Ata

[SNK]

proposed 717 pay rates

Would somebody in the know please post the proposed 717 pay rates that would be imposed if the LOA package is passed?

Thanks,

SNK

 

[atafan]

8 years at ATA, 8 pretty good years, finally making a little money.

Is Airtran hiring? I'm ready to sit in the right seat again, hope they will consider me.

I've finally lost faith in this Roadshow experiment.

 

[Ty Webb]

Don't laugh. There was a guy in my AirTran newhire class who was an ATA 757 FO with 5 or 6 years invested there. He left for AirTran because he lived in ATL and was tired of commuting. He had been jumpseating on us to MDW for years . . . . finally saw AirTran getting to the point where he would like to work there, and jumped ship.

This was in 2001. before your new contract was voted in.

Anyway, whatever you guys do at ATA, best of luck. I always enjoyed flying on ATA as a pax, and appreciated the rides when I was a 135 pilot, and hope the Company pulls their finances together.

 

[datafox]

NOW, THEREFORE, the Parties agree as follows:



A. For purposes of this Letter of Agreement, the term “New Aircraft” as used throughout this agreement shall pertain to only one aircraft type with no less than one hundred (100) and no more than one hundred and ten (110) seats.



B. New Aircraft Base Hourly Rates: Section 3.A. of the Collective Bargaining Agreement (“CBA”) shall be amended to add the following base hourly rates.



1. The following base hourly rates shall be effective on the date of signing (“DOS”) of this Agreement:



Longevity

Step CA F/O

Year 1 $ 37.50 $ 37.50

Year 2 90.89 45.45

Year 3 93.58 51.47

Year 4 96.29 57.78

Year 5 98.98 64.33

Year 6 101.78 67.18

Year 7 104.54 69.00

Year 8 107.34 70.84

Year 9 110.16 72.40

Year 10 114.28 73.73

Year 11 117.42 75.29

Year 12 and over 120.00 77.76



2. The following base hourly rates shall become effective July 1, 2006:



Longevity

Step CA F/O

Year 1 $ 39.19 $ 39.19

Year 2 94.98 47.49

Year 3 97.79 53.78

Year 4 100.62 60.37

Year 5 103.43 67.23

Year 6 106.36 70.20

Year 7 109.25 72.10

Year 8 112.17 74.03

Year 9 115.11 75.65

Year 10 119.42 77.05

Year 11 122.70 78.67

Year 12 and over 125.40 81.26



3. The following base hourly rates shall become effective July 1, 2007:



Longevity

Step CA F/O

Year 1 $ 40.50 $ 40.50

Year 2 100.00 50.00

Year 3 104.80 57.64

Year 4 109.60 65.76

Year 5 114.40 74.36

Year 6 119.20 78.67

Year 7 124.00 81.84

Year 8 128.80 85.01

Year 9 133.60 88.18

Year 10 138.40 88.58

Year 11 143.20 91.65

Year 12 and over 148.00 96.20

 

[Freight Dog]

These rates are pretty crappy in comparison to Airtran and Hawaiian (other 717 operator). Hawaiian is still operating under Chapter 11, although I think they'll be out sometime this fall.


Source: Airlinepilotpay.com

 

[yaks]

For the record:


B737-800 pay rates for AA effective 5/1/04

Cpt.

Year 6- $149.10
Year 12- $156.12

FO

Year 6- $93.93
Year 12- $106.16

Does not include night or international override.

 

[tz800ca]

8 years at ATA, 8 pretty good years, finally making a little money.

I've finally lost faith in this Roadshow experiment.

Agreed. If this agreement does get in, it will be a GIANT step backwards.

Oh well......

 

[Noam]

These rates are pretty crappy in comparison to Airtran and Hawaiian (other 717 operator). Hawaiian is still operating under Chapter 11, although I think they'll be out sometime this fall.


Source: Airlinepilotpay.com

I agree with you. In some instances they are even crappy compared to Midwest's concessionary rates. Are you surprised? A classic case of eating your young...fresh from the minds of ALPA national.

 

[tzskipper]

For the record:


B737-800 pay rates for AA effective 5/1/04

Cpt.

Year 6- $149.10
Year 12- $156.12

FO

Year 6- $93.93
Year 12- $106.16

FWIW, if the intent is to compare these rates to ATA, here you go:

Captain

AA year 6- 127.23 (adjusted for 75 hour guarantee). ATA - 132.97

AA year 12- 133.22 (adjusted for 75 hour guaranntee) ATA - 145.26

First Officer

AA year 6- 80.15 (adjusted for 75 hour guarantee) ATA - 87.76

AA year 12- 106.16 (adjusted for 75 hour guarantee) ATA - 93.93


The "new" TA will have an amendable date of 07/01/07 (once passed).

