Air Wisconsin

[Paladin]

av8er23 your are a dumbass

Oh the irony...

 

[logolight]

I'm not going to take sides here in this argument. Yes things suck right now as far as lines and commutability. We are way understaffed and the only way they can cover trips is to force alot of duty time on the pilots. That means minimum days off and non-commutable lines until staffing improves. I personaly haven't heard yet anything about AWAC turning down a PHX base.

(Disclaimer) I am in no way shape or form defending the company's actions in this next statement.

The reason AWAC gave as to why they previously turned down the 70 seat flying is because the contracts called for only a small number of aircraft that AWAC felt would have been a financial risk to the company. Why they thought that, I have no idea. My guess is they probably thought the operational costs would have exceeded the profitability of the few aircraft.

I will say that I'm having a hard time believing that USairways would have been willing to sign us on with the intent of us only flying 50 seat, unprofitable aircraft for the entire duration of the contract. I also don't believe that AWAC's parent company would have been willing to invest 125 million into a bankrupt company and then only offer aircraft that will not net a profit for USairways. Especially since they are becoming a LCC.

But hey, that's the Cool-Aid talking.

 

[av8er23]

av8er23 your are a dumbass

:cartman: !

 

[FranktheTank]

Diggler, your basically a douche. Yes, your entitled to your opinion, its just to bad that it sucks. The only reason that you think this place is descent now is becuase people that were here long before your shinny jet lovin a$$ showed up worked hard to make it a great place to work. Only imagine if you were here then. Don't be a such a disrespectful hump be saying how great it is and no one should be complaining. Blah blah blah.

 

[DiverDriver]

HaHa,

I am really looking foward to commuting! Is there never a chance of finishing up on the last day at a reasonable time and catching a flight home?

No. And my January bid just went in. About 75% of the lines have back to back 3 day trips. The first day starts at 0700 (commute the night before) and the last day (2nd trip) ends a 2140. My last flight home is at 2000.

Have a nice day.

Why am I pissed about schedules? Because they don't have to be that way. They make us sit for 17-19 (sometimes 24) hours in a hotel and we end up on the top of day flying causing us to finish late on the last day. It doesn't have to be this way. The Union is grieving many aspects of our schedules. It didn't used to be like this.

And no, this place is not a Major but according to CJT when I hired on it was a "destination airline". Meaning, it was a place you could retire from. But not anymore.

Of course, there is that little thing about AWAC applying to become a "large carrier" (100 aircraft or more) in 2006. The CP has now gotten a new title that corresponds with one required in a "large carrier". Makes you wonder if things aren't in the offing. But until we can staff this airline right (we XC 17 flights on Saturday and I've heard 36 flights on Sunday due to crew availability) the abuse will continue.

 

[masedogg19]

not trying to kiss a$$ here (and honestly not trying to pi$$ others off) but a big thanks to logo for seemingly being the only one around here who can post a non-emotionally charged message anytime someone contradicts him

just because someone's info might not be correct (hell i'm guilty of that) doesn't mean that they are trying to pick a fight

 

[masedogg19]

i'll shut up now since i'm the new guy

 

[Beaver_Liquors]

AWAC never was and never will be a major. Get over it and get on with it. You are all morons.

Who ever said they were a major? And its people like you, with no backbone. that are killing this company. If you dont like us bitching, standing up for ourselves, and trying to make this company worth working for, then you leave. Go work for *************************s, they like that kind of attitude over there i am sure. I am tired of hearing people say they are tired of all the complaining. If you dont complain, and work with your union reps, nothing will ever change.

BL

 

[WhiteCloud]

AWAC has done a pretty good job of surviving these past couple years. The big staffing problem is that a huge number of the pilots are/were settled out west and are/were facing two leg commutes on what seem to be uncommutable lines. It's a bad position to be in when your job can't be readily replaced and moves clear across the country and is so unstable that relocating (selling/buying a house) for it would be foolish. You know it's bad when the base at company HQ closes. This deal with USAir is just getting started. Hope you get some better schedules and some bases out west as it progresses.

 

[SpatialD]

WhiteCloud has helped to clear something up for me a little, but not entirely. Throughout this thread I've been trying to reconcile the fact that flights are being canceled due to understaffing, and the reports that the company is now hiring 50 pilots per month.

First of all - Understaffing? WTF? The only way I can see that any airline could end up understaffed these days is very, very piss-poor management - I mean horrible, incompetent, drunk, blind morons. Sure it takes a little while to train new pilots, but there's no shortage of qualified candidates to work with if they had used a little common sense and anticipated the need with the new commuting issues and whatever else is going on. Why wait till you're canceling 17 and 36 flights a day to take action? Which brings me to the next point...

So clearly there's a need for new crews right away. But doesn't 50 per month seem a little kneejerkish? I don't claim to know the biz all that well, but I've seen this sort of thing many times in other industries. Understaffing fiascos get so out of control and expensive that when the suits finally realize what's happening they panic and hire every warm body in sight rather than carefully assessing and forecasting the actual need and planning a deliberate, conservative, and manageable growth strategy. Then it takes about a year for them to realize that now they're overstaffed and upside down in personnel because they've invested so much in training a new workforce that hasn't been around and producing long enough to recoup the costs of hiring them in the first place. But there isn't actually enough work to go around, so somebody decides to cut the company's losses and makes the call to let half of the new people go. More often than not it's too late at that point and things just spiral out of control from there. So I wouldn't be at all surprised if this time next year we're all back here talking about the latest rumors of furloughs at AWAC.

