ALPA fails at JB

[RiddleEagle18]

If an inhouse was tried next I think it would pass 80/20

 

[Flyer1015]

What is M&A?

2. TWA and American. - Sued and Convicted of DFR

What is DFR?

 

[Tripower455]

No, and I don't think ALPA is the only way to get a CBA .... Right ?
An ALPA CBA usually has holes in it large enough to walk through.

You should see a SWAPA CBA! Talk about getting steamrolled!

 

[charlie2]

What is M&A?



What is DFR?

Merger/Aquisition

Duty of Fair Representation

 

[charlie2]

You should see a SWAPA CBA! Talk about getting steamrolled!

I know...poor guys!

 

[Flyer1015]

Merger/Aquisition

Duty of Fair Representation

Thanks!

 

[LearLove]

good - F' ALPA. Now go form your own inhouse union

 

[Caveman]

good - F' ALPA. Now go form your own inhouse union

Where the F' have you been? In-house was tried and failed. Now this. What's next? Teamsters? No thank you.

 

[charlie2]

Where the F' have you been? In-house was tried and failed. Now this. What's next? Teamsters? No thank you.

It was tried? I guess that's why I thought you had a CBA. Anyone is better than none in an M/A.

 

[Flyer1015]

If there is no union, whether ALPA, Teamsters, or in-house, what exactly happens in a M&A scenario?

Doesn't ALPA have some bylaws that address a scenario of merging an ALPA carrier with one that is non-union?

 

[Caveman]

If there is no union, whether ALPA, Teamsters, or in-house, what exactly happens in a M&A scenario?

Doesn't ALPA have some bylaws that address a scenario of merging an ALPA carrier with one that is non-union?

Bond-McC states that a non-union pilot group will be represented by their management in a merger/acquisition. Guess how that's gonna work out?

 

[charlie2]

If there is no union, whether ALPA, Teamsters, or in-house, what exactly happens in a M&A scenario?

Doesn't ALPA have some bylaws that address a scenario of merging an ALPA carrier with one that is non-union?

Staple them I think.

 

[charlie2]

Bond-McC states that a non-union pilot group will be represented by their management in a merger/acquisition. Guess how that's gonna work out?

Excellent for management...golden parachutes/bonuses/free first class pos space for life...are you implying that's not good?

 

[Fins Up]

An in-house union would have been nice if the company indicated it would take any sort of 'friendly' approach to it. They didn't. As Blue Dude said, what's next? I wouldn't vote for the IBT aka 'Dumstahs union'.

It's sad. Regardless of all ALPA's shortcomings, I am realizing today that right now I could have access to the best safety, medical, and legal representation a pilot could want if he gets his butt in a sling. Now I have only jetblue's jv legal squad. I could maybe contribute to a group that is responsible for the working and safety rules by which my pilot group lives under. Now all I can say is, sorry guys, I tried.

 

[charlie2]

An in-house union would have been nice if the company indicated it would take any sort of 'friendly' approach to it. They didn't. As Blue Dude said, what's next? I wouldn't vote for the IBT aka 'Dumstahs union'.

It's sad. Regardless of all ALPA's shortcomings, I am realizing today that right now I could have access to the best safety, medical, and legal representation a pilot could want if he gets his butt in a sling. Now I have only jetblue's jv legal squad. I could maybe contribute to a group that is responsible for the working and safety rules by which my pilot group lives under. Now all I can say is, sorry guys, I tried.

Is there a waiting period to try again? If the numbers are correct it wasn't that far off.

 

[Fins Up]

No, and I don't think ALPA is the only way to get a CBA .... Right ?
An ALPA CBA usually has holes in it large enough to walk through.

You have to have a solid item in which to have holes. Our current documents don't even meet that criterium.

 

[Fins Up]

Is there a waiting period to try again? If the numbers are correct it wasn't that far off.

I believe it's one year. I sure somebody here knows for sure.

 

[charlie2]

I believe it's one year. I sure somebody here knows for sure.

