CHQ new Delta jets?

[NYRANGERS]

Re: Re: Beautiful Irony

NY Rangers, you completely misunderstand the issues. The RJDC litigation is the result of ASA and Comair being locked out of bargaining by ALPA. Comair and ASA does not have scope because ALPA would not allow us to negotiate with Delta because of the objections of the Delta MEC.

Now ALPA is finally starting to realize the RJDC is correct on this point. A couple of weeks ago Duane Woerth was in CVG telling Comair pilots that in exchange for concessions the union would require that Delta be a signatory to the scope section of the Comair contract.

You and the others who parrot the ALPA line and add in the more radical political spin need to update your information - because your union is beginning to spin issues a lot like the RJDC.

Hey if ALPA finally comes around to actually lead us into a "brand scope" or "inclusive scope" I don't care who's idea it was. It is not a matter of who is right, but rather, what is right.

~~~^~~~

I understand the situation completly, thank you. Up until very recently, the comair mec and rjdc have tried not to step on each other too much. Now it seems the mec (cmr) is distancing itself from the the rjdc. The comair mec is smelling a loser in the rjdc and is now trying to open constructive dialog with our (Delta) MEC.

I don't care for the J4J idea. I would be happy with the opportunity to work for one of our DCI carriers (at the bottom of the seniority list) w/o resigning my number. I know some of you ASA guys and most of the comair guys don't like the idea.

All I am trying to say is.......with regards to the interest of furloughed pilots (of all airlines). We would incourage new aircraft to go to airlines with pilots that are willing to fly with us (us being just like any new hire) and not to a group whose mec does not care for the idea.

If Chautauqua gets all of "your"(cmr, I know you fly for ASA) new growth aircraft.................I don't yet see a problem with that. I would rather see the aircraft go to ASA, but CHA will hire furloughed pilots as well.(with out cmr restrictions).

I am sure there are many furloughed pilots (of all airlines) that welcome the opportunity to fly and support their families doing what they are best at.

NYR

 

[bailout]

>>Might want to check your sources. Look for a BIG increase in DFW. Sorry.<<


On the DCI side? or with someone else? This was given to us in print, basically saying that ASA will be picking up alot more of the flying in DFW due to CHQ and SKW reducing their presence in DFW.

 

[FDJ2]

Two and a half weeks ago, Duane Woerthe told us at the Comair meeting, according to my notes, "You are only here because you are cheaper than Delta (pilots)."

Yesterday, FDJ2 said, "... the only reason you fly a single hour of the DAL code is because you are willing to do it for less than a mainline pilot."

I am mortified, I mean gratified the president of my Union holds me in such high regard.

He just doesn't want you to be anymore dillusional than you need to be. The facts hurt, but they are the facts. Without any meaningful scope over the 70 seat and under category the flying goes to the lowest bidder. Management never offered the RJ flying to the mainline because the costs were too high, so the CMR pilots scooped it up, but now there are literally thousands of pilots willing to do it for even less than you. If their overall costs are less than CMR, you can bet your paycheck that they'll get the flying. That's life without scope and that's the world that so many CMR pilots yearn for by supporting the RJDC and their attack on the longstanding scope of ALPA pilots. It's just ironic, that the pilot group that is most vocal about abrogating the scope protections of others, may be the first to suffer from their own lack of scope.

 

[FDJ2]

ONCE AGAIN. The Delta pilots NEVER negotiated a pay scale for the CL-65. NEVER. So you too are incorrect when you make this statement.
Why do you guys keep saying this when you know it is wrong?

Like the DEMS? If you say a lie enough times, it becomes the truth ?

You are truly ignorant of how pay rates are negotiated. The DMEC does not proffer a wage on a non existing airframes on the mainline. Once management purchases an airframe for the mainline than negotiations on pay and work rules begin. FYI, we don't have wages on the A380, B747, A320 etc., etc.

If you still want to live in lala land and believe for a second that the reason DAL outsourced 100% of the RJ flying had nothing to do with the cheaper costs associated with the CMR pilots v. the mainline than have at it, but you are not only wrong, but intentionally disingenuous.

 

[trainerjet]

You are truly ignorant

Yep. That pretty much sums it up. The most ignorant, stupid poster on this entire board.

 

