Dhl

[rotor&wing]

That "stink that ALPA kicked up" was primarily the result of some Astar guys who, in a moment of stunned disbelief, demonstrated their insolence. To the best of my knowledge, it wasn't sanctioned or supported by ALPA national. It was a dumb move for sure, but what effect it will have on future hiring, nobody knows. I had lunch with a couple of UPS guys recently, who told me privately (and off the record) that "they don't care if they (the Astar pilots) never find jobs in this business again." So I guess it would be something an Astar guy would want to distance himself from, if and when he does get an interview there.

Your "knowledge" is once again severely lacking.

 

[hvydriver]

Actually, it was sanctioned by ALPA. All expenses paid out of the national coffers. Prater also testified at both hearings. As an aside, out of Mullen's own mouth, he stated that UPS contacted DHL first about the idea of taking over the US air/sort ops. for DHL during the Transportation hearing.

 

[shooter]

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bob Dylan
From my understanding, UPS cannot offer preferential interviews to ATSG or Astar employees, because then the lawmakers will claim that it is a quasi-merger.

I have heard the same thing, and from a lawyer, no less!

I don't really want a long drawn out conversation, but does anyone know how that would be a quasi-merger but they think what their plans are not a quasi-merger? Like I said, not a debate, not an argument, just a simple question of clarification on how preferential interviews are grounds for a merger argument.

 

[Whistlin' Dan]

I don't really want a long drawn out conversation, but does anyone know how that would be a quasi-merger but they think what their plans are not a quasi-merger? Like I said, not a debate, not an argument, just a simple question of clarification on how preferential interviews are grounds for a merger argument.

Once you "combine" workforces, it's pretty hard to argue that you haven't "combined" the work they do. I.E., the companies themselves. It's bad enough that they're providing an essential component of a service to a competitor. I doubt they'd want to provoke further inquiry into this deal by agreeing to hire their competitor's former employees to do the work.

 

[shooter]

Once you "combine" workforces, it's pretty hard to argue that you haven't "combined" the work they do. I.E., the companies themselves. It's bad enough that they're providing an essential component of a service to a competitor. I doubt they'd want to provoke further inquiry into this deal by agreeing to hire their competitor's former employees to do the work.

Why not would be my question. The employees in question are no longer working and seeking employment. Interesting how lawyers interpret things sometimes.

 

[Publishers]

The question of the day, name all the air freight operations that have shut down in the last 20 years and the supplemental lift carriers that worked theml.

 

[fob727]

brown stuff

I have heard the same thing, and from a lawyer, no less!

I disagree. Other than the initial start-up of their air ops, UPS - the company - has never given preferential interviews to anybody for line-pilot positions. Part of the reason is that the hiring process there is pretty objective to begin with. If you have the right quals and fit the right demographic, AND they're hiring, you may get a call. If you don't (or they're not) they won't let their arm be twisted into hiring you. Once you get the call, of course, letters of reccommendation help. But it's HR that makes the final decision, not the union.

That "stink that ALPA kicked up" was primarily the result of some Astar guys who, in a moment of stunned disbelief, demonstrated their insolence. To the best of my knowledge, it wasn't sanctioned or supported by ALPA national. It was a dumb move for sure, but what effect it will have on future hiring, nobody knows. I had lunch with a couple of UPS guys recently, who told me privately (and off the record) that "they don't care if they (the Astar pilots) never find jobs in this business again." So I guess it would be something an Astar guy would want to distance himself from, if and when he does get an interview there.

Give me a break! Where do you get your info.?

W.D., once again you show your ignorance.

 

[mxer]

There is a huge difference between granting interviews and combining a workforce. A job doesn't have to offered as a result of the interview. Also, it is not a one for one. Nobody would assume twelve hundred pilots would not only get an interview but be guarenteed a position, not to mention the other seven thousand that stand to be unemployed. If your lawyer couldn't fight that battle, you need a new lawyer.