The 07/01/07 rates will be as follows:

ATA year 6- 148.82 (75 hour guarantee)

ATA year 12- 181.95 (75 hour guarantee)

(the posting of these numbers is not a shot at the AA group. They did what they felt they had to do, as will ATA.

++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

Nobody likes the fact that ATA is in the position of needing help. The whole idea of the amended CBA is to have a successful airline to negotiate with in 2007.

Fraternally and good luck to all,

Skipper

 

[Splert]

The whole idea of the amended CBA is to have a successful airline to negotiate with in 2007.

Bingo.

 

[Pickle]

Apples and Oranges.

I believe that it was yaks who brought up the 6 year and 12 year captain and payscales at AA vs. ATA.

Exactly how many 6 year 737 captains are there at AA??

 

[njcapt]

I believe that it was yaks who brought up the 6 year and 12 year captain and payscales at AA vs. ATA.

Exactly how many 6 year 737 captains are there at AA??

I would scientifically postulate that there are a whole buttload of 6 year 737 Captains at ATA, and not a single one at AA.

OK, I went to the Jan 2004 seniority list and counted (a number of pilots have upgraded since then, though), there are 47 737 Captains at the six year pay scale or lower.

Not sure what the point is, but you get to make big bucks a lot sooner at ATA than AA.

 

[80drvr]

FWIW, if the intent is to compare these rates to ATA, here you go:

Captain

AA year 6- 127.23 (adjusted for 75 hour guarantee). ATA - 132.97

AA year 12- 133.22 (adjusted for 75 hour guaranntee) ATA - 145.26


Skipper

I'm not sure I follow your logic in adjusting AA's pay scale. Could you elaborate?

 

[tzskipper]

AA has a 64 hour minimum guarantee. ATA has a 75 hour minimum guarantee. To keep things equal, I multiplied AA's hourly rate X 64 and then divided the sum by 75. This was to come up with a 75 hour rate for the AA scale.

This is simplistic, but I hope it helps....

Skipper

 

[Pickle]

njcapt said: "Not sure what the point is, but you get to make big bucks a lot sooner at ATA than AA."


Well, the point was that there are no 6 year captains at AA, and there are many 6 and 5 year captains at ATA. So comparing a 6 year 737 captain at the two is really not much of a comparison, AA could pay a 6 year 737 captain $500 per hour, it does not matter, since there are none. Yes, I do realize that if 6 year was $500 then 12 year would probably be $800.

 

[80drvr]

AA has a 64 hour minimum guarantee. ATA has a 75 hour minimum guarantee. To keep things equal, I multiplied AA's hourly rate X 64 and then divided the sum by 75. This was to come up with a 75 hour rate for the AA scale.

This is simplistic, but I hope it helps....

Skipper

It's inaccurate. Reserve Guarantee is 73 hours. Bid lines are built to 75-78 hours scheduled time with voluntuntary pick up to 83 hours scheduled time. Actual hours paid trend higher due to a complicated diminishing scheduled projection that allows pilots pick up more time as they underfly their block hours. The company is tightly manned, so access to additionnal flying is not an issue.

I don't know what relevance guarantee has to pay rates. I'd agree higher is better, but it's only applicable if you don't fly.

 

[NZCHooverboy]

For What it is worth

I recently talked with an NROTC Classmate of mine who is an AA 757 captain. I make more than he does due to wage X guarantee.

Another post on this site has AA mgmt asking for more concessions later. Given that, UAL's peril, Delta's impending bankruptcy filing, I think we're lucky that we are not in such dire straits. It is also encouraging to see George FINALLY cleaning house.

 

[80drvr]

I recently talked with an NROTC Classmate of mine who is an AA 757 captain. I make more than he does due to wage X guarantee.

Another post on this site has AA mgmt asking for more concessions later. Given that, UAL's peril, Delta's impending bankruptcy filing, I think we're lucky that we are not in such dire straits. It is also encouraging to see George FINALLY cleaning house.

AA 757 avg line built to 75:16 @ 164/hr or 12,349/mo. Reserve is 73:00.

 

[jjbiv]

I heard that the LOAs have been ratified. True?

 

[Pickle]

Boy, you heard that fast. MEC just sent the emails out 15 minutes ago!

Anyway, about 85% of eligible voters voted, and about 72% voted in favor.