DAL Wants...

[DL_Infidel]

If DALPA gives DCI 79 200 seat jets, my job is history along with a thousand + others.


You're right! But I think it was 200 - 79 seaters.

You are right! That's what I meant. Thanks for correcting this selfish and arrogant DL pilot (we are all that way you know-TIC). Also, thanks for not name calling. Some people feel the need to get their shots in.

 

[dtfl]

To clear some things up - got this off of the DALPA board -

"In the name of accuracy, I have recieved some new information. A friend of mine from DFW called me, said he had spoken to a Chief Pilot and that what ALPA told me was wrong. He said they are not going after 200 79 seaters in addition to the current 70 seaters. The ch pilot told him what Delta wants is to change the definition from 70 seats to 79 seats and change the number limit from 150 to 200. Which would mean an additional 50 RJs above 50 seats.

I called and spoke with one of my ATL reps personally. He said the way it was briefed to him concurred with what the chief pilot said. "

 

[JI Gone OH]

Know what, mainline has not done anything yet. And if we do end up with a low pay rate on a 100 seater, its not like we had much choice. We are in bankruptcy. We have very little leverage. We will do the best we can but in the end its largely out of our hands.

So everything is the judges fault now, is that what you're saying. Look, I'm the last one that wants to see you flying a 100 seat aircraft for $88 bucks an hour... that's pathetic. Hell, those are [worse than] Mesa wages. And I know that there isn't much you can do; this isn't my first time visiting Chapter 11. It's just really frustrating to see people [like you] give us a hard time for taking freezes a few months ago. You claim that now you're in bankruptcy, you don't have much choice, and to a large extent I agree. Well whether you want to believe it or not, we didn't have much of a choice back then either, because Delta had showed their hand as to who would get growth; the cheapest. It was clear to me and 60% of our pilot group that if we wanted to secure any kind of growth and make things better at our company, we were going to have to give. That's what y'all had been screaming that we were going to have to do from the beginning anyhow, and then when we did we "sold everyone out" and "stole flying" and all the other bullsh*t that goes around about us. The bottom line here is that we were either going to play ball or sit the bench, and I chose to play. It looks like you guys want to play too, and I can't blaim you, it just seems a little hypocritical, that's all. You know, two-faced....

 

[AAflyer]

Seems to me this is the time for ALPA, CAPA, and the rest of the unions to pull together and make a stand. Set a minimum pay level for each aircraft, regardless of the carrier, and that will take pilot wages off of the table.

Then management will have to either raise revenues and find other means of making money.

BINGO!!!!

AA

 

[AAflyer]

Do you guys FINALLY GET IT? We are ALL in this TOGETHER. The ONLY real blame we need to lay is upon ourselves.

JetBlue, Mesa, CHQ, UAL, AA etc, no one is out to screw the other guy, however we have all been MANIPULATED, and have TAKEN THE ANGER out on OURSELVES and our FELLOW aviatiors.

Is there any difference in furloughed guys and gals going to JB to secure work at that payrate then UAL, or DAL pilots now taking what they can to keep their job? No. Infact as the senior pilots sold out the junior one at many of legacies they pushed their fellow pilots into the arms of the LCCs.

Yes JB rates originally had an impact on what other airlines looked to pay their pilots, but don;t you think DAL's new rates while impact what the AirTran guys are trying to get.

Do you see why regionals are underbidding eachother for contracts?

WE ARE ALL IN THIS TOGETHER AND NEED TO BAND TOGETHER NOW!

Do you get it yet?

AA

 

[DL_Infidel]

Just curious, what other airlines are you Delta guys sending your resume's too?

UPS
Cathay
Emirates

 

[800Dog]

UPS
P

 

[800Dog]

UPS, GA State and GA Tech MBA programs. Please don't sell us out just yet. Many of us are willing to suspend our services to Delta before we accept this POS proposal. We have not agreed to anything yet so, dont sell us short just yet. We will need the support of other pilot groups throughout this fight. I wish for the best to all pilot groups as we are all in this together. We need to bring together ALPA, IPA, APA etc. and gameplan as management is tearing us a new one. For the regional guys, I came up through your ranks. Noone, including ALPA, makes you agree/vote yes to anything. Stop blaming others and we need to do the same. If a judge imposes this proposal on us it is very different than voting yes. Hopefully my fellow Delta Pilots will strike if it comes to that. Good luck to all as you are a big part of why I got into this business.

 

[FlyBoeingJets]

There seems to be a lot of confusion on how Delta pilots could be considering $88 per hour as a viable option. Here is how I see the accident chain....

Big contract signed in 2000. It was great but then the slowdown came and then 9/11 REALLY slowed things down. Then the furloughes came and the losses mounted. Couldn't turn back time and undue the contract. Then oil went up. From then on it was a train that saw a bus on the track. The wheels were in motion and there was no way to stop the wreck. Senior guys wanted to get their payouts, management wanted to get their payouts and those that wanted more cuts were unwilling or unable to make them. Mid and Junior guys could only sit and watch. Many bought the BS floated to keep everyone quiet (see The General). That's human nature, we all have to answer questions whether or not we really know the answer or want to give the right answer.

To the folks floating the Delta guys Shiite for considering the low pay--You got peed on for the same thing, so what. Grow thicker skin. DAL was the top of the heap and even though I don't work there I hope they stay afloat. But with the HUMONGOUS debt they have accumulated they will have to suffer sub-standard wages for awhile. Give them a break. The pilot group is not homogeneous. There are many, many good folks there.

BTW--I hope the Delta folks figure out a way to improve the lowball company offer.

 

[pilotyip]

So what would be the advice to a recent DAL recall 7 numbers from the bottom who has a job waiting for him, making around $70K/yr?

 

[CODs4ever]

So what would be the advice to a recent DAL recall 7 numbers from the bottom who has a job waiting for him, making around $70K/yr?

Run... run for your life and don't ever look back. There is more money to be made in other professions and you can be home every weekend and have 100% of your holidays off. Oh and you can still fly, maybe even buy your own plane and fly VFR for a change.

Good luck.

 

[michael707767]

Yes JB rates originally had an impact on what other airlines looked to pay their pilots, but don;t you think DAL's new rates while impact what the AirTran guys are trying to get.

You know what? Does the current situation suck? Yes it does. We are chasing each other to the bottom. But......When times are good, we try to leapfrog each others contract while trying to raise rates. Pattern bargaining I believe they call it. Do you think it only works on the way up? If so you are kidding yourself.

 

[800Dog]

So what would be the advice to a recent DAL recall 7 numbers from the bottom who has a job waiting for him, making around $70K/yr?

Apply elsewhere and go to grad. school bro. Not worth it anymore. At 33 years old and with six years at Delta, I am planning on UPS or another career. Good luck.

 

[800Dog]

Why are you interested in UPS? Good luck with your future.

Stable company. Good benefits and retirement. No contacts at FedEx. Expect a 20 to 30% raise for them over the next 5 to 6 years. Look at ABX and FEDEX rates. Could be wrong. Crazy business we are all in. Good luck to you as well.

 

[800Dog]

Are they really going to get that big of a raise at UPS? Do you think that their retirement is really stable? As for ABX, I know that DHL will soon start to play them against Astar for future growth, so you know what that means to their rates, plus they still have guys on furlough.

UPS is making 2.5 to 3 billion annual profit. Retirement is safe for now. Things certainly could change. Best bet for now.