Comair Crash

[JCJ]

From airnav.com...

Apparently the runway lights on 26 were out of service until further notice. Listed as a daytime only runway. Only 75ft wide


Runway 8/26
Dimensions: 3500 x 75 ft. / 1067 x 23 m
Surface: asphalt/concrete, in poor condition
CONC IS SEVERELY CRACKED.
Weight bearing capacity:
Single wheel: 12500 lbs
Runway edge lights: medium intensity
MIRL RY 08/26 OTS INDEFLY.
Runway end identifier lights: yes
REIL OTS INDEFLY.
Touchdown point: yes, no lights

Although 8/26 is listed as 75' wide, the hard surface is actually 150' wide (same as 4/22). It is marked 75' wide, but in poor light it could appear to be 150' wide.

 

[kc81900]

Captain was a friend of mine he will be missed. My thoughts and prayers to his wife and family.

 

[mrnolmts]

Airport diagram:

http://download.aopa.org/ustprocs/20060803/airport_diagrams/00697AD.PDF

Hmmm... Looking at that diagram, and comparing to the live pictures on tv, it looks like the diagram isn't accurate. 4/22 has a overrun area with a taxiway leading up to it, from what I can see on tv. It is not depicted on the diagram. Looks like there are other discrepancies as well. Easy to make mistakes if you're looking at an inaccurate diagram...

 

[SoCentralRain]

All right. This is pathetic. As of 12:37 pm EDT, the female "reporter" on MSNBC stated that "their producer just tried calling the 1-800 number set up by Delta and was on hold for 15 minutes." Then she turned to ask a clinical psychologist how this 15 minute period must feel to those relatives and friends who were calling the hotline.

Perhaps if these incredibly irresponsible "producers" would stop flooding the 800 number with BS inquiries, they'd be able to get through more quickly. Jacknuts. Shame.

 

[Soverytired]

Was it a standup? Maybe a reduced rest overnight? I wonder if fatigue will be involved. Maybe the time has come for regionals to recognize pilot pushing.

God bless the families, friends and fellow employees.

My thoughts, exactly.

(after recently finishing a series of the patented Mesa "camping trips" . . . LEGAL DOES NOT MEAN SAFE)

God bless them, and lets hope that Congress will get off it's a$$ and shove some new laws down the airline industry's greedy gullet and get some sane rest rules, if this was a contributing factor.

 

[TOOL CRIB]

Although 8/26 is listed as 75' wide, the hard surface is actually 150' wide (same as 4/22). It is marked 75' wide, but in poor light it could appear to be 150' wide.

Yeah I see that now looking at Google maps (just type in LEX).

 

[Murdoughnut]

Please don't shoot the messenger ...

http://www.kentucky.com/mld/kentucky/15375985.htm

 

[BoilerUP]

www.wlextv.com

Live local LEX TV coverage...

I hope the FO pulls through, UK Med Center is excellent.

 

[TOOL CRIB]

Hmmm... Looking at that diagram, and comparing to the live pictures on tv, it looks like the diagram isn't accurate. 4/22 has a overrun area with a taxiway leading up to it, from what I can see on tv. It is not depicted on the diagram. Looks like there are other discrepancies as well. Easy to make mistakes if you're looking at an inaccurate diagram...

Good observation. 4/22 (maybe the whole airport) was closed for a few days either 1 or 2 weekends ago for repaving of 4/22. They also added some additional safety areas to the end of the runway. Obviously the live shots are accurate and new diagrams will probably be on the way.

 

[UM#1]

from all the helicopter video of the crash site its obvious that they used 26 not 22.

 

[Flightdawg]

too early to tell anything. the media are scum. i think a tendency to gab and a private pilot license makes you an "aviation expert" to the media.

God bless all those involved

It seems to work for iflyabeech.

Its student pilot stuff to take off on the right runway though. . . tired or not. . . .

oh boy wrong runway
COMPLACENCY!!!

There is complancency when you take off from the wrong freakin runway! and kill a load of people. Look at where the crash is. . .
Real mature with the "shutup" response.

My prayers and condolences for the survivor and the victim's families.

Does anyone have access to the crew members schedule? Specifically their rest schedule or circadian rhythm pattern?

 

[Flyin2low]

With all of the construction going on around there it would be very easy to mistake the runway thresholds of 22 and 26. The old taxiway A is barricaded off and the old A4 is re-signed as A now. Unfortunately the Jeppensen charts that we all use, still show it as A4. So at 6am, it would be very easy to get disoriented in that location especially with darkness and with possibly rain on the windows.

