Forecast for recalls, hiring, pension benefits if NPRM issued

[Flopgut]

If it's purely an issue of ending discrimination, then NOTHING has been accomplishished! It's still an age Fogey, How do you not understand that, and do you know how foolish that makes you sound?

This is a re-finance on the total dollars pilots make with a windfall going to one group, that's it! It's not even a bump up in pay. In fact, it will denude the possibility of raises from consideration for a long time.

 

[Flopgut]

Is there a single benefit for a pilot that wants to retire at 60 that could possibly come from this?

Edit: Post retirement age change: Junior pilots who want to retire at 60 are expected to take a several hundred thousand dollar hit so today's senior pilots don't have to retire at 60 with a several hundred thousand dollar hit?!

WTF? How stupid are we suppose to be for this to make sense?

 

[Tejas-Jet]

IF the NPRM is issued, then it really doesn't matter if ALPA or APA or whoever/whichever pilot group is for or against the age change.

If you are opposed to this, then your fight should've been stronger back...

...When the ICAO voted to make the change happen,

...and foreign Air Carrier pilots started flying into our airspace on Thanksgiving day 2006....

...When the FAA docs told a Senate comittee that it wasn't about safety

...When the FAA's official stance became "neutral" on the age change

....for all intents and purposes...the fight was over because nobody put much energy into it

... It's nothing but squealing now.

 

[PCL_128]

Unfortunately, that fight seems to have ended with Prater's election. Prater personally doesn't support Age 60, so he's taking a passive stance and "accepting the inevitable" as opposed to fighting this ugly turd from ever becoming a law as directed by the majority membership in ALPA.

Your perception is incorrect. This idea didn't start with Captain Prater's administration. Captain Woerth supported Age 60, but he said towards the end of his term that the change was inevitable, and the only thing left to do was minimize the negative impact.

 

[capt. megadeth]

Once its over and done with both ALPA and non ALPA pilots will probably wonder what all the hub-bub was about. How can ending 47 years of wrongful discrimnation suck, except to the very short sighted.

Airfogey

Safety smafety, discrimination, blah blah blah.

What a bunch of horse do do. The only reason this is being looked at is because of either the 1. lack of pensions at certain airlines or 2. the fact that pensions were dumped by incompetent management at other airlines. I am not buying the "discrimination" b.s. If you want to argue that then why don't we just get rid of the seniority system? I mean, if a pilot gets hired at Airline A on the 737 with 10,000 hours and 5000 hours as capt. on the 737, why should he/she have to fly right seat to a 6000 hour 737 capt. just because that person is senior? I could argue discrimination on that too. Shouldn't the more experienced be captain?

Not only that....why have an age limit at all? I mean, wouldn't 65 be discriminatory? Why not just make it that you can fly until you can't hold a 1st class? Whooops....sorry, don't want to give anyone any ideas.

 

[Flopgut]

IF the NPRM is issued, then it really doesn't matter if ALPA or APA or whoever/whichever pilot group is for or against the age change.

If you are opposed to this, then your fight should've been stronger back...

...When the ICAO voted to make the change happen,

...and foreign Air Carrier pilots started flying into our airspace on Thanksgiving day 2006....

...When the FAA docs told a Senate comittee that it wasn't about safety

...When the FAA's official stance became "neutral" on the age change

....for all intents and purposes...the fight was over because nobody put much energy into it

... It's nothing but squealing now.

Oh Tejas my friend, the squealing is going to start when the majority gets heard.

 

[Tejas-Jet]

Oh Tejas my friend, the squealing is going to start when the majority gets heard.

The majority has been heard for a long time. In fact, the FAA's change to a neutral stance came while hearing from "the majority". As did the FAA's Federal Air Surgeon's testimony that health issues had nothing to do with it.

Do you honestly think the age 60 will never change?

Tejas

 

[tomgoodman]

Unintended consequence?

The only reason this is being looked at is because of either the 1. lack of pensions at certain airlines or 2. the fact that pensions were dumped by incompetent management at other airlines.

Good point. The age extension issue was raised several times in the past, but remained a "dead duck" until the wave of pension-dumping. Had pensions remained intact, almost all pilots would have been content to retire at 60 (or earlier), especially where wage concessions have made continuing to work relatively less rewarding. Ironically, many of those who may stagnate if the rule changes were themselves accomplices to these pension-dumps.

 

[Flopgut]

Do you honestly think the age 60 will never change?

Tejas

It never should change. Just like a pilot's DOH.

 

[Purpled]

It never should change. Just like a pilot's DOH.

Hurumph!