Airtran MEC voted no

[canyonblue]

An Alaska/SWA merger isn't that far out of the question. And in that case the AS and combined SWA/AAI list would merge by DoH. Period, end of story.

Oh quit dreaming, it is out of the question. AAI had two things going for it, a huge presence at one of the worlds busiest airports and competition with Southwest. Alaska has neither, move along and hope for American, you have nothing to offer.

 

[Fly-By-Cable]

You obviously have incorrect information. Even adjusted for inflation, every SWA 11 year CA since 1974 makes more than you.

Reread my post. Not since 1974, but when SWA was 17 year old company, like AirTran is today. 11 year captain in 1991 did not make what I make now. So if you wanna talk how much money you make today, remeber that it took you 40 years to get to this point. We've been here for 17 and were on track to pass you. I know it's all empty projections, but you guys love to talk how future is predictable.

 

[RLAblows]

On that point, you may be right. This is not Alaska/SWA. Sorry if that stings some.

No, SWA pilots would still be screaming, "what are we getting out of this?" AT gets paid close to the same as Alaska, so it would be the same situation. It's only about money and what "we" get from the deal to the SWA pilots. The kicker would be their pilot group is way senior, it might make for a tough staple.

 

[Sacha]

It's fudge packers only hope for some movement in his dull,nasty little world. It would be tough to find anyone to fly with him though.

 

[Cruncher]

RLABlows,

Is that Lars Ulrich? I've always wondered that. If so, I'm gonna go cry.

 

[Fubijaakr]

Alaska has neither, move along and hope for American, you have nothing to offer.

Nothing but the West Coast, the most departures to Hawaii on a daily basis and a fully mature system of -800s...everything SWA wants to do in the future.

It's fudge packers only hope for some movement in his dull,nasty little world. It would be tough to find anyone to fly with him though.

Listen, Ace, I'm not the one try to staple and jump over 650 of your coworkers.

It's only about money and what "we" get from the deal to the SWA pilots. The kicker would be their pilot group is way senior, it might make for a tough staple.

Right on. What these guys don't realize is that BEFORE the AAI deal, SWA was sniffing AS's butt, but the stock price was too high.

 

[Ty Webb]

Well

I hate to say >> "I told you so"

you guys should have taken this deal and ran to the bank and cashed the checks while the money was still in the account.

Now the account may be running empty

Kicking yourself, aren't ya, Ron?

 

[bravodude]

The anguish over here because we are the minority is obvious. I interviewed at SWA and this merger process is a lot worse than that was.

We just don't think we have even come close to upsetting you guys. That is why we pushed back. That agreement was really unfair, not because of other airlines and your past mergers, but because of *** who we are.***

When it is all said and done whether we get relative or date of hire or something with protections, a SWAs pilots life is not going to change much. No risk. Just the disappointment of future expectations.

There is no risk of you guys losing your jobs. So don't tell me you are as disappointed with this agreement as we are. What we have on the line here man, and to vote it down!!!!!! It was so unfair and disrepectful.

First of all I would say you guys have done a pretty good job of pissing everybody off here at SWA at least the pilots.
Second UNFAIR, DISRESPECTFUL, what are you a baby this is business I am not here to be your friend and sing you a lullaby when you go to bed at night. This is about MY career and the careers of my fellow SWA pilots.
I never said I was disappointed with this agreement, I never said I think you guys should vote yes or no. I think you guys should have had a chance to vote on it but that's it.
You don't have to believe me, you can call me childish, a bully an a$$ I don't care but I promise you an arbitrated list will never see the light of day because there are a lot of people here that will have no problem contributing our own money to tie this up in the legal system for years to come!

It's just business.

 

[BigMeat]

You guys are failing to realize that the Airtran didnt draw the lawn in the sand with relative seniority. They were willing to take a substantial hit. However that being said what Gary Kelly offered was ridiculous. Its not just about the money kids. Its about being to be home with the family or live where you want. Yes the money is going to be nice but as many people are saying it aint everything. As Cal and United merge I dont expect to see a massive benefit over one pilot group over the other. Yes CAL had alot of money in the bank, big growth, fast upgrades, nicer and newer aircraft. So what. I still expect relative seniority. Being selfish I hope I gain a few percentage points. What the Southwest guys are expecting is dillusional.

 

[shootr]

the lawn in the sand

The what?

 

[scoreboardII]

Maybe you can tell me how many enemy fighters you shot down that were not built before 1960's, or how many active SAM sights have locked on and fired on you.

Easy:

None.

Twenty-two.

Six.

 

[jonjuan]

The what?

It's a mute point.

 

[slaquer5]

You guys are failing to realize that the Airtran didnt draw the lawn in the sand with relative seniority. They were willing to take a substantial hit. However that being said what Gary Kelly offered was ridiculous. Its not just about the money kids. Its about being to be home with the family or live where you want. Yes the money is going to be nice but as many people are saying it aint everything. As Cal and United merge I dont expect to see a massive benefit over one pilot group over the other. Yes CAL had alot of money in the bank, big growth, fast upgrades, nicer and newer aircraft. So what. I still expect relative seniority. Being selfish I hope I gain a few percentage points. What the Southwest guys are expecting is dillusional.

I just want to make sure I understand what your saying. You expect the number one pilot at AT to placed next to the number one pilot at SWA?

