Age 65 and the "F" word.

[Bluestreak]

I look forward to the mass retirements when the age 65 "get-out-of-my-seat" whiners selflessly retire at 60,to benefit those below them.After all,THEY wouldn't work until age 65,would they ? I'll bet $1,000 not one of them bolt at 60.You wouldn't do THAT,would you ? Just think of those below you,guys on the street,etc.,blah,blah,blah.....These whiners will lap it up post-60 with some lame "It is what it is,I didn't make the rules" rationalization,while failing to see the irony.

 

[Flopgut]

The Chairman, the Prussian, Undauntedflyer gets it (and others). This career will do nothing but through curveballs at you, some good and some not good. Some people deal with adversity better than others, but the people that whine and cry the most have the most problems.

What would be the difference between saying this now to junior guys after the rule change, or to not have changed the rule and used the same words for guys forced to retire with no pension? Seriously, we don't have to wonder about this, we read it right here on FI. Nobody bawled and whined like you guys pre rule change.

What get's lost in the argument is this: Why can't the mechanics of how the retirement age changed be discussed/compared to something like flight and duty time? Correct flight and duty time and everybody get's back to where they ought to be and hiring will start. Why can't we make that happen in the middle of the night?!

The problem is with guys like you.

An interesting thing to see is the surprising number of retirements at CAL. No pilot group had more career "curveballs" than CAL pilots. Yet, I would guess we've had the most retire close to normal age. The short story is this: They didn't make big, foolish financial mistakes. They kept a managable lifestyle and stuck to a plan. Conversely, the guys who are staying (or are most vocal about staying) will never be able to retire. You could pick almost any one of them [there's a few exceptions], give them an entire career's worth of earnings and in 12 months they'll be broke. You can't help but wonder why pause career progression (or furlough so many) to help these types out?

 

[Fubijaakr]

Considering the fluidity of the airline business and the variables involved, the only "career expectation" an airline pilot can have is to cash a paycheck every month he works.

 

[Mr.B]

This post by Mr. B is the perfect example as to the hypocrisy of this thread, what he didn't say is that a little over two years ago he was actively pursuing this contract, I personally gave him infomation about this job in the open forum and in PM's and now he is pointing fingers, the only reason that he is not here enjoying the job created to bypass the" Japanese pilots union" as he says is because ANA rejected his application.

By the way Mr. "B" I want to be the first to congratulate you on your command there at UAL, I know it is a little premature but hey, 12 years pass by very quickly when you are working in such a great working environment as UAL. Sorry ANA took a pass at you "B" we are having a great time, wish you could be here

Yes, I even interviewed too! They liked my application! And when I was briefed on the union issues in the hotel lobby, I turned down their offer.

I'm sure you got the same brief didn't you? You know, before the ride to the training center?

I have a couple buds there doing what they need to do but they don't get on these boards pontificating how wonderful they are. I'd really like to ask them about you.

 

[The Prussian]

No, you'd just be crying for age 70.....

Negative, Floppy.....

 

[Caveman]

You remember you wrote this when the economy improves, age 65 doesn't get changed to 70, and not one single pilot past age 65+1 day can get a job doing anything flying. What comes around goes around. It'll happen, then you'll get to show us all how to act.

Psst: Betcha cry like a wus...

I won't have to remember I wrote this because this has been my position since day one. I didn't like it when I began in this business and I still don't.

Psst: Betcha didn't answer the questions because you can't answer them consistently and still support mandatory retirement ages.

Does seniority matter or not? Yes or no? You can't have it both ways.

 

[waveflyer]

Retirements are a huge driving force to hiring.
I don't begrudge age 65 at all- I begrudge an implementation that occurred so fast that it guaranteed furloughs at most career airlines. Just as the majors were beginning to hire after a 7 year lull since 9/11, bankrupty abuse, and outsourcing.
Do not underestimate the impact of retirements on hiring and movement. Your HR will agree- an airline on average must hire 1.2-1.5 pilots per retirement. Add in training costs and contractual bumping rights and the increased furloughs since 2007 would not have happened at most airlines if it were not for the cold turkey age 65 implementation.
As for older pilots losing pensions- I feel for you - but do not on the whole feel sorry for you bc you vote republican.
Just what did you think would happen when you vote for people who do not believe in unions?
If we're all going to get along, unify, and accomplish anything again as pilot unions- it would go a long way for both sides to live in the other men's shoes for a while. Noone was trying to screw anyone. The older got screwed when pensions were stolen- the younger got screwed by age 65.
The point my generation makes is that noone argues that older pilots got screwed by pension and bankruptcy abuse - it's the denial that age 65 has affected us negatively - and for some, catastrophically, that pisses us off. A little reality check and empathy would go a long way.

 

[jenks]

I would love to see how many of the gummers would be whinning if they reversed the age 65 rule tomorrow and they were forced to retire immediately. Ok, this isn't going to happen, but I don't see much difference in this senerio and the age 65 change and how it was implemented. I understand that age 65 is here to stay and I should shut up and live with it, but don't blame those of us that had our career and lives destroyed because of age 65 if we are a little pissed off about it!

 

[The Prussian]

I look forward to the mass retirements when the age 65 "get-out-of-my-seat" whiners selflessly retire at 60,to benefit those below them.After all,THEY wouldn't work until age 65,would they ? I'll bet $1,000 not one of them bolt at 60.You wouldn't do THAT,would you ? Just think of those below you,guys on the street,etc.,blah,blah,blah.....These whiners will lap it up post-60 with some lame "It is what it is,I didn't make the rules" rationalization,while failing to see the irony.

A rare sense of clarity on flight info...thank-you!

 

[BoilerUP]

A rare sense of clarity on flight info...thank-you!

Amazing how something or someone's "clarity" depends on their perspective...