I'm done. (NWA/DAL)

[General Lee]

Which one? That it will end up as a negotiated deal instead of an arbitrated one? Or that it will not look much like anything on the table now?

I think it may be negotiated, but it won't look even close to DOH, more like relative seniority. Also it was an open forum, but someone on your side released it onto the internet with a lot of important personal info on it. There are plenty of open hearings at criminal trials too, but that doesn't mean the info is released on the internet. And you think that by asking for DOH we would automatically compromise? We should have asked for the staple, and then we would have come to our current proposal as middle ground...

Bye Bye--General Lee

 

[skystud25]

Using your exact logic, please advise DALPA to revise their proposed list to reflect the top 451 positions being NWA due to the 747-400.

Yeah General, you forgot about the Super Duper Premium airplanes. Did you forget how special they are?

DTW, the 9' is on the bottom of the proposed list because it's going away, not because it's the least Super Duper, so why the special status for the 400?

Even the arbitrators know this "Super" tag is BS. From the transcripts, one of them asked the Delta side if they'd ever heard of this "Super Premium" phrase being used anywhere else in the industry, the response was "Uhhhhh, no." Too funny!

 

[DTW320]

DTW, the 9' is on the bottom of the proposed list because it's going away, Says who? When? Please provide a reference. I can provide one of RA saying they aren't going anywhere.Have you seen the price of oil lately? Is the mission of the 737-700 domestic 100-125 seat flying?not because it's the least Super Duper,your buddies here say that's exactly why it's on the bottom so why the special status for the 400?Because each one is 50% bigger than DAL's largest A/C, and we have 60% more of them than DAL has 777's?

BTW, I'm on record here as saying that the "aircraft superlatives" being thrown around are hilarious.

 

[ACL65PILOT]

They are. It is all quite funny, but as stated FDJ2 has a point.
Two to two and a half years max on those 40 and 50 series 9's. (Assuming the business plan does not change again)

 

[skystud25]

BTW, I'm on record here as saying that the "aircraft superlatives" being thrown around are hilarious.

Fair enough on the superlatives.

As for RA saying they weren't going anywhere, I think as he said that he was saying in his head "not in the first few months, anyway." Those airplanes do not have a future at the new Delta.

Looking forward to getting out on the road with you guys/gals, although it's sounding like it may take awhile with all this "fence" business.

 

[DTW320]

They are. It is all quite funny, but as stated FDJ2 has a point.
Two to two and a half years max on those 40 and 50 series 9's. (Assuming the business plan does not change again)

Ahhhhh.....So......if the "business plan" DOES change (of course, I know that NOTHING changes in the airline business in 2 1/2 years) you would be willing to "redo" the SLI right?Ya know, since you want to base the SLI on future plans and all. That would also apply to changes in the DAL fleet plan within 2 1/2 years of DCC right?

 

[ACL65PILOT]

No because they are still the smallest gauge a/c. And if we had the smallest, I would expect our guys to be on the bottom as well.

There are going to be changes, but not the ones you are thinking of.

 

[General Lee]

Ahhhhh.....So......if the "business plan" DOES change (of course, I know that NOTHING changes in the airline business in 2 1/2 years) you would be willing to "redo" the SLI right?Ya know, since you want to base the SLI on future plans and all. That would also apply to changes in the DAL fleet plan within 2 1/2 years of DCC right?

Wait, is this the same thing as your guys wanting a "dynamic" list that would allow your guys to leapfrog over DAL pilots when your upcoming NWA pilots retire, even though we also have a large chunk of retirements coming up about 5 years later? Same thing? A redo of the SLI? Kinda crazy.....


Bye Bye--General Lee

 

[DTW320]

No because they are still the smallest gauge a/c. And if we had the smallest, I would expect our guys to be on the bottom as well.

There are going to be changes, but not the ones you are thinking of.

So which is it? The reason that DC-9 pilots should be STAPLED, not integrated, in the SLI? Is it because of gauge or because they are "going away"(well....maybe....ya know....in 2 1/2 years or so....unless things change, of course)? Using your logic, why doesn't your proposal have entire blocks of NWA stapled into various parts of the list based on gauge? It's OK to staple on the bottom but not on the top based on gauge? What's the "gauge" of the 744(with 451 pilot's) vs the 777?

 

[ACL65PILOT]

It is both and you know it. They are going away sooner rather than later. They are also the smallest airframe.
It is not only passengers but the capabilities of the airframe. The 777 and 744 perform the same roll. The 9 and 88 do not. I do not see any 9's going from ATL to SJU or ELP any time soon. (It does not have the capabilities)

 

[DTW320]

It is both and you know it. They are going away sooner rather than later. They are also the smallest airframe.
It is not only passengers but the capabilities of the airframe. The 777 and 744 perform the same roll. The 9 and 88 do not. I do not see any 9's going from ATL to SJU or ELP any time soon. (It does not have the capabilities)

OK, Both....First of those is gauge. You say the DC-9 pilots should be STAPLED due to gauge, yet DAL MD88 pilots are not STAPLED below 320 or 757 pilots...they are integrated. What a double standard! Your staple logic only makes sense if you also staple everyone else, in blocks, into the combined list based on guage.

Second is because they are going away. We are to sentence hundreds of NWA pilots to the bottom of the list, junior to hundreds of DAL pilots hired up to 10 years later, based on an assumption/guess, that can't be supported by any official comment? (in fact, the only public comments on the subject by DAL execs say just the opposite).

Wow. Very reasonable and fair logic there.

 

[ACL65PILOT]

Wow, go take your logic to your MEC.

I cannot wait to hear your side of it next week.
Quit arguing this, you or I cannot change the outcome.
Maybe Puff and FDJ2 will feel like spatting with you. I have better things to do with my time. Like taking a Nap!

 

[DTW320]

Wow, go take your logic to your MEC.

I cannot wait to hear your side of it next week.
Quit arguing this, you or I cannot change the outcome.
Maybe Puff and FDJ2 will feel like spatting with you. I have better things to do with my time. Like talking a Nap!

Hey, I agree 100%. I'm tired of all of it too, to be honest. It's out of our hands, we each have our strong feelings about it, but guess what....neither is going to change the other's position. Soon enough this will be behind us and we can concentrate on snubbing our collective noses at other legacies that attempt to challenge us in our airline world domination cage match!:angryfire

Have a good nap.....but if you're talking through it, you're too stressed out.

Later

 

[ACL65PILOT]

See that is my point. Time for a nap.:0

 

[ACL65PILOT]

Yeah, I am done debating this until I see your proposal. Maybe even then I will not want to discuss it.
I just would like it behind us. There are lots of plans that need this to be finished for them to be come a reality.