Comair In Slc

[AFELLOWAVIATOR]

Fellowaviator
Thanks for the invite to explain how you started the race to the bottom. I see you have company on the board as PFT and, seemingly proud of it.

While others were earning a position in the proper, if not glamerous (but still honorable) path you dropped to your knees like a street hooker and toked on a schlong to get your position. Before you ever set foot in the industry you were doing your part to destroy it. There has to be a genesis to the state we collectively are in today. I can trace that back to your original sin of having no pride in yourself or your profession. PFT, what a way to start out. I suppose the good thing is that people know what you do, only thing to do is negotiate the price. Much the same as a prostitute.

Aviator TX
Just go ahead and call security. The word will eventually filter out who you are if you do it enough. Your at best a Captain at a regional. I am also. I know what powers you think you have. Its not much, just the same as me. So call security, it may give you the power trip you seek.

And you point is?????

Darn, no thank you yet.

Skywest pilots are pathetic. They look to us Unionized pilot groups to fight the fight and are unwilling to step in and do their part.


If it were not for the Unionized pilots standing up thru the years, just think what your salaries and working conditions would be like.

Pathetic, just pathetic.

 

[AviatorTx]

Re: You must be a joy to fly with...

So you regret not being a PFT "whore" while calling others out for something that does not even approach doing the damage you wish you had done to the industry? You can't have it both ways.

I'm confused.

I can tell you are confused. Sorry, I cannot help you there, but professional help is available.

Like I said... Unless you were a military pilot, you paid for training, or you parents did for you. Most of us are guilty in one way or another. Me included. There is little difference in paying for a CFI, or a ( insert plane type ) checkout. If you paid for a CFI in order to teach at a flight school to build time, you did the same as someone that paid for a COEX seat, or a type for a SWA interview. Lets just call a spade a spade. I'm not saying that's wrong, it's just a shame that there are that many more pilots than there are jobs to where the market can allow for such a thing.

Airline pilot jobs are traditionally union jobs. Any gains in the profession can be directly tied to one union or another. Hell, even Gulfstream is union. If you are working for a non-union carrier that consistently votes down union representation, you serve two purposes: Dragging down the rest of the industry, while owing any gains you have to the union folks that have set the bar in a certain area. Again though... It's all about you.

 

[Russ]

Fellowaviator
When I look at a clownair pilot, I dont see the things you would like me to. I see whining PFT babies in most of your senior ranks. I can understand your anger twords SkyWest, I agree with your argument about union issues. Read it again, I agree with you.

But I can help look at you as a leech yourself. For all the anger and disgust your harbor at SkyWest, I feel the same about clownair pilots who bought the job. Its unethical, dishonorable and pathetic. If you had it to do again would you inhale the meat like you did for a job, or now that you've seen the damage you did would you take the proper path?

 

[Rogue5]

I'm not saying that's wrong, it's just a shame that there are that many more pilots than there are jobs to where the market can allow for such a thing.

Airline pilot jobs are traditionally union jobs. Any gains in the profession can be directly tied to one union or another.

So can I assume from the above quotes you will be sending in your cheack to the various left-leaning election campains? I mean, in the name of consitancy, you should therefore be: A) against free-market capitalism, and b) supportive of progressive labor rights.

I don't know if you live on the west coast but I wonder if you may have shopped at Albertsons/Vons/Safeway during their latest stike for health-care benefits, will you refuse the opportunity to fly a Boeing because they have agreed with the new ANA deal to send the construction of the wing of the 7E7 overseas to Japan, and finally, close to home, I assume you will disagree with the ability of businnessmen to make unimpeded decisions without oversight, i.e.: COEX's decision to be an "all jet fleet," and then attempt to run routes that an ERJ could not support.

Did SkyWest steal your IAH flying because they are non-union? NO! They were offered it because it was run at a loss by XJET, who were spun off and therefore had to earn their keep. SkyWest still had EMB's, and could thus turn a profit. The union had nothing to do with it.

Did SkyWest bump all of your captains back to FO after 9/11? No. Becuase they were unaffiliated with any major and had no formal flow-through/back, their pilot group was not adversely affected by the layoffs at the majors.