 

[shooter]

The question of the day, name all the air freight operations that have shut down in the last 20 years and the supplemental lift carriers that worked theml.

Whew, thats a broad question. Kind of like the professor that says your exam is only one question, with 78 parts. A quick reply would be, not as many as passenger carriers.

 

[Publishers]

Start by naming who flew for Purolator, CF, Emery, UPS, Flying Tigers, Airbourne, USPS, etc... Hubs that were shut down in Columbus, Indiannapolis, Cincinnati, Terre Haute, and various other cities.

 

[shooter]

Start by naming who flew for Purolator, CF, Emery, UPS, Flying Tigers, Airbourne, USPS, etc... Hubs that were shut down in Columbus, Indiannapolis, Cincinnati, Terre Haute, and various other cities.

Who flew for them? What do you mean? I think Purolator was bought by Emery and Emery was shut down for poor maintenance. Flying Tigers was bought by Fed Ex. USPS never owned an airline. CF? Do you mean Consolidated Freight? That was Emery's parent company, a trucking company, that still operates. And Airborne was bought by DHL and since they are a foreign company, spun the airline into the sister company of Airborne, ABX, to be owned by their shareholders. Is my answer correct?

You seem to be digging for something or wanting to start some sort of thread game. I can't figure out which.

 

[fokkers&beer]

Purolator is still going strong up in Canada. It was a canadian company to begin with, and I never saw them down here.
When Emery lost their mail contracts to FedEx were there there dispatchers this active with endless rhetoric?

 

[shooter]

Purolator is still going strong up in Canada. It was a canadian company to begin with, and I never saw them down here.
When Emery lost their mail contracts to FedEx were there there dispatchers this active with endless rhetoric?

Well, I am one of those former Emery USPS Express mail Dispatchers. And I knew back then what many here still do not know; That as a governmental agency the USPS is not subject to anti-trust laws. Otherwise, yes we would have been fighting it.

I do not doubt the advantage UPS will see from this deal. It is the poor choices of DHL and the anti-competitiveness (if thats a word) that will cost the consumers as well as the impact to the area where my friends and co-workers live that has me fighting with my "endless rhetoric". Deal with it or just don't read the thread and enjoy another white russian.


EDIT: And unless they started another airline (Purolator), they do not have one. Airborne carried much of their freight for them. If they have aircraft they have them under contract operated by another airline like the USPS had or they started one (which I doubt).

 

[rotor&wing]

Purolator is still going strong up in Canada. It was a canadian company to begin with, and I never saw them down here.

I flew as a contractor for Purolator in the mid 80's. Their hub was Indianapolis and Orion flew the 727's and DC-9's owned by Purolator.

Purolator sold out it's US operation to Emery.

 

[shooter]

Looks like the Senate does not even need a hearing. That makes both sides of the House saying it is a bad deal.

US Sen antitrust chair urges DOJ to block DHL/UPS

Thu Sep 25, 2008 4:39pm EDT



WASHINGTON, Sept 25 (Reuters) - The U.S. Justice Department should block a proposal for UPS Inc (UPS.N: Quote, Profile, Research, Stock Buzz) to take over air shipments for DHL Express in North America, the chairman of the Senate antitrust subcommittee said on Thursday.
Herb Kohl said government antitrust officials should prohibit the 10-year deal from taking effect, calling it anti-competitive.
In a letter to DOJ antitrust officials, Kohl said the deal would essentially eliminate DHL as an independent competitor in the express package business, possibly raising prices and hurting service to consumers.
DHL, a unit of Germany's Deutsche Post AG (DPWGn.DE: Quote, Profile, Research, Stock Buzz), and UPS executives have told lawmakers their deal is not a merger and would not hurt competition. (Reporting by John Crawley, editing by Richard Chang)

http://www.reuters.com/article/marketsNews/idUSWAT01015520080925

 

[TWA]

I don't know if anyone has posted this yet, but it is a few days old (Monday):

