Airtran Pilots

[Lonestar]

Both have distinct assets that make each valuable for a merger TOGETHER.
Bye Bye---General Lee

This statement is actually quite funny. First, as we all know...this is an ACQUISITION, not a merger. Second, (and this is a big one!) you mention assets as if ATN has any to speak of. They rent just about everything. They bring a bunch of leases with bad interest rates. Wow!

 

[Lear70]

For a second I almost thought PCL was on the right track. He is correct when he says there doesn't have to be a JCBA. But then he makes the mistake when saying he already 'effectively' has a JCBA in SWA's current contract. The problem is that PCL, nor the rest of his MEC, have much control over when (or even if) he and his peeps get to work under the current SWA contract. So to make a slight correction (since the JCBA would cover the time between now and when we're one airline), your JCBA by default is your current ATN contract. Enjoy it, you may be working under it for a while!

The alarmist stuff like this is getting kind of old and is one of the reasons almost all the AirTran pilots disengaged on this forum last month and why the only people left debating on this board are non-AAI pilots.

I don't see why people insist on antagonizing their future coworkers. Leave it to the Merger Committees to work out.

 

[ivauir]

The alarmist stuff like this is getting kind of old and is one of the reasons almost all the AirTran pilots disengaged on this forum last month and why the only people left debating on this board are non-AAI pilots.

Lear,

"Alarmist" cuts both ways. For months this forum has been full of your coworkers pot stirring and attempts to affect expectations. It seems pretty unabated to me, but I've pretty much checked out of this SWA bash fest, so maybe my impression is inaccurate.

I don't see why people insist on antagonizing their future coworkers. Leave it to the Merger Committees to work out.

Agreed. But you ought to have the same opinion when "certain" frequent AAI posters choose to advocate ridiculous and antagonistic positions.

 

[PCL_128]

The problem is that PCL, nor the rest of his MEC, have much control over when (or even if) he and his peeps get to work under the current SWA contract. So to make a slight correction (since the JCBA would cover the time between now and when we're one airline), your JCBA by default is your current ATN contract. Enjoy it, you may be working under it for a while!

You should do a little reading, Lonestart. Start with Section 1.E.2. of the AirTran CBA. It will be enlightening for you.

 

[Lear70]

I understand that in the past couple months some of our guys aggravated yours just as much as some of your guys were aggravating us and I'm glad to see it has calmed down quite a bit, regardless of a few people who keep stirring the pot from time to time.

As far as current events, if you take a look back in this thread, even Ty hasn't said much in the last week or so, the rest of our pilots have pretty much checked out and the only people still arguing are Southwest guys and Johnsonrod and the General, neither of which work for either company.

The other AAI/SWA threads haven't had any posts for almost a week as well and there's not multiple threads going on about it. From my viewpoint, it's calmed down considerably, which I'm thankful for.

Of course, there's PCL trying to insert a little insight to what's going on with the MC's and the Process Agreement, but at least it's not an SLI debate...

Fly safe out there, and have some fun along the way!

 

[Ty Webb]

I've been silent because there hasn't been much to respond to. By now, pretty much everything has already been said. I don't even bother responding to LoneStar-esque provocations anymore, what's the point? They're so ridiculous, there's nothing there to talk about.

I have confidence that both MC's will give it their best shot and will work it out as best they can.

In the end, it will be up to all of us to accept it and move forward. As Mark Twain observed, "Most folks are about as happy as they've made up their mind to be".

Regds,
Ty

 

[redflyer65]

I'm confused. Where is the JCBA language? Just thought there was a transition agreement between SWAPA and Southwest.

 

[RedDogC130]

You should do a little reading, Lonestart. Start with Section 1.E.2. of the AirTran CBA. It will be enlightening for you.

Is this from the new contract or the one prior to sept 27th the snapshot date? I will bet you which one the arbitrators will look at

Sent from my DROIDX using Tapatalk

 

[Sy-bill]

After observing both the SWA pilots and Airtran pilots going back and forth with this transaction, it is clear that there is much room in the middle that both will accept. I still believe that arbitration would favor SWA and that relative seniority is not a possibility. Likewise the other extreme of a staple of Airtran pilots is just as equally not a possibility. My guess is that an agreement with both unions will be made with date of hire with some seat and base protection language.

If or when this happens, this could be looked out as the gold standard of how two airlines integrate their seniority lists fairly.

The next year will be interesting to see how this all settles.

 

[Ty Webb]

Hey, Sybill, you done using my old avatar yet, or what? :laugh:

 

[Scope out RJ's]

Oh come on kernal, don't try and bend the truth now!

The only guys bending here will be the pft sw girls after the sly with AT.

 

[Scope out RJ's]

Easy now, Scope:

By your own definition, you're a PFT'er (since you paid for ratings required by your company).

I'm still waiting for you to answer my challenge as to how much of your own money you've spent on your career and ratings compared to me. The silence is deafening...

We've been over this one junior.
Get your hankie warmed up. You'll need it after the reality sandwich you're about to choke on care of an Air Tran SLI.

 

[ASADFW7]

This board is like the Sears catalog for kids circling their wish list. Be careful of the Red Rider gun, you might shoot your eye out!