Do SkyWest pilots make less than you do? Most likely not. Their work rules and pay are above industry average. By acceptiing this and not unionizing are they lowering the bar? How could they be?

This is a group of pilots by virtue of good fortune and good management have faired pretty well as of late. Lucky? Hell yes. Guilty of wrong-doing? Hell no! Listen: we're all doing the best we can. Some have been fortunate, some have not. I don't buy into this "I'm better becuase my airline is better that yours crap." I applied to almost every airline represented on this board and (knowing what I did at the time) would have gone to almost every one. The fact is, SkyWest called me first.

That, I believe, is the main reason why everyone of you is where you are today, for better or for worse.

This industy is severely damaged, but that is the economic world we live in today. The best we can do is focus energies on where the change needs to be made: labor representation with conflicts of interest, disinterested "leaders", government/industry corruption...

The pilot you see wearing another pair of wings is not your enemy, he is truely you.

 

[AviatorTx]

The pilot you see wearing another pair of wings is not your enemy, he is truely you.

Thus, the conflict: We are our own worst enemy...

 

[P38JLightning]

must be brave?

I can't believe the Skywest pilots would be hostile (either passive or agressive) towards the Comair pilots. Afterall, our standing up to management has directly benefited them. They are currently getting OUR flying, as ALL DCI orders and options were purchased by Comair and ASA, for Comair and ASA, not "DCI."

Skywest has grown like crazy on the "Delta side" since our strike, and has directly benefited from it in terms of pay and QOL. Yet they will NEVER be the top of the industry. Yet they will always benefit from those who fight to get to the top or fight to stay on top.

Its like when you invite your friends over to help you move, Skywest (and Chautauqua) are the friends who only pretend to lift their end of the sofa, and are only there for the free beer and pizza after the work is done.

Don't believe me? Just ask your "DCI family" and "scope impact" members who pledge mutual support to all of us in raising the bar and stopping the race to the bottom, because we are all in this together, then turn around and underbid us to help their company "win growth aircraft". A position you were in precisely because WE refused concessions to help ALL of us.

You're welcome. Fellow is right. You can save your cold shoulder for someone who cares.

 

[AFELLOWAVIATOR]

Well said P38!!!!!!! They just don't get it, do they?
Or they do get it and don't care? Who the puck knows.

They are leachs, plane and simple.


After we fought hard to raise the bar they knife us in the back with those whore wages just to get the aircraft we turned down by saying no to concessions.


Pathetic, just pathetic.

 

[AirBill]

Re: must be brave?

Its like when you invite your friends over to help you move, Skywest (and Chautauqua) are the friends who only pretend to lift their end of the sofa, and are only there for the free beer and pizza after the work is done.

P38,

It's not that no one appreciates what you guys did. We would have LOVED to get CMR + 6, or whatever number was floated. But it gets a little frustrating when we're tied with the "lowering the bar" crowd, when the fact is Mesa lowered the bar before we even got to that point in negotiations.

 

[Dave Benjamin]

Don't get me wrong. I thought it was funny. I guess what really p#ssed me off was not one of those guys and gals said "thank you" for fighting so hard for decent wages so those leachs could get paid what they do.( Except for the 70 seat pay, sorry, we tried. you just failed yourselves on that one.)

Oh my, one of the original PFT crowd is miffed that because he didn't get a group hug. Hey thanks for buying your job back in the 90's which put the bar so close to the ground to begin with.

What's even more amusing is that before CMR went on strike their pay and work rules were behind SkyWest. So CMR leapfrogs ahead in some respects and then 9/11 hits. So now we're listening to a CMR puke gloat over having a decent contract that just happened to be negotiated shortly prior to 9/11. I haven't seen too many regionals fare well in post 9/11 negotiations. Even now SKYW has some work rule advantages over many other carriers.

 

[AFELLOWAVIATOR]

Oh my, one of the original PFT crowd is miffed that because he didn't get a group hug. Hey thanks for buying your job back in the 90's which is what put the bar so close to the ground to begin with.

And your point is?