priviledged to know what NJASAP plans on doing at this juncture, but I assure you that they won't stand for any bs. If the decision is placed in the hands of the NMB, it might not turn out so well for either side.
Click to expand...

If I can put on the jailhouse lawyer hat for a moment, the fact that Santulli will apparently exercise his option to combine the seniority lists makes a single carrier petition to the NMB, as they say in legalese, moot. The option Santulli is signing specifically recognizes NJA and NJI as a "single transportation system" thereby rendering a filing by NJASAP pointless.

NJI pilots have been told, as recently as the middle of last week, that the official announcement is imminent and that the phase-in period to convert NJI to union work rules will take 12-24 months to accomplish. It's not bs and it's not stalling. As previously stated in this forum, you can't just flip the switch overnight to union work rules. This will take some time to sort out and, as always, the devil will be in the details.

In the meantime, pour a cold one, enjoy the fact that football season is here, the baseball playoffs are close, and we only have to endure 7 more weeks of stupid political ads.
 
gutshotdraw said:
If I can put on the jailhouse lawyer hat for a moment, the fact that Santulli will apparently exercise his option to combine the seniority lists makes a single carrier petition to the NMB, as they say in legalese, moot. The option Santulli is signing specifically recognizes NJA and NJI as a "single transportation system" thereby rendering a filing by NJASAP pointless.

NJI pilots have been told, as recently as the middle of last week, that the official announcement is imminent and that the phase-in period to convert NJI to union work rules will take 12-24 months to accomplish. It's not bs and it's not stalling. As previously stated in this forum, you can't just flip the switch overnight to union work rules. This will take some time to sort out and, as always, the devil will be in the details.

In the meantime, pour a cold one, enjoy the fact that football season is here, the baseball playoffs are close, and we only have to endure 7 more weeks of stupid political ads.
Click to expand...

Hit the nail on the head there Gut. I have heard the same word on the street on this one. You might also add that the most valuble thing being protected here (aside from the flight crews) is that little sheet of paper in the NOC with the words "135 Carrier Certificate NJI, Inc" on it. That is worth a G5's weight in gold as far as value.
 
Last edited:
It is he! He has come! It's him....Or whatever!

In the meantime, pour a cold one, enjoy the fact that football season is here, the baseball playoffs are close, and we only have to endure 7 more weeks of stupid political ads.

What Natural Leadership qualities!

Assess the situation and make a cool calculated decision.

Have you considered running for a Union position when ya get here?

You've already got 1 vote man!!!!!
 
gutshotdraw said:
If I can put on the jailhouse lawyer hat for a moment, the fact that Santulli will apparently exercise his option to combine the seniority lists makes a single carrier petition to the NMB, as they say in legalese, moot. The option Santulli is signing specifically recognizes NJA and NJI as a "single transportation system" thereby rendering a filing by NJASAP pointless.

NJI pilots have been told, as recently as the middle of last week, that the official announcement is imminent and that the phase-in period to convert NJI to union work rules will take 12-24 months to accomplish. It's not bs and it's not stalling. As previously stated in this forum, you can't just flip the switch overnight to union work rules. This will take some time to sort out and, as always, the devil will be in the details.

In the meantime, pour a cold one, enjoy the fact that football season is here, the baseball playoffs are close, and we only have to endure 7 more weeks of stupid political ads.
Click to expand...

I don't deny that it will take time for all the details to be in place, I believe your 12-24 month assesment is accurate. I am simply saying that NJASAP has options if RTS doesn't choose to play nice or decides to pull some sort of "stunt".
 
TK, You must be new to NJA. RTS loves his union, look what he got for sooooo little money, and more to come down the road for the company. He now will get cheaper G pilots, to fill the seats and they will be trained by the one's that have been here for a while. He is ONE smart man. He is tying up the pilot's for a LONG time in everyway (scope, money) etc. NJA pilot's received a great raise and more bene's at a cost, it's called TIME. It appears that you think some sort of union busting COULD go on in the future. If you don't trust the company you should move on and give one of the thousand's standing in line for the job a chance. No disrespect intended, just that I think all NJA pilot's (and the majority I think do) should trust what's going to happen, will be good for the majority.
:beer: Cheers
 
Hey DD why don't you share with us the pay scales of the NJI pilots so we can make an objective comparison?
 

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