A year goes by really fast and I'm sure your guys and gals will see the great potential for a future M/A and see the need for a union. Good luck. Remember, whatever CBA you have it may change in that M/A..TWA was ALPA and now the TWA pilots are not but at least they have something if another M/A happens to them...it might!

 

[sligo1]

J.B. pilots will never go for an in house union. The cost associated with fee's, assesments and initial operating will never pass. I think the pilot group should have bought insurance, before the accident. Hope I am wrong but nothing good can come from two failed attempts.

 

[Smarta$$]

After 2 failed attempts, it looks like the company has permission to withhold any substantial future raises.

 

[slaquer5]

The most miserable group of pilots ever assembled.

Also, the only time in my career I've been embarrassed to wear a uniform.

Dont be ALPA sucks. they would sell you guys down the river in a NY minute.

 

[MCDU]

We were talking about M&A. I'm telling you that ALPA doesn't appear to help. Here's a list of recent wins that ALPA has been a part of;

1. USAIR and Am West. - Disaster

2. TWA and American. - Sued and Convicted of DFR

3. AirTran and SWA. - Steamrolled and on the verge of a staple

4. CAL and United - Jury is still out. Not looking rosy.

You forgot Atlas Polar.

M

 

[Fubijaakr]

Why did they not pass it? Simply put, because there are a LOT of the original B6 guys were furloughed USAir and UAL pilots who blame their furlough on ALPA.

ALPA doesn't furlough, the Company does.

 

[StopNTSing]

Okay then. With that vote out of the way, maybe now ALPA will give the MEC at ATN the green light to finally poop or get off the pot with their AIP.

 

[waveflyer]

Ah yes- the airline pilots of the US- militantly anti-union, while collectively bargaining. Just dumb. The only thing getting steamrolled is the middle class as republicans and tea baggers continue to take up for billionaires at the expense of the middle class.
Your CEO has representation AND a contract, but the 2000 pilots of JETBLU don't....
Amazing.

 

[Beetle007]

Bond-McC states that a non-union pilot group will be represented by their management in a merger/acquisition. Guess how that's gonna work out?

How does it affect the jetBlue pilots that they sign individual contracts for individual terms of employment? Is it still a 5 year contract or is it a permanent contract. Bond-McCaskill only applies to "covered employees" which could be jeopardized when employees have individual non-permanent contracts of employment. For example, Bond-McCaskill does not apply to management employees.

Do jetBlue pilots have merger protections in their individual contracts? For example, does the individual contract mention that Allegheny-Mohawk protects shall be provided to the pilot.

 

[thruthemurk]

Ah yes- the airline pilots of the US- militantly anti-union, while collectively bargaining. Just dumb. The only thing getting steamrolled is the middle class as republicans and tea baggers continue to take up for billionaires at the expense of the middle class.
Your CEO has representation AND a contract, but the 2000 pilots of JETBLU don't....
Amazing.

Exactly. I am embarrassed to be part of this pilot group today. The stuff I have heard come from the mouths of the ignorant over the last few months is simply staggering. In addition to past legacy furloughees (of which I am one), do not underestimate the incredible number of ex-Mesa "just happy to be here" crew. Many (not all) truly have no self respect.

 

[charlie2]

Ah yes- the airline pilots of the US- militantly anti-union, while collectively bargaining. Just dumb. The only thing getting steamrolled is the middle class as republicans and tea baggers continue to take up for billionaires at the expense of the middle class.
Your CEO has representation AND a contract, but the 2000 pilots of JETBLU don't....
Amazing.

and quite a contract it is. he/she got an mba...thats really hard...not really

 

[GuppyPuppy]

After many years at JB I feel like I'm driving a Ferrari with no insurance. Get in an accident? Too bad. Lose your eyesight due to sharks with frickin' laser beams? Tough luck.

I'm making a good living right now at JB, but God help me if my health poops out or we get bought/merged. That Ferrari goes bye-bye and I'm stuck begging for rides with some crack head who's driving his Dad's Yugo.

The outcome of this vote stinks.

GP

 

[Neubyfly]

Is being ALPA in an M/A better?

It sure wasn't for TWA.