[AFELLOWAVIATOR]

AND...

what you people obviously don't understand, or simply cannot comprehend, is we don't give a crap where they put those airplanes now. We will not whore ourselves out just to get more flying, as so many have done.

We fought hard for our contract, and will not stand by and see our contract gutted when Comair financials show no need for concessions.

I don't know why this is so hard for you people to comprehend.

 

[NYRANGERS]

AND...

what you people obviously don't understand, or simply cannot comprehend, is we don't give a crap where they put those airplanes now. We will not whore ourselves out just to get more flying, as so many have done.


I don't know why this is so hard for you people to comprehend.

What you are really saying is..............you won't whore yourselves out for more flying in airplanes you already have...........you will whore yourselves to fly Delta 737's etc. etc.

You rjdc A-holes don't want pressure on your pay scale's but you're more than happy to put pressure on other companies larger ones.

It's all one big mess. Cmr mec doesn't want Delta pilots on their property and rjdc is trying to destroy scope language for ALL airlines (unless they can get ALPA to settle out of court for $$$$$$$$, or get DOH with Delta or some other BS.). You talk big about upholding the profession and then join a lawsuit built to destroy it.

You guys suck.

 

[Stick Man]

i can comprehend just fine thanks...

AFELLOW WROTE:

AND...

what you people obviously don't understand, or simply cannot comprehend, is we don't give a crap where they put those airplanes now. We will not whore ourselves out just to get more flying, as so many have done.

We fought hard for our contract, and will not stand by and see our contract gutted when Comair financials show no need for concessions.

I don't know why this is so hard for you people to comprehend.


__________________
Afellowaviator


Well AFELL, you have just admitted your inability to actually understand what your amazing contract did at Comair. You set your self up for future contract reneg.'s (or guttings as I believe you put it) due to the fact that 7% above is just that - 7% ABOVE! (on the average - of course). Your ignorance to the fact that you dont care where aircraft are placed shows how little you know about the economy and a rising fair market principle. We haven't even completed the 8th full fiscal quarter since 9/11 and you think that you'll never need to give into some concessions based on Comairs current finances.

Well, you better hope that not much changes in the order of next November. You better be on your knees everynight before you start, continue on or complete your 5 day trips at CMR, praying that the market continues to perform like it has over the past 8 mos. If the economy has a hiccup, another 9/11 happens or if Bedford and Orenstein have more opprtunities to buy more, place more shiny new ones or gain even more market recognition, then there's a patch of ground in Northern KY that will slow down - maybe just a lil - but slow down nonetheless. And while you may still be sitting pretty in the left seat - you can't argue with the fact that you're company passes on difficulties to its employees. Every company does it and you better prepare yourself.

In closing (this long winded response), congrats on an awesome contract at CMR. You make a lot more dough than I do. However - the difference between a lot more dough and a little more dough is minimal until you make 150K a year by the way. In fact - a 5th year CA at any regional is still in the same tax bracket as any other 5th yr CA at a similar regional (or national - flying regional equipment for that matter). Me - I'll take my company's long term financial health and be happy with that. Don't be happy with the money you make - make money with the money you make - you'll be happy then.

 

[trainerjet]

Re: i can comprehend just fine thanks...

AFELLOW WROTE:

AND...

what you people obviously don't understand, or simply cannot comprehend, is we don't give a crap where they put those airplanes now. We will not whore ourselves out just to get more flying, as so many have done.

We fought hard for our contract, and will not stand by and see our contract gutted when Comair financials show no need for concessions.

I don't know why this is so hard for you people to comprehend.


__________________
Afellowaviator


Well AFELL, you have just admitted your inability to actually understand

Inablility to actually understand.....sounds alot like a definition of stupid.

 

[AFELLOWAVIATOR]

Re: i can comprehend just fine thanks...

AFELLOW WROTE:

AND...

