AirTran MEC: Whine on!

[roughneck]

No, our last vote gave us 510 captain seats on the 717 with atl and tpa as bases. That was what WE voted for.

It gave you exactly the number of captain seats required to fill the 717 until 2015. If there are no 717's you have no seats. That is what you voted for.

 

[scoreboardII]

didn't this get covered two years ago? One year ago? Six months ago?

 

[Britpilot]

Yuuuuuup!

Phred

That's what you voted for.

 

[fletch717]

It gave you exactly the number of captain seats required to fill the 717 until 2015. If there are no 717's you have no seats. That is what you voted for.

Exactly, when we voted we were told the 71 would stay until the leases were up. I think the voted would have been a lot different on both sides had we been told the truth.

 

[PCL_128]

Exactly, when we voted we were told the 71 would stay until the leases were up. I think the voted would have been a lot different on both sides had we been told the truth.

Eh, I'm not so sure. People were voting purely out of fear, so if they knew the outcome of the 717s, they probably would have been even more afraid and would have voted the same way.

 

[roughneck]

Eh, I'm not so sure. People were voting purely out of fear, so if they knew the outcome of the 717s, they probably would have been even more afraid and would have voted the same way.

So quit whining, you get what you vote for and in this case it is SWA 737 FO.

 

[roughneck]

Exactly, when we voted we were told the 71 would stay until the leases were up. I think the voted would have been a lot different on both sides had we been told the truth.

If there was a promise of aircraft it would have been included in the deal. It wasn't because there were no promises. What was included in the deal was the plan for who would get the captain seats if there were no 717's prior to 2015. Those captain seats go to pre-merger SWA pilots. That is what you voted on. That is what is happening now.

 

[PCL_128]

So quit whining, you get what you vote for and in this case it is SWA 737 FO.

No, that's not what I voted for.

 

[Ty Webb]

It gave you exactly the number of captain seats required to fill the 717 until 2015. If there are no 717's you have no seats. That is what you voted for.

The information that was put forth by SWA to us, both in meetings and in the press, was that the 717 fleet would remain until the leases ended, which began in 2017.

BIG difference between ending them in 2017 and 2014. Hence the DRC's.

I would think that would be easy to understand.

 

[Tripower455]

Exactly, when we voted we were told the 71 would stay until the leases were up. I think the voted would have been a lot different on both sides had we been told the truth.

Definitely.

The vote would've been a lot different on the SW side had we known that you guys were only coming over with 1/3 the aircraft.

 

[HowardBorden]

The information that was put forth by SWA to us, both in meetings and in the press, was that the 717 fleet would remain until the leases ended, which began in 2017.

BIG difference between ending them in 2017 and 2014. Hence the DRC's.

I would think that would be easy to understand.

Nope, not buying it. Multiple articles in the press said the exact opposite and a letter was sent by GK to the AT pilots that said the future of the 717 was tenuous at best. You can't rewrite history.

http://www.dallasnews.com/business/...boeing-717-not-part-of-future-fleet-plans.ece
It?s not different enough or unique enough that it really brings any advantage beyond what a 737 would do,? Kelly said at the Boyd Group International aviation conference at a resort near Albuquerque.

http://travel.usatoday.com/flights/post/2011/08/southwest-boeing-717/545260/1
Kelly noted that Southwest didn't see a need for anything smaller than its 137-seat Boeing 737-700s before deciding in 2010 to buy AirTran. Southwest operates 25 Boeing 737-500s, which has 122 seats, but hasn't bought any that size in two decades.

http://blog.chron.com/lorensteffy/2...17s-will-be-phased-out-because-of-fuel-costs/
Kelly said the reason for his change in attitude comes down to fuel prices. The 717, which has fewer seats than the 737, works well for short-haul flights, but the higher fuel prices go, the more customers get priced out of short-haul markets, he said.

http://worldairlinenews.com/2011/08...advantage-of-keeping-airtrans-88-boeing-717s/
Southwest Airlines? (Dallas) CEO Gary Kelly, according to this article by Flightglobal, told the attendees at the International Aviation Forecast Summit (hosted by the Boyd Group) that the Boeing 717 does not ?bring any unique benefit that Southwest cannot get with the 737″.

http://www.aero-news.net/index.cfm?do=main.textpost&id=c4f94beb-1199-4f21-9dbe-5423110c0db6
But in the time since, Southwest has decided it will eliminate some smaller markets that were served by AirTran, and CEO Gary Kelly now says the company sees no advantage in keeping the smaller planes.

 

[scoreboardII]

Exactly, when we voted we were told the 71 would stay until the leases were up. I think the voted would have been a lot different on both sides had we been told the truth.

Lets be totally honest, that's what you wanted to hear, and SWA is excellent at getting unions to hear what they want to hear.

What was actually said, was something totally different, and in fact the language supports the departure of the 717, not when the leases are up but at anytime, a huge difference. Referencing the post above, AT pilots had every opportunity to know GK had every intention of offloading the 717 before lease end. The 717 departure harms me, your senior dudes climbing all over my seniority, if those 717's stayed they could have been a faster upgrade for me.

Welcome to the love.

 

[scoreboardII]

No, that's not what I voted for.

All the no voters are yes voters now. It's called a union.

 

[scoreboardII]

Definitely.

The vote would've been a lot different on the SW side had we known that you guys were only coming over with 1/3 the aircraft.

And there would have been a firestorm on this side if we had been told this truth.

 

[Tripower455]

And there would have been a firestorm on this side if we had been told this truth.

I think that might've just squeaked out a 50%+ 1 no vote on this side.