AirTran MEC Chair message.

[27 driver]

Exactly. And I'd need 200#'s.

And we need the $1,000 to $6,000/ month and QOL we will be losing over the next three years. You guys still gained relative seniority, lost $0 and 0 QOL. We lost seniority, pay and QOL. Sorry that's not enough for you.

 

[redflyer65]

Your MEC voted against the first NEGOTIATED agreement. You can thank them.


Let's move on Gentleman.

 

[27 driver]

Your MEC voted against the first NEGOTIATED agreement. You can thank them.


Let's move on Gentleman.

Red,
While I agree that our MEC screwed us....I don't have sympathy for those who gained seniority. And as you guys like to point out 80% + of you guys voted for it as well. The difference is we lose and $. Not by not getting your pay but by decreasing our credit by %10 to %20.

 

[redflyer65]

27,

I completely agree with you regarding the decreased credit. I'm sorry your having to endure that. Make no sense to me. Let me put it this way...

As a shareholder (with well over a thousand shares), I'd like to see you guys flying max hours over the summer and really making some money for OUR company (and for you personally) so we get higher profit sharing and a higher stock price.

If I were making the decisions, you guys would be flying your @ss off.

RF

 

[PCL_128]

That sounds like a great idea but you are going to have to give me back the 100 seniority numbera I lost between SL 9 and 10.

Jim

My pay has no relation to your seniority.

 

[MILF Hunter]

My pay has no relation to your seniority.

Respectfully, I must disagree! Below are sections from Side Letter 10 of the SWAPA CBA, the Seniority Integration Agreement.

A. AirTran Pilots will be transitioned to Southwest and will be subject to and covered by the
Southwest/SWAPA CBA upon entering training for service as Southwest Pilots. At that time,
they will also be eligible for and covered by current benefit and insurance plans and any other
programs available to current Southwest Airlines Pilots, subject to standard eligibility​

requirements.

6. Reference to Section 4.C. EQUIPMENT LONGEVITY PAY:
Effective January 1, 2015, the B717 rates will snap up to B737 rates applicable in the
CBA at that time. Until such time, current AirTran pilots' B717 pay rates will remain at
the AirTran rate, adjusted as needed for TFP /block hour conversion and any applicable​

increase per the AirTran CBA.

 

[PCL_128]

Only one problem with your quote of your CBA there, MILF: I don't work under your CBA or your Side Letter 10. Those documents only cover AirTran pilots after they've transitioned to Southwest.

 

[waveflyer]

Then we need ALL our Captain retention slots back... without displacement language if the total number of CA seats is going to be reduced.

See how that works? I can do it too!

"you can do it too"??
That's what you seem to be trying to do- get back the money you lost by not letting AT pilots vote- but none of the rest of the agreement-

Sorry, but if you want to press for an actual choice to go with your planes to delta- I'm all for that-
But grievance money en lieu??? Especially the ridiculous sums you were talking Lear, ($800k/pilot...? Really? )and I'd be against that (as if that matters much), but more importantly predict that GK would be against that and put significant resources against a pay out based on that logic. I simply predict you'd lose-

Badly.

But I'm sure you'll ignore me and press on just as you did with the SLI's.
Just may want to ask yourself how that turned out for your pilot group.

This company, as big as its getting, still runs on "win-win"

 

[K-Mart]

800K/Pilot????:laugh:

 

[PCL_128]

I don't think Lear was suggesting that we would expect $800k/pilot for a settlement. He was only pointing out what the potential damage could be in a worst case scenario (for the company) if an arbitrator were to award the grievance to the Association. That possible damage is the motivation for the company to bargain in good faith towards a settlement that would be much less costly.

 

[GoodTimes]

PCL and Lear,

Are you guys being advised by the same legal eagles that helped you through the SLI debacle?

 

[scoreboardII]

evidently the same ones who recommended not taking the first deal.

 

[Lear70]

I don't think Lear was suggesting that we would expect $800k/pilot for a settlement. He was only pointing out what the potential damage could be in a worst case scenario (for the company) if an arbitrator were to award the grievance to the Association. That possible damage is the motivation for the company to bargain in good faith towards a settlement that would be much less costly.

^^^ THIS ^^^

evidently the same ones who recommended not taking the first deal.

Actually, the attorneys suggested that the MEC send it out for vote and didn't recommend anything one way or another (that's in the meeting minutes). They also, however, assumed that SWA management would follow the spirit and language of the process agreement. Their words directly to me at the MEC meeting was "If you like the agreement, vote yes. If not, vote no. Don't base your vote on the worry of non-integration."

I say again, if GK had been forthright and had nothing to hide, he would have told us BEFORE the MEC meeting of his intentions to find ways to operate us separately if the deal wasn't ratified. That's something that will continue to chafe us as long as you keep bringing it up.

Want us to get over things? Quit bringing it up. It's just that simple.

My pay has no relation to your seniority.

Exactly.

The simple truth is that SWAPA has zero, zilch, nada, NO control over any changes we make to OUR CBA on this side of the partition. If we work something out with SWA management in exchange for the multiple issues that have arisen because of business choices SWA is making that negatively affect us and our CBA yet don't affect you in the slightest, well that's just what will happen. Like I've said, it is my hope they will work with us in good faith to solve these issues. If the solution happens to be snap-up to your CBA rates, then,,, well,,, Sorry you don't like it, but it doesn't affect you, so...

This is what happens when you allow alter-ego carriers. IMHO, SWAPA should have filed for one CBA and one representative structure from the get-go, just like every OTHER successful merger in recent history. Separate unions on separate CBA's (like UAir/AWA) cause problems...

This is case in point.

 

[vixin]

Lear if you guys thought the 717 was going to stay then you are clueless. So to come back and say we had no idea is poor planning. You always have to look at what GK doesnt say or how he says what he does.

 

[Lear70]

Lear if you guys thought the 717 was going to stay then you are clueless.

So MV, Russ M., Joe H, and other senior management people telling us, during negotiations, in a direct answer to "what happens if the 717's go away early?" and them telling us "This lower pay rate until you transition makes sure the 717 stays "at least" through their lease terminations instead of us looking to dump them ASAP" is being "clueless"?

I'm sorry, I take people at their word when negotiating. I ask a straight question, get a straight answer, and expect it to happen.