AirTran MEC: Whine on!

[Ty Webb]

Airport standby at 40/hr. That's horrible. Hardly pays for a Popeye's basket.

What are you talkin' about?

 

[Ty Webb]

This message is hidden because madjack is on your ignore list.

Can't hear ya, Crazy Train . . . . . Guess you didn't get the memo.

:laugh:

 

[redflyer65]

What are you talkin' about?

A newhire Airtran FO doing airport reserve.

 

[Ty Webb]

A newhire Airtran FO doing airport reserve.

Airport Reserve pays the same hourly rate as everything else.

If trotting out our 2001 Contract continues to give you a chubby, let's break out the SWA 1982 Contract (SWA's equivalent year in business). That should be equally mirth-provoking.

Btw, when our 2001 Contract was negotiated, the average time on Reserve was a few months. I spent one month on Reserve as an FO, one month as a Captain . . . total Reserve in 12 years - two months; that was the atmosphere that contract was negotiated in . . . the logic was that Pilots spent a year or two as an FO, and the remainder as a Captain, so the negotiation capital was spent accordingly. By 2010, that had changed tremendously, and the improvements were largely spent of the FO scales.

 

[redflyer65]

Airport Reserve pays the same hourly rate as everything else.

If trotting out our 2001 Contract continues to give you a chubby, let's break out the SWA 1982 Contract (SWA's 8th year in business). That should be equally mirth-provoking.

Btw, when our 2001 Contract was negotiated, the average time on Reserve was a few months. I spent one month on Reserve as an FO, one month as a Captain . . . total Reserve in 12 years - two months.

I'm glad you got hired at the right time Ty. We have plenty on this side as well, but the ones that didn't are living a different job.....as you stated in your post above. And I agree that we have that as well, but maybe to a lesser extent.

Your 2001 contract is what you've been work under until SW stepped in...right? Are you actually trying to refute that? It doesn't matter to me whether you were working under a contract dated 2001 or 2008. It was YOUR current contract at the time. How are trying spin that as anything else? Is the sky green in your world?

 

[Ty Webb]

Red, this has been explained to you and everyone else on here a million times.

I know you have a lot personally invested in believing that somehow, we would still be working under that contract 14 years later, but

We had already voted down the 2010 rates when they were offered to us in 2008

and,

We grudgingly accepted them the third time around because of the merger..

Over and Out.

 

[redflyer65]

Red, this has been explained to you and everyone else on here a million times.

I know you have a lot personally invested in believing that somehow, we would still be working under that contract 14 years later, but

We had already voted down the 2010 rates when they were offered to us in 2008

and,

We grudgingly accepted them the third time around because of the merger..

Over and Out.

I understand that and I'm done talking about it as well.

Come on over...you'll like it here. Starbucks on me, especially after you toss it on my shirt.

 

[Ty Webb]

I understand that and I'm done talking about it as well.

Come on over...you'll like it here. Starbucks on me, especially after you toss it on my shirt.

Now, that's pretty clever!

Thanks, I'm getting tired of the re-hash, too. It's like kicking a rock . . . at first it might make you feel good, but eventually, you just end up with a sore foot.

:beer:

 

[scoreboardII]

annnnd close thread.

 

[SWA/FO]

after you toss it on my shirt.

What are we talking about?

 

[waveflyer]

What are we talking about?

Read the thread....aaannd back to closing thread

 

[ron burgundy]

.....

 

[737tanker]

What is with the new DRC? According to SWAPA AirTran has filed a new DRC concerning MOUs SWAPA signed with SWA in Nov 2011 and Dec 2012. The Nov MOU stated that all AirTran pilots would be at SWA by Dec 31, 2014. The Dec MOU said that the SWA 717 ATL domicile that was in SL 10 would be changed to a 737 domicile. So I'm trying to figure out why is AirTran complaining at this late date, and what are they hoping to accomplish?

 

[Ty Webb]

Sorry . . . thread crosed. Thank you, come again!

 

[Phlintstone]

What is with the new DRC? According to SWAPA AirTran has filed a new DRC concerning MOUs SWAPA signed with SWA in Nov 2011 and Dec 2012. The Nov MOU stated that all AirTran pilots would be at SWA by Dec 31, 2014. The Dec MOU said that the SWA 717 ATL domicile that was in SL 10 would be changed to a 737 domicile. So I'm trying to figure out why is AirTran complaining at this late date, and what are they hoping to accomplish?

