FAA Vacation

[BoilerUP]

If they fill out timely ASAP reports, they likely will still get violated by the FAA but they won't have to serve any suspension of their certificates and the letter will go into an ASAP-specific file, which will be expunged after 2 years.

I believe any correction/warning letters issued under ASAP are not viewable by a PRIA request.

 

[Noserider76]

Not saying this is what happened by any means but I've noticed over the years that some of the best captains I've flown with go into a kind of slow down mode when rushed for any reason. It's easy to fall into the trap of letting others rush you. Whether it's a late operation, reroute, late numbers, ATC induced, new crew member, or just a slow bad crew member (me), they realize mistakes will happen when they're rushed and not feeling completely ahead of the game and they slow it down.

 

[gutshotdraw]

Several of you have clearly misunderstood. I was not casting aspersions on the crew in question. By pointing out they were probably on the last leg of a long day, I was attempting to give them the benefit of the doubt. I have done those reaaalllly looong daaayys, especially on the V/550 fleet and I know what fatigue can do to your hearing when you get a clearance. I think they call this one something like "anticipation error." I was seriously asking if anyone knew whether an ASAP might cover such an event. I hope it never happens to me or anybody else, either. I'd just like to know if filling out the ASAP for an incident such as this would be a waste of time.

As an aside, the controller's handoff to NORCAL actually left some question in our minds as to whether the crew made the error or she did. I bet the supervisor on duty was rewinding the tape before the wheels were in the well.

 

[gutshotdraw]

By the way Jon, no jealousy here. Had my chance at SWA and elected to stay where I'm at. Great company and I have lots of friends over there but they don't get to layover in Maui :beer:

 

[BoilerUP]

I'd just like to know if filling out the ASAP for an incident such as this would be a waste of time.

Not a waste at all; it just might save their certificates and their careers.

 

[Quiet Flight]

Zero days. ASAP

 

[Frap]

I believe any correction/warning letters issued under ASAP are not viewable by a PRIA request.

Where is this written?

 

[BoilerUP]

Where is this written?

I can't guarantee that statement is in either one of the links below because I don't have time this morning to review them, but I'd look in the top one first.

Beware - there is plenty FAA legalise...

Designation of Aviation Safety Action Program (ASAP) Information as Protected from Public Disclosure Under 14 CFR Part 193

This is the full AC about the ASAP program, in .pdf:

Advisory Circular 120-66B

 

[SteelerMan]

Zero days. ASAP

I agree, this will probably be accepted into ASAP with a letter of warning that goes away after a year. Airspace violations that I have knowledge of have been treated that way, and they were noted by atc during the flight.

 

[Occam's Razor]

The test case for this was our A319 that landing at Ellsworth AFB instead of Rapid City.

1. Not sole source.

2. Immunity status subject to the discretion of the ERC.

3. "Visibility" on PRIA based on #2.

CAUTION: Pure speculation ahead! If the SWA crew is "cooperative", they might not get time off. If not, or if the ERC is in a snotty mood...they'll have time to paint the family room.

ALPA bashers note: Our guys received immunity from the ERC because NWA pilots acted collectively via ALPA, and threatened to pull down the ASAP and FOQA programs if the incident wasn't classified "sole source". The crew screwed up, no question, but the chain-of-events that led to the boo boo were more important to us than their heads on a pike.

That message COULD have been delivered by a couple of pilots individually...but for some reason, managements tend to listen to large organized groups with a little more interest.