 

[81Horse]

Condolences to any of you who may have lost a friend or colleague -- and prayers go out for all the families who've lost a loved one today.

 

[Wasted]

Hmmm... Looking at that diagram, and comparing to the live pictures on tv, it looks like the diagram isn't accurate. 4/22 has a overrun area with a taxiway leading up to it, from what I can see on tv. It is not depicted on the diagram. Looks like there are other discrepancies as well. Easy to make mistakes if you're looking at an inaccurate diagram...

I agree. The Jepps haven't been updated yet with the changes at that airport. Absent specific instructions from the controller "taxi Alpha, cross 26, Alpha 5, to runway 22," I think it would be very easy for someone to accidentally takeoff from 26 in the dark of early morning since once you get on 26, you would find that Alpha straight ahead no longer takes you to 22 and you would be led to think that you are already on 22.

 

[iflyabeech]

It seems to work for iflyabeech.



My prayers and condolences for the survivor and the victim's families.

Does anyone have access to the crew members schedule? Specifically their rest schedule or circadian rhythm pattern?

First of all. My prayers are with the crew, passengersr and the families.

Guys I apologize for calling a spade a spade. I hope I am wrong, and of course I am just speculating, but. . . .

"The plane was largely intact afterward, but there was a fire following the impact, police said.

A little after 6 a.m., flight controllers gave the pilots clearance to take off from runway 22 and the pilots acknowledged the controllers with a "roger," Orr reports. However, it appears the pilots took off from runway 26, which is only half the size of the 7,000 foot runway 22.

Sources tell Orr the radar tape and debris from the crash site suggest the plane never got airborne, that instead it went off the end of the runway and through a retaining area before settling into the crash site where it seems a significant post-crash fire erupted. "

 

[EOpilot]

All right. This is pathetic. As of 12:37 pm EDT, the female "reporter" on MSNBC stated that "their producer just tried calling the 1-800 number set up by Delta and was on hold for 15 minutes." Then she turned to ask a clinical psychologist how this 15 minute period must feel to those relatives and friends who were calling the hotline.

Perhaps if these incredibly irresponsible "producers" would stop flooding the 800 number with BS inquiries, they'd be able to get through more quickly. Jacknuts. Shame.

Wow, that's almost exactly the wording I used in the email I just wrote to MSNBC.

From my email-

"I just watched your anchor on MSNBC, while interviewing a psychologist,
mention to him that when a producer called the victim family hotline
for Delta Airlines he was put on hold for 15 minutes, and asked how
terrible it is to make family members wait for so long to hear whether
their loved ones are alive or dead.

Did it ever occur to anyone that the flood of calls from disgustingly
irresonsible news producers across the country might contribute to that
wait?

I'm used to news reporters being irresponsible, but this makes me sick.
I would say that this producer should be ashamed, but I'm not sure
he/she is intelligent enough to understand why.

So in lieu of that, let him/her know that I stopped by to say, "F***
you."

Thanks.

Bill Douglas"


The email was not censored.

 

[captjorge74]

God speed on everyone.

 

[crashpad]

SoCentralRain is exactly correct. I've been following this since it broke. I'm a former tv news employee and want to puke in the face of these reporters!
The reporting is irresponsible and thinly veiled to paint pictures of a hundred different horrific mental pictures for the general public to consume. Morons!

When the story first broke, it was nothing more than what they reported 6 hours later. However, it was given minimal airtime over hurricane Ernesto and hostage news. It was obvious they were given the 'thumbs up' to run with this when some senior manager woke up.

Yes Soverytired, let's pray for these families and that the powers that be effect 'Immediate and Unconditional Change' to the level of energy Regional Airlines are allowed to extract from there pilots. They need to be regulated by number of legs flown per day, and not the maximum hours allowed to schedule by law.

 

[ReportCanoa]

Having the rwy heading bugged before you leave the gate is a good policy.

 

[pianoman]

I don't think anyone has a problem with you calling a "spade a spade", Beech. The problem is your arrogant attitude of being above mistakes. I think the more experienced among us agree that things like this can and do happen to almost anyone. Not "student pilots", as you so sensitively wrote.

Again, you're telling me you never almost landed on the wrong runway before?

There's a reason many of the airports we go to have notes saying "runway X may easily be mistaken for Y"......