ATSG Receives NASDAQ Deficiency Notice
Monday September 22, 4:45 pm ET
WILMINGTON, Ohio--(BUSINESS WIRE)--Air Transport Services Group, Inc. (NASDAQ: ATSG - News) received a written notification from The NASDAQ Stock Market (“NASDAQ”) on September 16, 2008, indicating that the minimum bid price of the Company’s common stock had fallen below $1.00 for 30 consecutive trading days and that it was therefore not in compliance with NASDAQ Marketplace Rule 4405(a)(5). The notice further provided that in accordance with the NASDAQ Marketplace Rules, the Company will be provided 180 calendar days, or until March 16, 2009, to regain compliance with the minimum bid price requirement.If at any time before March 16, 2009, the bid price of the Company’s stock closes at $1.00 or higher for a minimum of ten consecutive business days, NASDAQ will notify the Company that it has achieved compliance with the minimum bid price requirement. If the Company does not regain compliance with the minimum bid price requirement by March 16, 2009, NASDAQ will notify the Company that its common stock will be delisted from The NASDAQ Global Market.
In the event the Company receives notice that its common stock is being delisted from The NASDAQ Global Market, the NASDAQ Marketplace Rules permit the Company to appeal the delisting to a NASDAQ Listing Qualifications Panel. Alternatively, NASDAQ may permit the Company to transfer its common stock to The NASDAQ Capital Market if it satisfies the requirements for initial inclusion set forth in NASDAQ Marketplace Rule 4310(c), except for the minimum bid price requirement. If its application for transfer is approved, the Company would have an additional 180 calendar days to comply with the minimum bid price requirement in order to remain on The NASDAQ Capital Market.
About ATSG
ATSG is a leading provider of air cargo transportation and related services to domestic and foreign air carriers and other companies that outsource their air cargo lift requirements. Through five principal subsidiaries, including three airlines with separate and distinct U.S. FAA Part 121 Air Carrier certificates, ATSG also provides aircraft leasing, aircraft maintenance services, airport ground services, fuel management, specialized transportation management, and air charter brokerage services. ATSG’s subsidiaries include ABX Air, Inc., Air Transport International, LLC, Capital Cargo International Airlines, Inc., Cargo Aircraft Management, Inc., and LGSTX Services, Inc.


Contact:Air Transport Services Group, Inc.
Quint Turner, 937-382-5591

So sad to see this happening.

 

[Publishers]

While reading this thread about the loss of a hub, it started me thinking about the others that had stopped and the airlines that served them.
Purolator actually hubbed at Lane Aviation in Columbus before Indiannapolis. Yes while Flying Tigers was bought by Fedex, the hub was shut down from what it would be. CF and Emery were separate first.
USP opened with Evergreen at Terre Haute and at Las Vegas. Connie and others flew the routes. Eventually Tom Christopher and Kitty Hawk took part.
UPS did not close but remember companies like Rosenbalm and Ryan.
CF and Emery were separate before together.
My point is that DHL is not the first, nor will it be the last. The communities they were in all survived.

 

[mxer]

Since when is Columbus, Las Vegas, and Indy merely communities. Operations there where smaller and the cities are larger and more diverse. Also, did the state give the same tax relief in exchange for certain promises. Did these companies invite the Mayor of the town to a public meeting to show the future growth and on the same exact day pull the rug from under him with an announcement of shutting down. Not apples to apples. On the distant outside, it may look the same but is really no where even close.

 

[Fly Astar Jets]

We're talking about a region here

Mix has a point here Pub. Regarding the ILN hub, if I'm not mistaken, we're talking about the largest single employer in Clinton county. This deal, if it should go through, will adversely affect an entire region with respect to tax base and the resulting negative effect it would have social services right at a time when they would need them most.

The opposite can not be said about SDF or anywhere else in the UPS system. I would say that no more than 400 jobs, system wide, would be created as a direct result of this deal for UPS. And I think I'm being generous there.

FAJ

 

[TWA]

if I'm not mistaken, we're talking about the largest single employer in Clinton county.

Largest employer in 6 counties.