what you people obviously don't understand, or simply cannot comprehend, is we don't give a crap where they put those airplanes now. We will not whore ourselves out just to get more flying, as so many have done.

We fought hard for our contract, and will not stand by and see our contract gutted when Comair financials show no need for concessions.

I don't know why this is so hard for you people to comprehend.


__________________
Afellowaviator


Well AFELL, you have just admitted your inability to actually understand what your amazing contract did at Comair. You set your self up for future contract reneg.'s (or guttings as I believe you put it) due to the fact that 7% above is just that - 7% ABOVE! (on the average - of course). Your ignorance to the fact that you dont care where aircraft are placed shows how little you know about the economy and a rising fair market principle. We haven't even completed the 8th full fiscal quarter since 9/11 and you think that you'll never need to give into some concessions based on Comairs current finances.

Well, you better hope that not much changes in the order of next November. You better be on your knees everynight before you start, continue on or complete your 5 day trips at CMR, praying that the market continues to perform like it has over the past 8 mos. If the economy has a hiccup, another 9/11 happens or if Bedford and Orenstein have more opprtunities to buy more, place more shiny new ones or gain even more market recognition, then there's a patch of ground in Northern KY that will slow down - maybe just a lil - but slow down nonetheless. And while you may still be sitting pretty in the left seat - you can't argue with the fact that you're company passes on difficulties to its employees. Every company does it and you better prepare yourself.

In closing (this long winded response), congrats on an awesome contract at CMR. You make a lot more dough than I do. However - the difference between a lot more dough and a little more dough is minimal until you make 150K a year by the way. In fact - a 5th year CA at any regional is still in the same tax bracket as any other 5th yr CA at a similar regional (or national - flying regional equipment for that matter). Me - I'll take my company's long term financial health and be happy with that. Don't be happy with the money you make - make money with the money you make - you'll be happy then.

Unreal. That one word just about sums up your post. You sir, don't get it and never will. Unreal.

 

[AFELLOWAVIATOR]

What you are really saying is..............you won't whore yourselves out for more flying in airplanes you already have...........you will whore yourselves to fly Delta 737's etc. etc.

You rjdc A-holes don't want pressure on your pay scale's but you're more than happy to put pressure on other companies larger ones.

It's all one big mess. Cmr mec doesn't want Delta pilots on their property and rjdc is trying to destroy scope language for ALL airlines (unless they can get ALPA to settle out of court for $$$$$$$$, or get DOH with Delta or some other BS.). You talk big about upholding the profession and then join a lawsuit built to destroy it.

You guys suck.

What ever.

 

[AFELLOWAVIATOR]

Re: Re: i can comprehend just fine thanks...

Inablility to actually understand.....sounds alot like a definition of stupid.

Uh. What?

 

[AFELLOWAVIATOR]

You are truly ignorant of how pay rates are negotiated. The DMEC does not proffer a wage on a non existing airframes on the mainline. Once management purchases an airframe for the mainline than negotiations on pay and work rules begin. FYI, we don't have wages on the A380, B747, A320 etc., etc.

If you still want to live in lala land and believe for a second that the reason DAL outsourced 100% of the RJ flying had nothing to do with the cheaper costs associated with the CMR pilots v. the mainline than have at it, but you are not only wrong, but intentionally disingenuous.

YOU said we are willing to fly them for less. That would mean we will fly them for x amount, and you would fly them for x amount. And our X amount is less than your X amount. I was just responding to your assertion with facts, and you were unable to respond to mine with facts. How do you know our rates are lower until you negotiate a rate??????

 

[Stick Man]

amazing

What's amazing is that it took u three posts to reply with the comebacks of:

1. Unreal

2. Uh What?

3. Whatever

You must have helped CMR's negotiating comittee when they negotiated their contract. Thanks for coming back with a 5 sentence response and doing yourself justice.

 

[trainerjet]

Re: Re: Re: i can comprehend just fine thanks...

Uh. What?

Exactly. Every time you post, your ignorance and stupidity rule. Why do you continue to embarrass yourself and your company?