 

[SWA/FO]

You should do a little reading, Lonestart. Start with Section 1.E.2. of the AirTran CBA. It will be enlightening for you.

Should'nt you be working full-time on the MC?

 

[FDJ2]

This statement is actually quite funny. First, as we all know...this is an ACQUISITION, not a merger. Second, (and this is a big one!) you mention assets as if ATN has any to speak of. They rent just about everything. They bring a bunch of leases with bad interest rates. Wow!

Who cares whether it was an acquisition, certainly not at all relevant in an SLI, and what does it say about SWA management that they would spend, what it is $1.4B for ATN, if as you say, "they only bring a bunch of leases with bad interests rates."

 

[texman]

Ok we have all gone full retard on this board. See you in a couple weeks. Time to take a vacation from FI.

 

[Lonestar]

You should do a little reading, Lonestart. Start with Section 1.E.2. of the AirTran CBA. It will be enlightening for you.

I don't need to read the language in your NEW post-9/27 CBA to know there's nothing in it that can force SWA to put you on our contract at any particular time. The only thing you will cling to is your 18-month limit, which probably can't hold up anyways. Good luck getting a judge to rule against the company that will potentially bring you into more money, job security and QOL than you ever reasonably expected.

Lear 70, I actually agree about cooling off on here and had taken at least a week off. In fact I just saw this thread for the first time today. But when I see a member of your MEC spouting off such false claims, I just can't keep quiet. AirTran peeps want to get under our contract asap. Everyone gets that. I read PCL's statements, though, as saying y'all will get our contract asap and that's just plain false.

 

[Candide]

Calling out Scope Out RJs: PFTer by his own definition

We've been over this one junior.
Get your hankie warmed up. You'll need it after the reality sandwich you're about to choke on care of an Air Tran SLI.

You have not posted anything resembling a logical response to my challenge, so no, we haven't "been over this."

Until you do, your attempts to defame SWA pilots as PFT do nothing except expose your jealousy and underline your hypocrisy.

(BTW...Your ill wishes to my career speak volumes to your character)

So: let's see the line item accounting of what you've paid towards your career. If you need reminding, I can repost mine. If you've spent less than me, you can keep your anti-SWA propaganda going; if not, you need to gracefully retreat.

We're all waiting...

 

[FDJ2]

I don't need to read the language in your NEW post-9/27 CBA to know there's nothing in it that can force SWA to put you on our contract at any particular time. The only thing you will cling to is your 18-month limit, which probably can't hold up anyways. Good luck getting a judge to rule against the company that will potentially bring you into more money, job security and QOL than you ever reasonably expected.

You say so much, but know so little.

 

[humveedriver]

I don't need to read the language in your NEW post-9/27 CBA to know there's nothing in it that can force SWA to put you on our contract at any particular time. The only thing you will cling to is your 18-month limit, which probably can't hold up anyways. Good luck getting a judge to rule against the company that will potentially bring you into more money, job security and QOL than you ever reasonably expected.

Lear 70, I actually agree about cooling off on here and had taken at least a week off. In fact I just saw this thread for the first time today. But when I see a member of your MEC spouting off such false claims, I just can't keep quiet. AirTran peeps want to get under our contract asap. Everyone gets that. I read PCL's statements, though, as saying y'all will get our contract asap and that's just plain false.

I agree Lonestar. I don't think PCL 128 should be posting on this thread either. Assuming he is part of the Airtran MEC. His job is at the table, in the office or flying the line.

 

[Scope out RJ's]

You have not posted anything resembling a logical response to my challenge, so no, we haven't "been over this."

Until you do, your attempts to defame SWA pilots as PFT do nothing except expose your jealousy and underline your hypocrisy.

(BTW...Your ill wishes to my career speak volumes to your character)

So: let's see the line item accounting of what you've paid towards your career. If you need reminding, I can repost mine. If you've spent less than me, you can keep your anti-SWA propaganda going; if not, you need to gracefully retreat.

We're all waiting...

So time isn't the only thing you have on your hands then?:blush:
Oh yeah, I'm jealous. The typical southwest pft cocky attitude.
We've been over this one sport. You had to pay for your type rating junior. My company paid for all of mine.
I'm sure you believe you no longer live at home with your parents, even though you really just moved downstairs to the basement.
It really is quite simple, even for someone with limited intelligence such as yourself.
And as far as ill wishes to your career.......:laugh: Relax, you're really not that important. Your cockiness is about to get a serious dose of reallity after your SLI with the Air Tran pilots.

 

[tankerhead]

Yours is capitalized? Dang, mine is only lower-case.

 

[Ty Webb]

You say so much, but know so little.

I know ... There's nothing factual there to respond to, it's all just wishful thinking.

 

[Candide]

Scope Out RJs,

I would like to remind you: I paid absolutely nothing for my B737 type rating.

I got my type rating by driving to the FSDO with my NATOPS jacket and log book. The examiner perused the documents, noted my 737 PIC time and NATOPS checks, and gave me the rating.

The entire message in your increasingly schizophrenic rantings against me is my "purchase" of a type rating, and I've made it clear that this is completely false.

