FO/Flex how would you vote to integrate??

[notapilot]

It's already been said on multiple occasions that a single carrier petition is not needed to accomplish the vision. It sounds like either you are being told something different and possibly being played or you are using the fence negotiations as a way to see if you can strike a deal that benefits your group. That's fair enough since you are organized and have a voice in the fence negotiations. Our only recourse is to vote out your union/contract if you force the game with a single carrier petition. Fair is fair. Realize that if you get fence agreements that satisfy your union and you decide to make a petition for single carrier there will more than likely be no union left to enforce those agreements.

 

[GlorifiedCabbie]

So, if KR wants a single carrier and the cards get sent in, then he will do a "voluntary recognition". The pilots will have to work out an amended CBA with the company and the whiners will still continue to complain while the company moves foreward.

 

[slowtation capt]

I am glad I at least understand that part. Ok, so, KR wants it, FO wants their union and Flex does not. Not starting a fight here, but why petition? If as you said I am correct, than we get to stay separate as long as no one petitions. Yes, KR does not get his way, but it seems with us separate, it is a win/win. Right? Again, not looking to start a fight, just making sure I understand what I am hearing and being told.

Thanks for the calm open dialogue.

Look at the cost savings of the operation from KR's standpoint.

Separate = Scheduler's if combined trying to keep track of 2 different set's of rules, schedules, everything.

Customers wonder why Flex does this and Flops does that when it's owned by the same company.

Together = Everything combined, 1 Ops center, 1 CP, 1 DO, etc.......

If I owned a business and bought another like business, I would want to combine as much overlap as I could to get the maximum return for my investments.

That's how I view it.

 

[GlorifiedCabbie]

Listen up. KR is going to make a deal with the union that we can't refuse. Things go good-he takes the credit. Things go bad -he blames the union. Were you born last night?

 

[shanes123]

TWA. One last time to ask a civil question from you. Lets say we negotiate a new contract before single carrier status is complete.( Trust me I dont want Single Carrier, Just for the fact of ever having to deal with you) And the new contract has better pay, benefits, and work rules. Then you currently have at FJ. Then KR gets his single carrier staus after the fact and a union vote is put to the pilots..How will you vote then?

 

[Necromonger]

Does this Slowtation douschBag even fly? He seems to be going for a flt info record for most idiotic posts.

Help me... I think my IQ drops a point or 2 with every post of his I read.

 

[notapilot]

Look at the cost savings of the operation from KR's standpoint.

Separate = Scheduler's if combined trying to keep track of 2 different set's of rules, schedules, everything.

Customers wonder why Flex does this and Flops does that when it's owned by the same company.

Together = Everything combined, 1 Ops center, 1 CP, 1 DO, etc.......

If I owned a business and bought another like business, I would want to combine as much overlap as I could to get the maximum return for my investments.

That's how I view it.

I don't disagree except that can all be done without single carrier. Flexjet does it today with Jet Solutions. We will all soon be on the same certificate but that does not require the groups to merge to realize the cost saving efficiencies you mentioned. There are over 40 pages of messages of you guys saying how you have been through it before and you don't trust him. There is great anger towards Flexjet crews that we won't listen. I have to honestly ask why all of a sudden do you have a change of heart and say the company wants single carrier so we have to give it to them. There's something missing here that is not being shared.

 

[slowtation capt]

Flexjet does it today with Jet Solutions.

My understanding of Jet Solutions, is so you can fly 135 trips in the US. When Bombardier owned you, they couldn't have a US 135 certificate.

I have to honestly ask why all of a sudden do you have a change of heart and say the company wants single carrier so we have to give it to them. There's something missing here that is not being shared.

It's not a change of heart, I have accepted the fact that KR wants single, single is where this operation is going to be headed. My thought is that the Union can be the di*k everyone wants them to be, or just work with the company to accomplish something that in inevitable.

 

[TWA 2 ASA FO]

TWA. One last time to ask a civil question from you. Lets say we negotiate a new contract before single carrier status is complete.( Trust me I dont want Single Carrier, Just for the fact of ever having to deal with you) And the new contract has better pay, benefits, and work rules. Then you currently have at FJ. Then KR gets his single carrier staus after the fact and a union vote is put to the pilots..How will you vote then?

That is a very good question.

It isn't just about the contract with pay, benefits and rules.

The relationship between management and the employees would need to be mended so there wouldn't be this us vs them mentality. The one thing I really like about FJ is the fact that we work with management for the betterment of the company.

When I worked at union carriers more time was spent by pilots trying to find a way use the contract as a tool to find any way they could to screw the company. I would listen to pilots talk about how they couldn't wait until the company asked for anything so they could tell them to screw off.

Flying with that kind of negativity all the time can make flying airplanes for a living suck.

Someone on here mentioned Southwest. The reason they have always been a great company is the pilots and management work together. The pilots go out of their way to work hard for "their" company and are rewarded handsomely.

That type of environment would at least make me consider a union.

I know it is a tall order, but you asked.

 

[TWA 2 ASA FO]

My understanding of Jet Solutions, is so you can fly 135 trips in the US. When Bombardier owned you, they couldn't have a US 135 certificate.



It's not a change of heart, I have accepted the fact that KR wants single, single is where this operation is going to be headed. My thought is that the Union can be the di*k everyone wants them to be, or just work with the company to accomplish something that in inevitable.

Ok, serious question.

Who are you referring to when you say the everyone that wants the union to be a dick?

 

[slowtation capt]

Ok, serious question.

Who are you referring to when you say the everyone that wants the union to be a dick?

The company, the pilots that think the Union personally went out of their way to screw them, everyone that views and feels the Union is always trying to screw over the company, etc.....

 

[slowtation capt]

The one thing I really like about FJ is the fact that we work with management for the betterment of the company.

Is that not what the Union is doing by meeting with the company and trying to find a way to properly merge these companies so that you and I don't lose our pay, our seat, our expectations for a future.

Finding a way to merge, move forward and grow

 

[TWA 2 ASA FO]

Is that not what the Union is doing by meeting with the company and trying to find a way to properly merge these companies so that you and I don't lose our pay, our seat, our expectations for a future.

Finding a way to merge, move forward and grow

I think they are only doing what is required by section 1.5(c)(2) of your contract. They are required to negotiate a fence agreement.

Although now reading that section I don't think it applies. It only says this applies if the pilots of the acquired carrier are employees by the company.

The company is defined as Flight Options LLC. I don't think this section applies to our situation.

 

[Club ORD FO]

Correct, only the Union can petition, and KR want's it.

So should the Union be the big bad bully that everyone wants it to be and not peitition for single? Just so they can keep the Union.

Or should the Union work with the company to come to a solution to merge to everyone's benefit and help the company with their future plans? Taking a risk of cutting it own throat.

I'd say the union is being the big bad bully by asking for single carrier. Nobody at flex wants single carrier. nooooobody. You can only get away with it because you have more pilots.

 

[slowtation capt]

The company is defined as Flight Options LLC.

Along with Flight Options Holdings I, Inc.