From what I remember from the conversation I had with an ALPA rep...It has to do with SWAPA pushing SWA (and getting an MOU) to have a vacancy bid for all remaining (uncaptured?) CA slots in the event that all AT aircraft/personnel are not across the partition by 12/31/2014. This prevents an AT CA from keeping their seat if SWA cannot effect an expeditious training plan. ALPA is none to happy that these MOUs were negotiated and signed without them at the table.

I understand SWAPA's reason behind the MOUs and I know a number of CAs are hoping to keep their seat by deferring their transition until the very end.

Phred

 

[Just thinking]

Last year they upgraded almost 200 Captains. So far this year at 134. Word is 500 for next year. Not bad "growth" to skew the Captain seats for years to come. Without massive orders of aircraft it will be hard for the senior FAT FO's that will be uber senior) to see any upgrades when everything flattens out over the coming years.

 

[Tripower455]

Last year they upgraded almost 200 Captains. So far this year at 134. Word is 500 for next year. Not bad "growth" to skew the Captain seats for years to come. Without massive orders of aircraft it will be hard for the senior FAT FO's that will be uber senior) to see any upgrades when everything flattens out over the coming years.

Many of those upgrades are coming at a price. Unless they live or are willing to move west, they'll be commuting cross country to Capt reserve for decades, especially when the FAT guys can start moving left. We have a lot of guys bypassing upgrade for this reason. I know 2 guys personally that upgraded, commuted for a while, and bid back to the right seat (not even a lance in one of the cases) for QOL reasons.

Being an FO at SW is not a bad gig, particularly a senior one at top scale. A senior FO, living in domicile can work less days (if you count commuting days as the jr capt) and make nearly as much as he would commuting to reserve. I think 128 tfp is the magic break even number for an FO to make the same as he would as a reserve Capt making 90ish. It's far easier to make 128 TFP (without even messing with POT stuff) as an in domicile, senior guy than it is to commute to 90 tfp on reserve on the other side of the country.

I know if my choice was being a senior FO in my domicile, or a jr. Capt on the other side of the country, I'd take the FO gig in a heartbeat.

The only downside is if you go out on medical, you get a lot more if you're a Capt than an FO.

As for the "flattish" comment, we're already there. If we're lucky. The 717s leaving negatively affects us too, as now we have to absorb all the AT pilots with roughly 1/3 the seats.

 

[SWA Bubba]

From what I remember from the conversation I had with an ALPA rep...It has to do with SWAPA pushing SWA (and getting an MOU) to have a vacancy bid for all remaining (uncaptured?) CA slots in the event that all AT aircraft/personnel are not across the partition by 12/31/2014. This prevents an AT CA from keeping their seat if SWA cannot effect an expeditious training plan. ALPA is none to happy that these MOUs were negotiated and signed without them at the table.

I understand SWAPA's reason behind the MOUs and I know a number of CAs are hoping to keep their seat by deferring their transition until the very end.

Phred

I've never heard of this. Post it, please.

Bubba

 

[freightdogfred]

I've never heard of this. Post it, please.

Bubba

We didn't either. It was evidently covert, unpublished and only recently discovered. Contact Steve Chase for further details, I'm sure he can fill you in.

This WAS just recently published, however. It apparently negates yet another part of the process agreement, which by now, most of us are used to.

1.Training for 717 positions will no longer be offered.


2.All Pilots, regardless of Transition Bid Award, will now be able to bid for SWA 737 FO positions when Pilots are being accepted from their Crew class.



3.Pilots originally awarded SWA 737 FO in the Transition Bid
who are voluntarily bidding to go to training
will receive priority over Pilots originally awarded TBA 717 CA or FO.



4.Involuntary assignments will be made in reverse seniority order based on the Crew class being drawn from regardless of what they were awarded on the Transition Bid Award.

What it means is that 737 Captains who specified 717 as the second choice
will no longer be able to transition to the 717 to remain as captain, and quite possibly will transition to SW 737 FO while a less senior 717 Captain remains flying left seat at FL. In a nutshell, it's a complete reversal from their previous position that all training bids will be followed as bid, as I understand it.

 

[Phlintstone]

Bubba, I'll try to find it. Like I wrote it was word of mouth...from an ALPA rep.

Phred