Understand that these are just my impressions based mostly on this single thread. I don't claim to actually know what I'm talking about, and I really hope I'm wrong and just missing some piece of the puzzle. But from this outsider's point of view it sure looks like you guys have some major leadership problems. Somebody please set me straight because I was thinking I might like to come fly with you until reading all this. I see a lot of red flags and it's making me a little less enthusiastic now. This industry is unstable enough without a bunch of clowns chasing their tails in the head office messing with our lives and wasting years of hard work and progress in our careers. I really hope things get better for you guys.

 

[spg2bmd]

Just had an interview with AWAC and wondering how long for a call if you get the job?

 

[rightrudder]

The pilots here that bitch, we're sick of being bent over time and time again without lube. We care about our company and are dismayed at what it has become. I am so sick and tired of the "if you don't like it, leave" comments. If everyone had that attitude, nothing would ever improve. Someone has to give a $hit.

The pilots and others at AWAC have busted their a$$es to try to make this a better company and trusted our owners when they came to us for help. Turns out the LIED to us. You can't blame us for being angry about that. I have been waiting for good news here since 9/11, and it hasn't come. Just one kick in the nads after another. I highly doubt things will get much better.

Having a fun night figuring out how to bid for Jan. The lines are so bad, I don't think it matters what I pick. I either pay for 11 hotels for the month or 8. I get to spend 4 days at home. WHoopee!

I will say to those who want to come here, if you are single and don't mind moving every year, live in base.

 

[Skyguy]

Having read all the scuttlebutt I have decided to insert my two cents. For all of you looking for employment consider the following about AWAC. The 6 owners (three unknown) have decided to take a stand against UAL and move to other waters for their benefit not for the airline’s or for its employees. They are owners and wish to make as much money as possible and you can’t fault them for that. But, they have misrepresented the facts for the TA which gained them enough cash in a short time to invest in a bankrupt airline ($125,000,000) and then double it. They are closing down DEN, ORD and ATW. Denver was once the largest base. The company requires moves clear across country with the least amount of notice and show little regard for your needs. But the owners didn’t move. They have refused to bid on F9 flying when it was available, or any other flying in the west and have displaced at least 1500 employees with out much of a believable apology or apparent fore thought to the years of service and loyalty given. Some of these employees were husband and wife couples and are now both are on the streets and some of them were 20+ years on the job.

The owners were given over $9 million for Sept. 11th and by all accounts, AWAC is still the most expensive regional airline by seat mile. The cost is not because of the employees wages.

If you question too much or make too much noise you will be harassed by a fleet manager or threatened by some management type (BF) with consequence resulting in a trip to ATW for the whipping. If you can nod your head yes, keep a low profile and make the occasional bleat, AWAC is for you. Moral is so low that it needs a step ladder to reach for the snake’s belly. The relationship between management and the union is almost militant.

Recent policies and decisions have chased away some of the greatest employees any airline would ever hope to have. The pilots that gave their sweat and hard work for all that followed are leaving in droves. Some being forced to retire early or just throw in the towel and change careers. As each senior pilot leaves, more of the heart and soul which separated this airline from all the rest is gone forever. AWAC is not a destination airline anymore.

The USAir thing looks to be a long-term deal and hopefully will be stable. But rest assured that if you become too expensive or make too much money the owners will back you into another TA with give back for promises that will go unfulfilled. It’s all about the money, their money. They expect your professional effort and you had best not expect a return on the favor in any manner. Good luck for any of you looking to get ahead, just don’t plan on staying long because AWAC is not anything near what it was yesterday, last year or even 5 years ago.

If you decide to stay, I wish you the best luck. If you are coming to AWAC, don’t base your decision on what once was. Clicking your heels will not return AWAC to what it one was and yes, commuting is a BI**H.

 

[BE99chick]

They have refused to bid on F9 flying when it was available, or any other flying in the west ...

Yes, what exactly is this fear of the west this company has? They blew off LAX, closed DEN, ignored Frontier, and systematically withdrew from every city west of the Mississippi (with the execption of a few).

I guess they wanted to lay out the red carpet for SkyWest to take all that west coast flying.

PHX or LAS base? It would be nice, but since SkyWest is now feeding 2 bankrupt carriers, they'll probably come sniffing around the Tempe offices for more business. They'll end up with those bases, and we'll open LGA for our next "incredible opportunity to work with our partner".

No, I don't hate the SkyWest pilots...I have many friends over there.

 

[WhiteCloud]

Good post Skyguy. The thing that's really sad is the corporate culture change. While not perfect it was a lot better than most places. I guess that's what happens when trust is lost. The owners make plenty of money. Given the past misrepresentations there is no reason to give up anything.

"I've always said that a man that doesn't tell it like it is, is a liar" James Coburn-Snow Dogs