So you need to accept my challenge:
Provide a detailed list of every expenditure you've made for your airline career. If you've spent more than me (which is almost certainly the case), then do us all a favor: show a modicum of self awareness and quit with your SWA Pft nonsense.

 

[Candide]

Scope Out RJ's:

You have no moral authority to talk about SWA pilots "buying our jobs" until you compare your career expenditures to mine. Until you can demonstrate that you've spent less than me, a SWA pilot, your line of venom will continue to drip with hypocrisy.

 

[clr4theapch]

Just a note.. since I had to delete the posts for a couple of members, the posts from "candide" SEEM TO be causing problems and make him look like a touble maker.. his posts were in reply to the posts I deleted.. so please keep that in mind if you decide to respond further on this thread..

thanks clr4 mod

Ps, And no I will not replay the content of the deleted posts.. one can only imagine , that is all..

 

[Ty Webb]

The following interview with Gary Kelly in Business Traveler News should be of interest to Lonestar and the other members of the "Flat Earth Society" who keep asking "What does AirTran bring?" and fantasize about a separate 717 operation. Here is an excerpt:

BTN: You said you see a few dozen cities where you can expand. Is that independent of AirTran?


Kelly: I think it is, in the sense that after almost 40 years we served just 72 cities. With or without AirTran, we have all these additional cities that we'd consider. The point is that AirTran improves the prospects of adding those new cities faster and more profitably. If you think about Atlanta as an example, they've already got that business up and running for us at 200 flights a day. I'm not sure, absent the AirTran deal, when we might add Atlanta—and it could be never.

The other thing that AirTran does is that we've got the [Boeing] 737-700 sweet spot in our fleet. We're going to augment that with a bigger airplane, and we're also going to augment that with a smaller airplane for the sole purpose of serving smaller communities with less frequency. That is a market that we had been unable to crack, if for no other reason than we felt like we didn't have the right airplane for it, and it's really tough to take that first step. It takes a lot of effort to bring a new aircraft type onto the property. By definition, you're only going to have a handful of airplanes, and in the beginning it only provides some incremental contribution at best. Here, we're stepping into a business: They've got it up and running, they've got 86 airplanes, and they've already plowed that ground. We can take what they've got, put the Southwest brand on it, plug it into our much larger network, then grow it from there. AirTran does a number of different things for us and that's why we think it's such a compelling opportunity.

 

[Dash Power]

The following interview with Gary Kelly in Business Traveler News should be of interest to Lonestar and the other members of the "Flat Earth Society" who keep asking "What does AirTran bring?" and fantasize about a separate 717 operation. Here is an excerpt:

BTN: You said you see a few dozen cities where you can expand. Is that independent of AirTran?


Kelly: I think it is, in the sense that after almost 40 years we served just 72 cities. With or without AirTran, we have all these additional cities that we'd consider. The point is that AirTran improves the prospects of adding those new cities faster and more profitably. If you think about Atlanta as an example, they've already got that business up and running for us at 200 flights a day. I'm not sure, absent the AirTran deal, when we might add Atlanta—and it could be never.

The other thing that AirTran does is that we've got the [Boeing] 737-700 sweet spot in our fleet. We're going to augment that with a bigger airplane, and we're also going to augment that with a smaller airplane for the sole purpose of serving smaller communities with less frequency. That is a market that we had been unable to crack, if for no other reason than we felt like we didn't have the right airplane for it, and it's really tough to take that first step. It takes a lot of effort to bring a new aircraft type onto the property. By definition, you're only going to have a handful of airplanes, and in the beginning it only provides some incremental contribution at best. Here, we're stepping into a business: They've got it up and running, they've got 86 airplanes, and they've already plowed that ground. We can take what they've got, put the Southwest brand on it, plug it into our much larger network, then grow it from there. AirTran does a number of different things for us and that's why we think it's such a compelling opportunity.

Simply earth shattering.

SWA is only spending 300mil on this ACQUISITION. To bring it down to your level of understanding, it is only a "compelling opportunity".

Soon SWA will be a tremendous boost in your career. And you have the balls to come on here and consistently antagonize the ones handing you this golden ticket? I continue to contemplate how big of an idiot does this type of thing.

 

[ATLplt]

Soon SWA will be a tremendous boost in your career. And you have the balls to come on here and consistently antagonize the ones handing you this golden ticket? I continue to contemplate how big of an idiot does this type of thing.

Funny, I didn't see him antagonizing GK... (Seeing as how he's the only one responsible for handing out anything.)

 

[funnyman12]

How is Ty posting this antagonizing anyone. What is wrong with Airtran guys justifying that Airtran does have something to bring SWA. am I happy that SWA has decided to acquire and merge us? Heck yeah.....btw per SWA SEC filings the word merge is also used. Acquired, though, is used a vast majority of the time. I understand SW pilots concerns, but pilots are all the same. Other than some of the arrogant comments by some on here, if I was at SW now I would be in agreement with many of the SW guys. To the contrary, most of the SW guys if they were at Airtran would be in agreement with the AAI guys. We are all pilots and I think that once the dust settles this will ba a great company with improved career expectations for all.