Airtran posts 4th quarter profit of 1.9 million

[CaptAntoineMack]

We are like spoiled children, we are not deserving of respect or understanding, and our claims laughable that us children will have the grownups hash it out....

These responses absolutely further inflames a dicey situation. In a casual conversation with an assistant chief, he asked what I thought of the purchase and I asked him what have others been saying. He said although this may be good for the profit margin, largely he is concerned about what he is hearing about what the Airtran pilots are saying and hopes that Gary is listening.

This is what I guess would be "unverifiable data". When half of your unionized work force is not supporting this purchase, I know our highly respectable executives will take pause and say, is this worth it? Or, is there a way around this without frustrating at least half of our core work group?

This is a business before it is our careers.

Call us what ever you want. This is who we are. You don't like it maybe you should start looking for a place you will feel like more of a fit. You will be miserable here at our company if you can't understand or respect our concerns of outsiders coming in.

 

[Ty Webb]

Thankfully your laughable claim to "speak for" the pilots at SWA is far from the case and in the end the grown ups will hash this out.

Man, ain't that the truth! I don't claim to speak for anyone but myself. . . . Some of the SWA guys on here are even claiming to speak for the mechanics now. . . :laugh:

 

[ivauir]

Hey Snoop D O Double G you and the other pilots over there at SWA aren't giving us Airtran pilots anything. Nothing. Zip. Zilch. Nada.

Cool.

Keep your contract then.

 

[XRMEFLYER]

You are clueless if you think our pilots are not giving you anything.

Help me understand then oh wise and benevolent one.

 

[CaptAntoineMack]

Man, ain't that the truth! I don't claim to speak for anyone but myself. . . . Some of the SWA guys on here are even claiming to speak for the mechanics now. . . :laugh:

I can say that the mechanics are as concerned as the pilots and flight attendants. That is what the two, three or four mechanics that I see every trip say about what their work group is talking about.

 

[CaptAntoineMack]

Help me understand then oh wise and benevolent one.

Our pilot group does have the power to not include you in our contract. And our scope language keeps Southwest from code sharing with your airline.

Ponder that.

 

[Ty Webb]

Our pilot group does have the power to not include you in our contract. And our scope language keeps Southwest from code sharing with your airline.

Ponder that.

If you believe what you have written, you don't understand the process. Whatever, buddy. It's not my job to educate you.

See you on the other side, and we can resume this conversation then.

 

[roughneck]

Ty,

You will get the Swapa contract when Swapa and SWA decide you will get it. Not a second before. Not even an arbitrator can give you our contract without Swapa and SWA deciding to give it to you. Enjoy your contract, we will enjoy ours.

 

[CaptAntoineMack]

If you believe what you have written, you don't understand the process. Whatever, buddy. It's not my job to educate you.

See you on the other side, and we can resume this conversation then.

Oh wise one, you are soooooo misinformed. There is absolutely NO requirement to have you on a SWAPA seniority list. We can easily allow the company (transition agreement with SWAPA and SWA) to operate Airtran separately. And being the acquired company, likely the courts will decide what will happen to you. We as a union legally do not require you to be members. And if you don't understand this, keep on living in your own "flat earth society".

Ty, there are now stickers at SWA that has your name with circle/slash to show the displeasure of this purchase. You are becoming infamous in a Lee Harvey Oswald kind of way.

 

[gt1900]

I think its a two way street, and everyone needs to realize that. Is the SWA contract good, absolutely. But the AAI guys also have some resentment that our bargaining power was taken away from us, and we didn't get the contract we deserved because of it. If this deal falls through, then trust me, there will be uproar over our contract (not that there isn't enough already) that we signed. So ya, the AAI guys want this to go through, we all bet our current contract on it. It is also not the end all be all. This merger has already most likely cost me my upgrade, and that WILL cost me money over the next 5-10 years. Nobody can say for sure what would have happened in 15-20 years, just because SWA has a better contract now, doesn't mean they would have always had a better contract. WHo knows, AMR could have bought AAI, or AAI could have merged with ALA. There are many different scenerios that would have eventually played out. And remember, up until about 10 years ago, SWA was one of the bottom feeders as far as contract's go. The SWA guys also need to realize that you are hiring again because of the growth opportunities that AAI brings. That is a good thing for both pilot groups. This slows down upgrade times for AAI guys, and starts movement again for the SWA guys. Yes, the AAI guys are getting the better deal, but not if we get stapled. Hopefully, there will be a happy median between both pilot groups, and nobody will have a windfall.

 

[roughneck]

Yes, the AAI guys are getting the better deal, but not if we get staple

Not true. My domicile rep says they were briefed by an outside consultant and that even a staple gives every pilot on your seniority list an increase in career earnings when the payrates, rigs, and retirement are factored in.

 

[XRMEFLYER]

We are like spoiled children, we are not deserving of respect or understanding, and our claims laughable that us children will have the grownups hash it out....

These responses absolutely further inflames a dicey situation.....

Wrong again Dogg. Reread my post. It was directed specifically at you and I stand by my comments. As for what my response inflames, maybe you should take a good look in the mirror about the tone of your statements before you lecture me about stirring the pot.

 

[MILPILOT17]

Help me understand then oh wise and benevolent one.

It's simple; your company was purchased by SWA. If not for a law passed by congress to protect the weak you would be hitting the street. Happens every day in America. Hope that clears things up?

 

[Ty Webb]

Oh wise one, you are soooooo misinformed. There is absolutely NO requirement to have you on a SWAPA seniority list.

Nothing but Bond-McCaskill . . . , :erm: plus our CBA, which your management is a party to, as of DOCC. Not to mention the fact that only an idiot would want a quarter of their pilot group to be non-union.

So, I guess you could say that, other than Federal Law, our Contract, the RLA, and common sense, no, there's no requirement to have us on your seniority list.

Anyone else feel like they're just wasting their time trying to explain this stuff?

 

[XRMEFLYER]

Cool.

Keep your contract then.

It would not be the end of the world. I'm doing fine.
Let's be clear about what I was saying. Clearly your contract is better than ours and I will be glad to work under it too just as I am our current CBA. What I was getting at is that you and SWAPA are not "giving" us that or anything else for that matter. Your management (soon to be our management) will negotiate a new CBA with all of us.