 

[Fly-By-Cable]

I just want to make sure I understand what your saying. You expect the number one pilot at AT to placed next to the number one pilot at SWA?

NO, but you missed my expectation by 1000 numbers in this AIP.

 

[Music]

You don't have to believe me, you can call me childish, a bully an a$$ I don't care but I promise you an arbitrated list will never see the light of day because there are a lot of people here that will have no problem contributing our own money to tie this up in the legal system for years to come!

It's just business.

Thank God you're not running the airline (or any other business for that matter) You sound like Gordon Gecko. If you truly believe this then why don't 'you give GK a call and offer him some business tips.

You're statement is COMPLETELY emotional, irrational, and yes, I'll say it, CHILDISH. But if you really want to go there, I'm prepared to be patient and wait as long as necessary. Whether you like it or not, we're tied at the hip for better or worse.

"Can't we all just get along".

 

[redflyer65]

"Can't we all just get along".

I hate to be Debbie Downer, but I see that as less and less likely. I've heard some rather interesting stories about how AAI crews have recently interacted with ours. Already getting ugly out on the line.

Begging for a staple (from anyone) just prior to the SW announcement, and now wanting their seniority AND the SW contract as a kicker. That's a pretty huge 'Snake River Canyon' jump. Most people would be quick to agree.

RF

 

[HighSpeed]

Here's our culture, we busted our balls to make a success out troubled airlines and took one sacrifice after another in a process.

The way I see it...

And now to SLI. For you guys to suggest that after 11 years of struggle and building this airline into what it has become my 20+% seniority worth nothing, is an insult. I am a mid to senior captain here who paid his dues every single block our of my time here, and you think that putting me behind a guy who did 2 tours wasting jet fuel in Iraq, sailed into SWA in '05 on wings of squadron buddies, and since enjoyed the worry-free career with fuel hedges and great management is fair?

We carried our management on our backs every leg we flew, by saving gas that they failed to properly hedge so that they can come out smelling like a flower, and sell us for their bonuses.

We've all paid our dues pal.... I could have gone to ATN in 2003. Instead I stayed at a regional making sub standard wages, living paycheck to paycheck raising a family in the Northeast... Making sacrifices to build the PIC time to be competitive to be hired at SWA.

Simply put - how many Airtran Pilots had applied to Southwest?? Why??

Last question: what would you have done after your 97% strike vote??

6000 pilots at SWA were happy to be put at the BOTTOM of the seniority list the day they got hired. We were all thankful to be number last. We told Gary during our new hire breakfast how happy each and every one of us were to be here... Your pilot group just told Gary to kiss off. That you're not happy to be here... That keeping every captain (even those that upgraded two months ago) in his/her seat was not good enough.. In this economy, you have told Gary your not happy to be part of the SWA family... All I can day at this point is good luck... I have friends at ATN and I really hope you all still get to make it here!

 

[Music]

I hate to be Debbie Downer, but I see that as less and less likely. I've heard some rather interesting stories about how AAI crews have recently interacted with ours. Already getting ugly out on the line.

Begging for a staple (from anyone) just prior to the SW announcement, and now wanting their seniority AND the SW contract as a kicker. That's a pretty huge 'Snake River Canyon' jump. Most people would be quick to agree.

RF

I've been the recipient of some of that "ill will" as well. Truly unfortunate, since we're all adults.

As far as the "begging for a staple" part. Yes there are those that have in the past, as well as those that had an app on file at SW. I can only speak for myself that I never applied. For no other reason than I was comfortable where I am. I've spoke of this at length on FI before, so no point in doing it again. That being said, so infer that all of us were "begging for a staple" is just flat wrong and misleading. No wonder why there is so much ill will out there.

 

[bravodude]

Thank God you're not running the airline (or any other business for that matter) You sound like Gordon Gecko. If you truly believe this then why don't 'you give GK a call and offer him some business tips.

You're statement is COMPLETELY emotional, irrational, and yes, I'll say it, CHILDISH. But if you really want to go there, I'm prepared to be patient and wait as long as necessary. Whether you like it or not, we're tied at the hip for better or worse.

"Can't we all just get along".

Once again this is not just me! However if you are willing to wait be my guest I will retire in 30 years then its all yours.

 

[BigMeat]

I just want to make sure I understand what your saying. You expect the number one pilot at AT to placed next to the number one pilot at SWA?

Listen. Should they try for it? Yes. I would. Remember that a little over 10 years ago Southwest was a ********************ty little airline. People were leaving there to go elsewhere including United. I know you guys like to think that you are the top dogs right now but it always was not the case. United was always the highest paid. They did really well for a long time. Then it fell apart. You never had crew meals or dry cleaning or exotic overnights etc. The crap you see in the movies. Dont get me wrong. Everyone know that Southwest has the best culture and is one of the best companies in the world to work for...for now. I hope that it last forever for you guys. The reality is that Airtran was a growing profitable airline. It wasnt in distress. They were working on a contract at the time. Fair is fair. As I said the Airtran pilots were willing to take a nice cut but Gary Kelly went too far. I think he should have stayed out of negotiations between the pilots. And for the rest of you that are cheering that a fellow union pilot might hit the street let me just tell you that you are a very distateful bunch.