Ex-United pilots weigh future without pension

[bafanguy]

Canyonblue,

You might have meant well and even tried to be funny. It came accross
to me like you were making fun of the United guys loosing their
retirement. I hope that wasn't the case. Who knows where you and your
company will be in 20 years? Most of us went to the first carrier
that called and rolled the dice.
Dave B

dbrownie,

Bingo !!!

Canyonblue,

You know who these unfortunate UAL/EAL/BNF/PanAM/USAir/TWA guys might be ? Well, let me tell ya, Junior: they just might be YOU in a couple of decades ( hope you have considerable assets outside your company plan; if not, better get busy ).

It's a long, embarrassing fall to the ground from the back of a high horse. I sure hope it doesn't happen to SWA, of all airlines, because you are the last hope to demonstrate that management is the key to the whole puzzle.

Good luck, Sir.

 

[capt. megadeth]

dbrownie,

Bingo !!!

Canyonblue,

You know who these unfortunate UAL/EAL/BNF/PanAM/USAir/TWA guys might be ? Well, let me tell ya, Junior: they just might be YOU in a couple of decades ( hope you have considerable assets outside your company plan; if not, better get busy ).

It's a long, embarrassing fall to the ground from the back of a high horse. I sure hope it doesn't happen to SWA, of all airlines, because you are the last hope to demonstrate that management is the key to the whole puzzle.

Good luck, Sir.

Well said!

I hope the majority of pilots at SWA have SWAdude's attitude rather than canyonblue's.

 

[PHXFLYR]

Megadeath...



I like to think that they do......



PHXFLYR

 

[SWAdude]

Well said!

I hope the majority of pilots at SWA have SWAdude's attitude rather than canyonblue's.

They do. Trust me.

Every airline has its 10%, right?

Sometimes I think out of our 10% that half of them are here on this board!

SWAdude

 

[WhiteCloud]

On the other side of the coin.....an older UAL retired pilot (over 30 years) I'm acquainted with will be doing just fine. In his later 60's his home is paid off, he drives a good late model car and his first and only wife of 40 plus years is still with him and they have a great relationship. His children are grown and make their own money. Personal cut backs will come in the form of less charitable giving and not going out to eat as often. Maybe wait a few more years before replacing the car and no designs on replacing his home or his spouse.

 

[Hobiehawker]

On the other side of the coin.....an older UAL retired pilot (over 30 years) I'm acquainted with will be doing just fine. In his later 60's his home is paid off, he drives a good late model car and his first and only wife of 40 plus years is still with him and they have a great relationship. His children are grown and make their own money. Personal cut backs will come in the form of less charitable giving and not going out to eat as often. Maybe wait a few more years before replacing the car and no designs on replacing his home or his spouse.

Something we all should learn from.

 

[SWAdude]

Something we all should learn from.

Amen brother. Amen

 

[Andy]

You finger pointers forgot something. A large portion of the B fund went towards the esop which went away with the bankruptcy. Also, depending on when you retire, the value of a B fund can fluctuate quite a bit. Just ask the EAL pilots who had a large portion of theirs invested in real estate that was highly depressed at the time of the bankruptcy and subsequent liquidation. Let he who is without sin....

Yaks, you raise some valid points. On the B fund, that was only the company-contributed portion that went toward EFLOP shares. Pilots could contribute to their 401ks for other investments.
On the fluctuation aspect, this is why it's essential to diversify. And as you get closer to retirement, fixed income assets should be an ever greater portion of your portfolio. And whatever you do, DO NOT have your company's stock in your investment portfolio ... no matter how much you believe in your company, you already have a significant stake in your company; get away from airline investments.

My wife and I have been following his plan for about 3 years. Gone from ~230k in debt to ~100k, with big chunks going away every month.

Darned good job, Huck. And I'm sure that you'll attest that the changes that you made were not all that painful.
There's nothing wrong with a bit of delayed gratification. I'd say that you're rapidly approaching the point where you can loosen up the purse strings a bit and feel like you're living like royalty.

All great advice Andy with the exception of the Coverdell Education IRA's. I encourage you to consult a financial advisor/tax accountant and investigate the superiority of the 529's for kids' college education savings. The tax laws have changed in the last few years to heavily favor the 529's.

Big Beer Belly, thanks for the tip. I'll take a look at 529s.

Why was it necessary to terminate the retirees pensions?

Skykid did a very good job of answering your question. To reiterate, UAL will not be able to get exit financing without shedding the pension plans.
For those of you flying for airlines that still have pension plans, take note. They're going the way of the Dodo bird. Legacy airlines can't compete with startups who don't have those costs.

Canyonblue,
You might have meant well and even tried to be funny. It came accross
to me like you were making fun of the United guys loosing their
retirement. I hope that wasn't the case. Who knows where you and your
company will be in 20 years? Most of us went to the first carrier
that called and rolled the dice.
Dave B

Dave, I also read this as a joke gone awry. Like most pilots, Canyonblue has a fairly large ego (that's why chicks dig pilots ... NOT!) and is not going to apologize, even though I am sure that he realizes that his joke was interpreted differently than he intended.




I was probably too harsh on my fellow UAL pilots, but all of us should walk away from this article and thread with a plan to not rely on anyone else for our financial future. I'd love to read many more stories like Huck's.

One last item ... the cancellation of pension plans will eventually result in retirement ages being raised. Sorry, it's inevitable. I don't want to see retirement age change, but congress will eventually pass a change. The question is whether it will result in 2, 3, 5, 7, or more years of stagnation. Something else for every pilot to plan on.

 

[skykid]

One last item ... the cancellation of pension plans will eventually result in retirement ages being raised. Sorry, it's inevitable. I don't want to see retirement age change, but congress will eventually pass a change.

Agreed. I'm hoping the change will come after a long, drawn out trip through Congress and then an extensive study on implementation from the FAA. The longer it takes the better as more and more turn 65. Tick tock tick tock.

 

[canyonblue]

Canyonblue,

You might have meant well and even tried to be funny. It came accross
to me like you were making fun of the United guys loosing their
retirement. I hope that wasn't the case. Who knows where you and your
company will be in 20 years? Most of us went to the first carrier
that called and rolled the dice.
Dave B

It was a joke, and it was not on United but on the 2 idiots in that article that are whining about losing “part” of their pension. Having to drive a car that is 5 years old is a misery, sorry that struck a nerve, and for that I won't apologize for the post. Unlike some pilots, and even a few on this board I did not grow up with the rich airline pilot dad with the new car every year. I did not grow up with money so if it goes away, so be it. These clowns might lose up to 75% of their pension, what about my friends that lost 100% with their furlough letter. They at least got some of their pension, and now they slam the current United pilots for losing it for them. The pilots currently at United are fighting to stay alive all the while those same retired guys want them to take care of them before they help the company pull out of a nosedive. I can’t believe anyone on this board could sympathize with them. We have those few percentile at Southwest also that just want everything to be rosy, so they can cash out their options and walk away with a lot of money. It's all about them. For those that thought I was making light of the UAL situation I do apologize, it was a satire for those 2 guys that can't seem to live on $50,000 a year, for those that feel for the 2 idiots I don't. As far as it happening to us here at Southwest, well that has been a conversation around the crashpad for months now. Many of us, myself included, see an implosion here in possibly 10-15 years unless some things change. I see other groups starting to go the "me" route, instead of thinking of the company first. I just can't believe with all the events in the world that these guys find themselves to be the most important people on the planet. And just as sad there are people on this board that seem to feel for them, rather than the ones who are suffering the most in this world.